Coronavirus: General discussion (see opening post for rules)

[Primus]

Risk assessments are not the be all and end all though, and if the risk assessment is poor simply having one will not stop an organisation ending up in court for negligence.

Especially if you aren't even considered on said risk assessment.

 

Perhaps your school is different but my school and everyone in the area I live in is isolating the teachers who've been in an infected bubble, alongside any pupil.

 

The national guidance and legislation requires each school to conduct a risk assessment and it also encourages not isolating teachers because they are meant to stay 2m+ away from students. If you want to be cynical it's because in a secondary school a handful of cases would see the whole school close due to teachers seeing so many different groups.

 

As an employee you have to follow the school's risk assessment - if you're not happy you challenge through your union but there is no legal requirement that teachers self isolate if a class they taught has a positive case and the same goes for support staff.

 

You cannot tell people what they can and can't definitely do unless you're referring to their legal entitlement, every school and scenario are different so you need to be careful telling people they definitely shouldn't do something as if they simply refuse without going through the proper process it's going to cause them issues.

 

Perhaps a better way of wording it would be "in my opinion we shouldn't be going into classrooms while they have classes in them to provide technical support" since it is just an opinion.

[Andrew_C]

Bubbles in a school is so much bovine excrement.

 

The kids get on the bus - no masks, the bubbles are broken. The kids go home, and lick their siblings, the bubbles are broken. They come back to school, and infect the rest of the 'bubble'.

[paulkerton]

Perhaps a better way of wording it would be "in my opinion we shouldn't be going into classrooms while they have classes in them to provide technical support" since it is just an opinion.

Fair enough.

In my opinion, if a school is unwilling to protect their staff and can't provide covid protection and don't consider you in a risk assessment, then in my opinion it's a matter for your union.

In my opinion.

 

[Rob_D]

Bubbles in a school is so much bovine excrement.

The kids get on the bus - no masks, the bubbles are broken. The kids go home, and lick their siblings, the bubbles are broken. They come back to school, and infect the rest of the 'bubble'.

 

And (for us at least) lesson changeover. There's so many kids it's impossible to tell if the bubbles are merging or not.

[caffrey]

It's a funny one, we're here to provide IT support and the majority of the time it is hands on and we cannot escape that

 

End of day if we aren't looked after, and one of the team get it then it'll be 2 weeks without IT support

[Andrew_C]

Fair enough.

In my opinion, if a school is unwilling to protect their staff and can't provide covid protection and don't consider you in a risk assessment, then in my opinion it's a matter for your union.

Those damned Europeans offering us protection:-

https://www.pcs.org.uk/coronavirus-can-employees-refuse-to-attend-the-workplace

 

 

Legislative protection

EU legislation provides health and safety protection to workers. Specifically, Article 8(4) of the Framework Directive 89/391/EEC provides:

“Workers who, in the event of serious, imminent and unavoidable danger, leave their workstation and/or a dangerous area may not be placed at any disadvantage because of their action and must be protected against any harmful and unjustified consequences, in accordance with national laws and/or practices.”

This protection has been enacted into UK law by Sections 44 and 100 of the Employment Rights Act 1996 (ERA) which make it unlawful for an employer to dismiss someone, select them for redundancy or subject them to any other detriment in certain circumstances. There is no qualifying period of employment for these protections, but they are restricted to employees, not workers. Consequently, these protections may not apply to contract workers, although the law on agency worker rights is complicated.

 

[rickjames]

We've been told today that we as a department shouldn't anticipate being back at our main office until October 2021, and there'll be temporary hot desks/space at a few of our sites.

 

Time to enjoy the wonderful world of WFH some more. I mean, I'm fine with it.

[the_quick]

We've been told today that we as a department shouldn't anticipate being back at our main office until October 2021, and there'll be temporary hot desks/space at a few of our sites.

 

Time to enjoy the wonderful world of WFH some more. I mean, I'm fine with it.

Lucky !

 

3 of us in ICT Support office, offered HT solution - always 1 member works from home, on rotation - so if one of us catch covid, not the whole office has to close. It was turned down and still all 3 of us are always on site, wo go to classrooms when needed.

Same with finance, 4 ladies, all share same office - not allowed working from home - why? Know one seem to know.

[mikeprice]

If you are being told that all x of you work from the same office then whoever is in charge (Network Manager) needs to make sure there is a recorded communication (email probably) sent to the HT warning that this means that if ONE of you gets Covid then all of you will have to isolate - even if it is just a couple of symptoms

and remember that flu/cold season is coming - so one cough and IT support ceases until the cougher can get the test results

 

As far as I can see that is not you being awkward - it is a legal requirement on all of you as individuals - and a legal requirement on the school to enforce it

[Primus]

If you are being told that all x of you work from the same office then whoever is in charge (Network Manager) needs to make sure there is a recorded communication (email probably) sent to the HT warning that this means that if ONE of you gets Covid then all of you will have to isolate - even if it is just a couple of symptoms

and remember that flu/cold season is coming - so one cough and IT support ceases until the cougher can get the test results

 

As far as I can see that is not you being awkward - it is a legal requirement on all of you as individuals - and a legal requirement on the school to enforce it

 

Just to be clear - onsite support might cease, there's no reason remote support couldn't continue.

 

Once again it's hard being black and white when you don't know the exact circumstances, if the office is tiny then yes if one is off with suspected symptoms you're probably going to have to send everyone home and get them tested. However if the office is huge and has good ventilation then this isn't necessarily the case.

 

It's really hard being categorical when every circumstance is different and this is why a risk assessment has to be done by each school or MAT. If you feel the risk assessment hasn't covered certain areas then flag it (ideally through your union).

[Davit2005]

We've been told today that we as a department shouldn't anticipate being back at our main office until October 2021, and there'll be temporary hot desks/space at a few of our sites.

 

Time to enjoy the wonderful world of WFH some more. I mean, I'm fine with it.

 

Same boat, we go in only if we are needed to do a specific task that needs physical intervention but otherwise it is preference by org to WFH. To be honest I am working on Projects most of the time so WFH is no issue.

[StevieM]

Just to be clear - onsite support might cease, there's no reason remote support couldn't continue.

Unless they all do actually catch COVID-19 and are signed off sick.

[jmak]

Business continuity requirements would suggest that you only have one person on site from each time at a time and then only where essential.

 

If you have the option to keep teams isolated from each other, it seems like bad management not to.

 

Have you asked how they are responding to the updated government guidance that everyone who can work from home should work from home?

 

I can see that having someone on site is potentially useful, but it seems unnecessarily risky to have the whole team in a room together.

[kennysarmy]

Child tested positive in my other half's class in primary school!

Waiting to hear what PHE are going to advise!

[Primus]

Unless they all do actually catch COVID-19 and are signed off sick.

 

Yes obviously if they have COVID-19 with symptoms then you're in a pickle!

[elsiegee40]

Yes obviously if they have COVID-19 with symptoms then you're in a pickle!

 

If they all have to self isolate they’re in a pickle. Nobody can go onsite to fix anything.

[the_quick]

If they all have to self isolate they’re in a pickle. Nobody can go onsite to fix anything.

I have laid down that scenario, not in email but in person. Answer was : we will deal with that when we get there.

 

For some reason on last few emails I do not get any response from HT to my my emails, but he talks to me if I catch him on a break duty. Apparently even business manager mention it to HT and she works with 3 other ladies in finance - not well ventilated office.

 

My office has only skylight, almost no air movement unless strong winds, if it rains our desks would be soaked - no other windows. Office is big enough just to fit in 3 desks and space to get to them - we have a small attached office where keep spare computer parts, to narrow to fit in a desk - not ventilation either.

 

I think I will email suggestions again, especially where cases are raising

[Primus]

If they all have to self isolate they’re in a pickle. Nobody can go onsite to fix anything.

 

Obviously. However the original point was no support. I was pointing out a lot of stuff can be done remotely.

[jmak]

I'd want the bursar and finance team working away from each too. If they all go off sick, no one will get paid!

[StevieM]

For some reason on last few emails I do not get any response from HT to my my emails

Do you think they may be more likely to respond if you CCd someone else into the email, e.g. deputy head, H&S lead, chair of governors?

[MrFlibble]

Unless they all do actually catch COVID-19 and are signed off sick.

You make a valid point but, given there are 3 people in their team, that is unlikely.

 

Most people who are infected with Sars-Cov-2 are asymptomatic; only a relatively small proportion of infections result in severe Covid19 symptoms.

[paulkerton]

You make a valid point but, given there are 3 people in their team, that is unlikely.

 

Most people who are infected with Sars-Cov-2 are asymptomatic; only a relatively small proportion of infections result in severe Covid19 symptoms.

 

Yeah, but that is quite frankly worse. I'd definitely be rotating HR and finance teams so there are some working off-site for a period at least.

[6Foot2]

Link:

[Picture Tweet]

 

 

Nothing to add.

[StevieM]

Two more classes sent home due to positive tests. That's 1/4 of the school closed, now.

 

I'm so pleased that I'm working in a room on my own (most of the time) but, as an asthmatic who worked from home for the whole of the summer term, I'm beginning to wonder whether I should be here at all.

[mikes]

I'm being forced to come on site, because I might be needed to plug a projector's VGA cable in, or swap out a mouse. Our school is basically continuing as if nothing has happened, minus face masks, a one way system and hand sanitizer. I thought there were year group "bubbles" but I'm expected to breach that if there's a problem in a classroom.

Our BM hates the lockdown, she basically came in every day during lockdown and resented other people being off.