Coronavirus: General discussion (see opening post for rules)

[Andrew_C]

Trust me - LFT are barely worth the plastics they are made from. Two, within a half hour.

 

One positive, one negative.

 

Done the other way around (I doubt I'd have done a second) I'd have trotted off to work, merrily spreading it around.

[jthompson]

Trust me - LFT are barely worth the plastics they are made from. Two, within a half hour.

 

One positive, one negative.

 

Done the other way around (I doubt I'd have done a second) I'd have trotted off to work, merrily spreading it around.

 

I think their value increases when used at a population level. Like a lot of these interventions, they're easier to poke holes in when viewed at the level of the individual.

[E_G_R2]

@mikeprice and I are currently outside of school employment. You're right about the new LFD kits - I think I participated in a pre-launch trial. It's certainly nice to avoid putting the swab to the back of your throat! One of my kids came home with a pack from school recently, but not the other - no idea why. I haven't read the paperwork, but do they give a result in less than 30 minutes? The old ones always showed a successful test within a few minutes, but I always understood you need to wait 30 minutes. Fortunately I haven't seen a positive test yet, but wondered if the 'C' shows before the 'T'.

@Ditto read the paper work as the way you deal with the sample is different (longer)

[jmak]

@Ditto read the paper work as the way you deal with the sample is different (longer)

I'd always assumed that the C shows up as soon as it gets wet, whereas the T only shows up in response to a particular chemical released if Covid is detected. I did have one which was broken - the fluid never made it through to the detection paper.

[paulkerton]

I'd always assumed that the C shows up as soon as it gets wet, whereas the T only shows up in response to a particular chemical released if Covid is detected. I did have one which was broken - the fluid never made it through to the detection paper.

The control is a ligand of some sort. I assume it's picking up a protein that is present on the tonsils and/or back of the nostril.

[enbiggen]

The control is a ligand of some sort. I assume it's picking up a protein that is present on the tonsils and/or back of the nostril.

 

I don't think so, I think it just detects the reagent - we've done tests with an unused swab and the control line shows up.

[Rob_D]

As it was explained to me, the covid (or whatever marker they're testing for) is bound to pigment in the transport medium or buffer solution, which then defuses down the test paper. The T line is a line of structures designed to bond to the covid/protean marker thus holding the both the protean and it's bonded pigment in place and creating the line. The C line just bonds to the pigment as a control line. So you shouldn't get the C line if you use tap water rather than the buffer solution (I think).

[Ditto]

@Ditto read the paper work as the way you deal with the sample is different (longer)

Ahh, the old RTFM!!! Fair comment though, although when I was helping with the trial, that wasn't an option.

I've done my homework and here are the results.

So, firstly the packaging. Both have that strong clear plastic sticky disc sealing the end. On the older pack (throat and nasal), one is labelled 'Open' (on the box edge) the other end is clear with no markings. I discovered this after cutting through the clear tape only to find the tab to pull the contents out wasn't present - oh well, that's a 50/50 chance of success on first attempt! On the newer pack(nasal only and marked ACON Flowflex), it also says 'Open' on one end, but it also has a clear white pointer and it's visible on the top of the box. This resulted in a successful opening and access to the pull out tab first attempt. From a design perspective, text to the effect 'Open other end' on the non-opening end to say would be even better, but if the manufacturers would like an optimal design solution, I would recommend @mikeprice whom I believe is available for consultancy on design matters.

Now to the meat of the topic.

Both sets of instructions say that once the test cassette is removed from the sealed bag, you must start the test within 30 minutes. On to the part where the swab is swirled around in the buffer solution - this is where things get really interesting.

Old swab, you do this for 30 seconds. New swab it is 15 seconds. Both instruction in terms of technique are identical and require force.

After dropping the fluid on to the cassette, again some differences.

Old test, 2 drops, new test, 4 drops - hands up who didn't spot this!

Finally, test results, which is where I started.

Old test - wait 30 minutes before reading the result. It notes a positive test can appear anytime after 20 minutes, but you must wait 30. You are asked not to wait longer than 30 minutes, after which the test is void. I'll avoid the pedantic observation here!

New test - wait 15 minutes before reading. You can read the result anytime between minute 15 and minute 30 and as before, after this the test is void.

I conclude the new test can in fact be quick by between 15 seconds and 15 minutes 15 seconds. Yet, it doesn't really tell me the answer to question I posed, but the subsequent posts have made it clear the C will come first and the T later.

[JordanT91]

Word on the grapevine is that control measures will be re-introduced after half-term. Our LA issued guidance yesterday basically saying we need to go back to having bubbles, no staff mixing, no trips out, no parent visits, face coverings in communal areas etc. This was almost immediately withdrawn apaprently because UKHSA (formerly PHE) and the DfE are issuing their own guidance to schools very soon.

[Garacesh]

Word on the grapevine is that control measures will be re-introduced after half-term. Our LA issued guidance yesterday basically saying we need to go back to having bubbles, no staff mixing, no trips out, no parent visits, face coverings in communal areas etc. This was almost immediately withdrawn apaprently because UKHSA (formerly PHE) and the DfE are issuing their own guidance to schools very soon.

 

Our LA has recommended (and the school is abiding by) wearing facemasks again whilst moving around the building.

I suspect this is only the beginning of a significant regression.

[kennysarmy]

Mrs KA LFT +ve last night

She was awaiting PCR test having spent most of Saturday with someone who subsequently tested +ve on Sunday.

PCR came back this morning "inconclusive" so another one booked for this morning.

 

My LFT last night was -ve.

 

Meant to both be taking daughter to start "basic training" on Sunday - that's now in jeopardy

 

Bit of a nightmare.

[mavhc]

https://committees.parliament.uk/committee/81/health-and-social-care-committee/news/157991/coronavirus-lessons-learned-to-date-report-published/

[StevieM]

Ahh, the old RTFM!!!

 

I don't think @E_G_R2's comment was meant as RTFM. If you look at the posts in context:

 

I haven't read the paperwork...

@Ditto read the paper work as the way you deal with the sample is different (longer)

 

it's more like advice to read the paperwork as the method is different, as you have since discovered.

 

...it doesn't really tell me the answer to question I posed...

 

 

<start pedantMode>

The paperwork did tell you the answer to the question you posed.

...do they give a result in less than 30 minutes?

 

Your other comment:

Fortunately I haven't seen a positive test yet, but wondered if the 'C' shows before the 'T'.

is a statement, not a question.

(I'm not having a go, just pulling your leg.)

[Ditto]

I don't think @E_G_R2's comment was meant as RTFM. If you look at the posts in context:

 

 

 

 

it's more like advice to read the paperwork as the method is different, as you have since discovered.

 

 

 

 

<start pedantMode>

The paperwork did tell you the answer to the question you posed.

 

 

Your other comment:

 

is a statement, not a question.

(I'm not having a go, just pulling your leg.)

Fair enough, but I stated I would avoid pedantry, but in doing so was pedantic . What I was really after was real world examples, but in passing it did make me smile that the old test gave you an infinitesimal small time point to read the test. As an aside, I'm wondering if there is a third variant of the test that does take longer. In the RTFM, maybe your are right, but I think it is something we could all do more. Google is great, but often clouds the world with opinion, rather than fact. No worries on the leg pull, I'm thick skinned and my post knowingly invited it. I guess we should move on for risk of drifting off topic.

 

To that end, local cases of people I know or are two degrees of separation away are through the roof. Post half term changes really wouldn't surprise me.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Ditto

[JordanT91]

Fair enough, but I stated I would avoid pedantry, but in doing so was pedantic . What I was really after was real world examples, but in passing it did make me smile that the old test gave you an infinitesimal small time point to read the test. As an aside, I'm wondering if there is a third variant of the test that does take longer. In the RTFM, maybe your are right, but I think it is something we could all do more. Google is great, but often clouds the world with opinion, rather than fact. No worries on the leg pull, I'm thick skinned and my post knowingly invited it. I guess we should move on for risk of drifting off topic.

 

To that end, local cases of people I know or are two degrees of separation away are through the roof. Post half term changes really wouldn't surprise me.

A few times over the last few weeks my wife has been getting a faint T line on the 'old' stlye lateral flows. It appears anywhere from 35 minutes to 8 hours after testing. You're not supposed to take a result after 30 minutes but she's been for a couple of PCRs and they have been negative every time. No idea what's going on there!

[Andrew_C]

Wow 'Test & Trace" app, thanks for that. THIS MORNING!!

On the 15th, I might have been in close contact with an infected person.

 

No sh!t Sherlock. Me*. I've been isolated for 10 days...

 

 

* and MrsC. Who told you she was + over a week ago.

 

ETA Phone test&trace have just told me that 10 days isolation from Tues morning is "allowed out" tomorrow. Bit of a bggr 'cos I'm at work now. Like my phone said I could.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Andrew_C

[kennysarmy]

Mrs KA LFT +ve last night

She was awaiting PCR test having spent most of Saturday with someone who subsequently tested +ve on Sunday.

PCR came back this morning "inconclusive" so another one booked for this morning.

 

My LFT last night was -ve.

 

Meant to both be taking daughter to start "basic training" on Sunday - that's now in jeopardy

 

Bit of a nightmare.

 

Well thankfully both daughter and I continued to test neg. over weekend so she's now started her army career at Pirbright - they also did another LFT when we dropped off.

 

Track and trace contacted me so as a precaution also went for PCR last night, but LFT this morning again neg.

 

Mrs KA very upset not able to hug daughter before she left home - and has now lost sense of smell

 

All in all an emotional last 5 days.

[Ditto]

After 18 consecutive days of unsettlingly high increases in cases by date reported, week on week, we've now had 2 days of reducing cases. I couldn't possibly guess (or scientifically predict!) which way things will move over the next few weeks. I would be delighted if the theory of a sort of herd immunity kicking in due to high vaccination levels, increasing numbers of booster shots being given, younger age ranges having the jab and protection due to infection, but I'm sure there is a lot more to the variations than that.

 

*** I should add if you are looking at UK case numbers for today, Wales data is missing but it's still going to be a drop. What's going on with dataflows? Problems from various nations are quite a regular occurrence recently. ***

Edited October 25, 2021 by Ditto

[LeMarchand]

School quieter today as the residential trip has gone ahead. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me...

[mavhc]

It'll be even quieter when they come back and then everyone is off.

 

Currently averaging 47000 covid deaths per year, total deaths 140k

 

Total cases: 9 million.

 

Latest R range for England

1.1 to 1.3

 

Latest growth rate range for England

+1% to +3%

per day

[6Foot2]

Link 1: Book or manage a booster dose of the coronavirus (COVID-19) vaccine - NHS

 

 

Link 2: Do you know your NHS number? - Book a coronavirus vaccination - NHS

[elsiegee40]

Mask wearing irritation. We are getting people round to quote for sorting out our aged bathroom.

 

Two so far and neither wearing a mask. I was wearing one when I answered the door. The first scurried back to his car and got one. The second admitted he didn’t have one and I supplied one from the pack of disposables we bought ages ago for emergencies.

 

I accept that when they’re actually doing the build then they won’t be wearing masks, but I will stay out of the way. I just think it’s impolite to turn up at a prospective customer and not be prepared to wear a mask.

[Andrew_C]

I just think it’s impolite to turn up at a prospective customer and not be prepared to wear a mask.

I wonder why people behave like that?

 

[Roberto]

Mask wearing irritation. We are getting people round to quote for sorting out our aged bathroom.

 

Two so far and neither wearing a mask. I was wearing one when I answered the door. The first scurried back to his car and got one. The second admitted he didn’t have one and I supplied one from the pack of disposables we bought ages ago for emergencies.

 

I accept that when they’re actually doing the build then they won’t be wearing masks, but I will stay out of the way. I just think it’s impolite to turn up at a prospective customer and not be prepared to wear a mask.

 

All I know is that I've had mild symptoms last week and my partner's got a proper covid case. This despite both of us being double jabbed and at least fairly careful with masking. Given how much I didn't enjoy the mild symptoms and how much I can see my partner's feeling about 1000% worse than that, it boggles my mind that people don't appear to care anymore.

[JSpaced]

All I know is that I've had mild symptoms last week and my partner's got a proper covid case. This despite both of us being double jabbed and at least fairly careful with masking. Given how much I didn't enjoy the mild symptoms and how much I can see my partner's feeling about 1000% worse than that, it boggles my mind that people don't appear to care anymore.

 

I'm a big fan of the epic, questing, fantasy/sci-fi trope in books, movies and other media. (Love me some Dungeons and Dragons)

 

The one thing the last 24 months has confirmed for me is that if Lord of the Rings was set in the real world, Frodo would have got to the end of his road then gone: "Ah, it's a really long way. I'll just put the ring in a safe. The one with the combination on a post-it on it. Gandalf can sort out the other stuff? I'll let him know the next time I see him. If I see him."

 

The biggest first-world problem is our comfort and convenience massively prioritises over virtually anything else (I'm generalising here, but our nation bought toilet roll by the truckload in case it became hard to buy toilet roll, then in the sequel bought petrol in case it became a bit hard to buy petrol.) I used to be boggled by the easy callousness of people towards their literal and metaphorical neighbours, now it just makes me sad and angry.