Long range Wi-Fi solution

[TheHyperTechie]

Hi Everyone,

 

I am hoping someone can offer their opinion/experience on long range Wi-Fi solutions. We have a cabin about 150m away from our main school building (with a clear line of site) which is used within outdoor learning sessions. The cabin has NO power, or internet connectivity (cabling) in proximity.

 

We use UniFi throughout, and would be wanting to look for a solution from them. My first thought was a U6-LR access point, but I'm not sure if this would be sufficient enough distance wise - we need something reliable. There was initial discussions about a mobile phone with an unlimited data plan, but this means the phone would need to be shared, and there's the looming cost of an expensive data plan to pay every month for the foreseeable.

 

This thought led me to possibly integrating a Basestation XG. Does anyone currently use one of these? It's a lot of money to spend on something which might be completely overkill.

 

Thanks!

Edited November 8, 2023 by HyperTech

[FragglePete]

Thing to remember, that your AP on the main building maybe long range, but the devices connecting in the cabin may not have the same range back.

 

This was bought to my attention when planning our install over last Summer - we wanted to get WiFi onto the field, but the device in the teachers hand is only going to be able to go so far itself.

 

Pete

[Sibrows]

I installed a XG point to point wireless link to connect 4 classrooms that had been moved to portacabins over the summer it has been flawless. I’m a firm believer in you get what you pay for and to compare it to two access points isn’t fair compare it to digging a trench to get fibre out there and you’ve got a very cost effective and reliable solution.

[synaesthesia]

A couple of unifi Nanobeams will do the job perfectly for around £150 a pair, or if you prefer a full gig then the airmax Gigabeams for around £300 the pair are a well tried and tested solution.

[3s-gtech]

I like the look of those. I need occasional network to a sports field 150-200m away from the school, and a pair of those wouldn’t break the bank.

[FN-GM]

A couple of unifi Nanobeams will do the job perfectly for around £150 a pair, or if you prefer a full gig then the airmax Gigabeams for around £300 the pair are a well tried and tested solution.

 

How would you power them with no power in the cabin? Solar or something?

[msi_school]

As @syneasthesia says a wireless bridge is the solution you are looking for, this is a pair of dedicated devices replace a fiber run to connect the cabin. Unif do these if you want to keep to one supplier. https://uk.store.ui.com/uk/en?category=wifi-building-bridge

 

However all this does is replace the fiber connection the cabin will still require power to run the device on its end and it will require some sort of network kit (switch AP etc) in the cabin.

 

If there is no power in the cabin which is as I understand you original question this will not work. A long range AP such as the U6-LR might work but as @FragglePete said the issue is that the normal limit on Wireless range is not the AP but the user device which can "hear" the network but it cant "shout" loud enough to reply.

 

Other options include dedicated mobile dongles which you will need to speak to a specialist supplier for I have used Simpliwifi before and they are very helpful or starlink if you have a clear view of the sky but electricity will be your issue. Alternatively you could look at device with built in mobile capability such as iPads or laptops with mobile modems, if you speak to a phone company they can do deals for data packages and data only SIMS which can be pooled by your devices.

 

After a couple of years the costs for these mobile internet connections might be more than getting a electrical cable and fiber installed.

Edited November 9, 2023 by msi_school
fixed mention tags

[DalekSec]

No Wi-Fi is going to handle 150m outside and still have a workable connection, you will need some sort of power in the cabin to power an AP and either a PTP link or fibre connection.

[synaesthesia]

Ah, I misread/missed about the power, my apologies. FN-GM's idea might not actually be unfeasible, they only use a couple of watts so a very small solar & battery solution would be more than sufficient even in the winter months. But of course you'd also need another AP in the cabin to relay that wifi to clients. 20 watts would be more than enough and should be achievable, if not a small technical project for you

[dmj]

4/5G dongles and VPN, or dig a trench.

[speakercon]

Solar panel and a couple of car batteries!?

[TheHyperTechie]

How would you power them with no power in the cabin? Solar or something?

 

This is the main issue it seems... I could look into solar panels however the nanobeam located at the cabin would need internet connectivity too which isn't really an option for us currently.

[synaesthesia]

This is the main issue it seems... I could look into solar panels however the nanobeam located at the cabin would need internet connectivity too which isn't really an option for us currently.

 

Would it not be getting that from the other end?

[TheHyperTechie]

Would it not be getting that from the other end?

 

I could be wrong, but from my understanding a connection is needed at both ends to create the wireless link?

[Aprice]

Nope it's just a glorified wireless ethernet cable. One end on a building with connectivity plugged into one nano beam, the other end ethernet out into whatever, or a unifi WiFi Point. Just needs a POE source at either end, which is where you might need to engineer something with solar.

[Oaktech]

We've got some cameras that are remote from the building on poles and they run a camera, sometimes up to 4, a Ubiquiti nanostation and sometimes a POE switch.

 

They've got a couple of big 12v batteries some power supply stuff and a fairly sizeable solar panel in a plastic box. The site staff just clean the leaves off with a brush every day.

 

We have discovered that they will run for 4 days with the the solar panel disconnected after the site assistant pulled the wires out while cleaning it!

[TheHyperTechie]

Nope it's just a glorified wireless ethernet cable. One end on a building with connectivity plugged into one nano beam, the other end ethernet out into whatever, or a unifi WiFi Point. Just needs a POE source at either end, which is where you might need to engineer something with solar.

 

Thanks for explaining. So in theory, if I managed to get power to the cabin I could have a building to building bridge and plug the cabin nanobeam into something like a U6-LR? seems to easy haha!

[FN-GM]

This is the main issue it seems... I could look into solar panels however the nanobeam located at the cabin would need internet connectivity too which isn't really an option for us currently.

 

You should only need the internet at the main site. The wireless link is essentially a long Ethernet cable.

[TheHyperTechie]

You should only need the internet at the main site. The wireless link is essentially a long Ethernet cable.

 

I guess I was reading into it a bit much! so in a sense it's just a wireless uplink to the other building? I guess I could just plug the main site one into our POE switch rather than the injector. I think this is the way... just got to find a way to provide power. Thanks for your help

[aydee]

If / When you get this working please can you let me know what the final setup is? I am curious to see if it would work for a personal project!

[TheHyperTechie]

Just a quick update

 

After looking around online, I have decided that this might be the best solution for permanent Wi-Fi/Power to our cabin.

 

The Anker 535 power station 512wh (max 500w output). This will power a nano-beam at the cabin.

 

I will pair the power station with a 100w solar panel which should be enough to keep the power station topped up. I will use the second PoE port on the nanobeam to power an AC-PRO I have lying around. The maximum power draw for these two items is about 20 watts, so the power station should suffice. Can anyone see any issues I may face with this setup?

 

The only issue I can think of.... being in Cornwall, well... we don't get much sun!

 

Thanks!

[DalekSec]

Think you can get a Anker 535 set with Solarpanels,

 

I mean the setup isn't ideal but if you have 0 way of getting power there then its the best that will do! If it doesn't work well then hopefully someone will pull their finger out and run a cable

 

Edit: If they don't mind noise you could get a petrol generator which will last aslong as your fuel reserves! Just turn on when needed*

 

*Dont do this

Edited November 10, 2023 by DalekSec

[TheHyperTechie]

Think you can get a Anker 535 set with Solarpanels,

 

I mean the setup isn't ideal but if you have 0 way of getting power there then its the best that will do! If it doesn't work well then hopefully someone will pull their finger out and run a cable

 

Yeah I agree, it isn't ideal but I suppose it will do. I spoke to the site manager today, and they had a quote to run electric to the cabin in 2016 which came to £2600. It would probably be even more now. So although it isn't the best option it's still much cheaper @ £1200. Although the phrase 'Buy cheap, buy twice' comes to mind

 

Thanks!

[dmj]

Yeah I agree, it isn't ideal but I suppose it will do. I spoke to the site manager today, and they had a quote to run electric to the cabin in 2016 which came to £2600. It would probably be even more now. So although it isn't the best option it's still much cheaper @ £1200. Although the phrase 'Buy cheap, buy twice' comes to mind

 

Thanks!

 

If you can run electric, you can add the fibre at the same time so you don't need to add the cost of the wireless link.

 

edit - also cost it over the lifetime of the hut - not the initial price you are paying.

Edited November 10, 2023 by dmj

[andy_b]

If we did that here I could guarantee that the power station would go walkies within a week.