1066girl Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Hi everyone, I have been trying to work out the best licensing approach for our school. I arrived at my current school to discover all the licensing in complete disarray (they expired last August) and the RM CC4 environment on its knees, accompanied by an RM abandoned Office 365 project. As a result, I have had no choice than to sever ties with RM as the account management has been pretty poor and they seemed fairly disinterested in doing much to save the relationship. So, I am currently on the market for a new licensing partner, but need to pull together costs for server and cal licensing for the school asap as we need to implement a new server environment to replace the Server 2003 CC4 environment. We have 600 fte's and 700 PCs. I need to license the following, but am confused about CALs and whether EES represents value for money for us based on our ftes v device count: 4 x Windows Server 2012 R2 DataCenter Licenses 1 Yr 5 x SQL Server Enterprise 1Yr 4 x Windows System Center 2012 Datacenter We have managed to implement office 365, so have got E1 Faculty/Student licensing. We would also like to implement MDOP at the same time as SCCM to help us deliver UE-V and App-V but again, I have no idea how this is licensed and am struggling under the barrage of url links in the microsoft pages to make sense of it all! Anyone here know anything about licensing these environments that can point me in the right direction?!? Thanks
mjk Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 We have 600 fte's and 700 PCs. Special school ? I don't think you want an EES subscription, you would be better off with a volume license and buy perpetual licenses. 1
Sagima Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Special school ? I don't think you want an EES subscription, you would be better off with a volume license and buy perpetual licenses. I think I would agree 1
Oaktech Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 You need to call Millgate on 0114 242 9805 and talk to Kate. Explain your situation and let her talk you down! 1
mjk Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Is O365 still dependant upon an EES subscription ? This might be a problem if it is.
1066girl Posted May 21, 2015 Author Posted May 21, 2015 Thanks guys for coming back so super speedily. We are not a special school, we are an independent with a high BYOD rate. This is really useful. Thanks again.
kennysarmy Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Thanks guys for coming back so super speedily. We are not a special school, we are an independent with a high BYOD rate. This is really useful. Thanks again. Got to be one of the most amazing FTE to PC ratios I've ever seen.....
sted Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Is O365 still dependant upon an EES subscription ? This might be a problem if it is. no i dont believe it ever was student/staff advantage as part of office 365 but the e1 part is free and separate as long as you can prove to ms you are a school 1
localzuk Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Thanks guys for coming back so super speedily. We are not a special school, we are an independent with a high BYOD rate. This is really useful. Thanks again. You have 600 FTE staff!? I think you may be counting the wrong thing with an FTE level that high. 1
speckytecky Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Paul Scaling or Sammy Dunn at Phoneixs is a useful chap to have a conversation with as well. Tel:01904 562200. Their specialism is in Software - particularly for education. Edited May 21, 2015 by speckytecky 1
fiza Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 600 FTE!!! I hope that's a typo otherwise how many students do you have to require that many staff? 1
tmcd35 Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 I'm going to hope/assume your FTE count is wrong and pick up some of the other bits around EES: Hi everyone, 4 x Windows Server 2012 R2 DataCenter Licenses 1 Yr 5 x SQL Server Enterprise 1Yr You need to decide how often you want to upgrade these. When/if you move to Server 2016, or wait for the next major update. If you think you'll be refreshing you Server OS or SQL licences within 5 years then EES would normally be cheaper. Any longer and Perpetual licences are almost always better - which is why I never buy server licences on EES. Dows that SQL count include licences for SCCM? if so deduct them, SCCM comes with the SQL licence it needs. 4 x Windows System Center 2012 Datacenter What features do you want our of SCCM? Are you looking to use it to manage the servers? If not then all the licencing you need to run SCCM are included in the CoreCAL pack under EES. We would also like to implement MDOP at the same time as SCCM to help us deliver UE-V and App-V but again, I have no idea how this is licensed and am struggling under the barrage of url links in the microsoft pages to make sense of it all! This is an extremely cheap (couple of £ per fte) add-on to the basic Desktop licencing under EES. For about £35 per fte (exact quotes from your favourite reseller), the Core Desktop Licence pack + MDOP should net you: Latest Windows Latest Office Server CALs SCCM CALs Exchange CALs Endpoint AV CALs MDOP (App-v, UE-V) and more for all client computers - a very good deal! 1
kennysarmy Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Just to clarify on the UK FTE calculation, your FTE count should be ALL Teaching/Support and Admin (not catering/cleaning/caretaking etc) working 200 hours or more per year 1
tmcd35 Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Just to clarify on the UK FTE calculation, your FTE count should be ALL Teaching/Support and Admin (not catering/cleaning/caretaking etc) working 200 hours or more per year I think we over pay! I just take the total staff count off SIMS.
kennysarmy Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 I think we over pay! I just take the total staff count off SIMS. oops!!!! 1
1066girl Posted May 21, 2015 Author Posted May 21, 2015 Yes this is fte including cleaners, catering, boarding staff, medical, estates staff, school office, etc etc. If it is full time teachers and admin, it is probably nearer 300!
localzuk Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Yes this is fte including cleaners, catering, boarding staff, medical, estates staff, school office, etc etc. If it is full time teachers and admin, it is probably nearer 300! The FTE is determined as any full-time (meaning 200 hours per year) "computer users" (doesn't include tills, if these are computerised). So, cleaners and most catering staff (the manager of the kitchen probably uses a computer, for example), dinner supervisors etc... would be excluded. For us, that works out at about 80 for 550 pupils. 1
fiza Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Yes this is fte including cleaners, catering, boarding staff, medical, estates staff, school office, etc etc. If it is full time teachers and admin, it is probably nearer 300! It should be anyone who uses a computer and works 200 hours per year. excerpt from How to calculate the FTE count for Microsoft EES | Education | SLA Performance Ltd Teachers – I will include all teaching staff - YES Admin – I will include all admin staff - YES Cleaners – cleaners work more than 200 hours per year but don’t have access to a PC – do I need to include them? - NO Kitchen – kitchen assistants work more than 200 hours per year but don’t have access to a PC – do I need to include them? - NO Cook – I will include the cook as she has access to a PC and her own staff username/log on. - YES Midday Assistants – some midday assistants work more than 200 hours per year but none of them have access to a PC – do I need to include them? - NO Teaching Assistants – Teaching assistants work more than 200 hours per year but don’t have their own PC/Laptop or staff user name/log on – they just help the pupils using the computers – do I need to include them? - NO 1
1066girl Posted May 21, 2015 Author Posted May 21, 2015 I'm going to hope/assume your FTE count is wrong and pick up some of the other bits around EES: You need to decide how often you want to upgrade these. When/if you move to Server 2016, or wait for the next major update. If you think you'll be refreshing you Server OS or SQL licences within 5 years then EES would normally be cheaper. Any longer and Perpetual licences are almost always better - which is why I never buy server licences on EES. Dows that SQL count include licences for SCCM? if so deduct them, SCCM comes with the SQL licence it needs. What features do you want our of SCCM? Are you looking to use it to manage the servers? If not then all the licencing you need to run SCCM are included in the CoreCAL pack under EES. This is an extremely cheap (couple of £ per fte) add-on to the basic Desktop licencing under EES. For about £35 per fte (exact quotes from your favourite reseller), the Core Desktop Licence pack + MDOP should net you: Latest Windows Latest Office Server CALs SCCM CALs Exchange CALs Endpoint AV CALs MDOP (App-v, UE-V) and more for all client computers - a very good deal! Thanks for this, yes the numbers were taken straight from the HR system, and aren't fte's or teaching/admin only! I did know about SCCM including SQL. We have SQL for MIS, Finance system, Estates System, other small dbs and an HR db which run on their own virtual servers. SCCM - we are planning to use it for server management as well as Endpoint, updates, patch management, software packaging, asset management, etc. Ultimately, it will be nice to introduce more automation for new staff, etc. Thanks for the reminder about MDOP, we want to look at App-V and UE-V once the domain is built. So, £35 per fte sounds a really good deal.
localzuk Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 SCCM comes with its own built in SQL license, but it can only be used specifically for SCCM.
Chris_ Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) 5 x SQL Server Enterprise 1Yr Depending on how many people are using the databases, it might be cheaper to license to license the server + user CALs. For example you might have 5x people using a finance system so it would be cheaper to license server + CALs, whereas if all teachers use iSAMS for registration/reports you'd be cheaper licensing it per CPU/core. Edited May 21, 2015 by Chris_
DMcCoy Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 Student BYOD devices will also need the student option to make sure they are covered for CALs etc (The FTE licensing only covers *pooled* student machines that aren't used by only one user).
jmak Posted May 21, 2015 Posted May 21, 2015 I think we over pay! I just take the total staff count off SIMS. I start with AD user accounts - tends to be more accurate (for EES) than HR or SIMS records.
jayemm Posted May 22, 2015 Posted May 22, 2015 @1066girl How many pupils do you have for 600 staff? Do you sit accross multiple sites? Are the 600 staff current staff or is it returning all staff current and leavers? Sorry, but it just appears quite a high number.
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