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General Chat Thread, ICT Out - Computing in! in General; Was this article first published in 1998?? With this quote underneath lol!! Schools will be free to use teaching resources ...
  1. #31

    CHR1S's Avatar
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    ICT Out - Computing in!-_57809474_schoolcomputers.jpg

    Was this article first published in 1998??

    With this quote underneath lol!!

    Schools will be free to use teaching resources that will equip pupils for the 21st Century

  2. #32

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    @Chr1s - was wondering that myself!!

    The thing is, when I was at school (1991-1995 beign the main years) - I learnt about the insides of a PC, how it worked - (Data Buses, Hard Drives, Ram, Frequency, etc) as well as how to use office apps (erm well the Acorn Archimedes equivelants), I had to write my own formulas in spreadsheet (Pipedream IIRC) with the only help given to me was a basic overview of how a formula worked, I even did programming (Pascal and even Logo (Turtle?)

    So why are we having to roll the clock back 20 years to get us into the 21st Century?

  3. #33
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    I would like to see more variation in ICT teaching in schools. Not just how to use applications, but how to deal with several OS's and their default applications as well. A bit of graphics and some simple programming wouldn't go amiss either would it?

    I remember doing Computer Studies at O level - in those days you were taught a fairly low level of computing. I had to know how to manually perform Octal/Hex calculations and had to provide a working program to pass the exam!

    Obviously things have moved on but I think the current ICT curriculum is too stagnant and too MS based. The biggest problem I can forsee is training. i.e teaching staff will get lots and lots of training and us guys will be expected to just 'know' everything about whatever new area they are teaching.

  4. #34

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    Does anybody else see where this is heading - schools rush to buy a load of Raspberry Pi's - does Gove have a vested interest in the company by any chance?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tech_guy View Post
    Does anybody else see where this is heading - schools rush to buy a load of Raspberry Pi's - does Gove have a vested interest in the company by any chance?!
    Considering its a charity... It doesn't make a difference...

  6. #36

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    Shame the Raspberry PI is not being made in the UK.

    from http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/509

    If a British company imports components, it has to pay tax on those (and most components are not made in the UK). If, however, a completed device is made abroad and imported into the UK – with all of those components soldered onto it – it does not attract any import duty at all. This means that it’s really, really tax inefficient for an electronics company to do its manufacturing in Britain, and it’s one of the reasons that so much of our manufacturing goes overseas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tech_guy View Post
    Does anybody else see where this is heading - schools rush to buy a load of Raspberry Pi's - does Gove have a vested interest in the company by any chance?!
    I wouldn't mind one, come to that..

    Part of me is quite pleased that Gove has done this - I agree that from what I see here, ICT teaching has become too..idiotic. Possibly the wrong word. Basic. Can you use word, excel etc, can you send an e-mail? Can you screenshot? You've passed. I see so many kids that just plain don't see the point, or think it's as dull as dishwater..that's not right.

    We do robotics club, scratch, and all that too - but it's a niche. I think we should do more "grass roots" IT..how it works, theory, fundamentals...stuff that applies globally, not just in the MS/Office camp. Take away the monkey-UI from our kids, they're lost. Dreamweaver code view - even the staff have problems understanding the code and come to us. I code in Notepad++.

    We're not helping them understand ICT at the mo, IMHO..and we're not utilising their brains much at all. If texting is more fun than lessons, we've not got it right.

    Bring back C++, Turbo Pascal, structured english, programming theory, quantitative methods, systems theory and systems practice, and hardware lessons. Never hurt me. I don't work in IT for the software, not at all..bar Virtualisation, I find it quite humdrum. Hardware, now that's different. How it all works, the nuts and bolts..yes.
    Last edited by Sirbendy; 11th January 2012 at 01:14 PM.

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by JJonas View Post
    Shame the Raspberry PI is not being made in the UK.

    from We’ve started manufacture! | Raspberry Pi
    Its designed here, and uses processor technology from a UK company. So, its not entirely a foreign thing.

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by localzuk View Post
    Its designed here, and uses processor technology from a UK company. So, its not entirely a foreign thing.
    I know that, just a shame the government cant get its act together and do something to encourage electronics manufacturing in the UK.

  10. #40
    CAM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirbendy View Post
    I wouldn't mind one, come to that..

    Part of me is quite pleased that Gove has done this - I agree that from what I see here, ICT teaching has become too..idiotic. Possibly the wrong word. Basic. Can you use word, excel etc, can you send an e-mail? Can you screenshot? You've passed. I see so many kids that just plain don't see the point, or think it's as dull as dishwater..that's not right.

    We do robotics club, scratch, and all that too - but it's a niche. I think we should do more "grass roots" IT..how it works, theory, fundamentals...stuff that applies globally, not just in the MS/Office camp. Take away the monkey-UI from our kids, they're lost. Dreamweaver code view - even the staff have problems understanding the code and come to us. I code in Notepad++.

    We're not helping them understand ICT at the mo, IMHO..and we're not utilising their brains much at all. If texting is more fun than lessons, we've not got it right.

    Bring back C++, Turbo Pascal, structured english, programming theory, quantitative methods, systems theory and systems practice, and hardware lessons. Never hurt me. I don't work in IT for the software, not at all..bar Virtualisation, I find it quite humdrum. Hardware, now that's different. How it all works, the nuts and bolts..yes.
    But if the curriculum has become so basic that the kids are taught very simple things, where are the skills to teach pupils these more advanced concepts? Will our students be taught to layout websites with tables or CSS? Will students studying C++ be taught a to code a basic 1980s style command line database or shown how to create a GUI-based application? What about apps instead? Will the current cohort of IT staff have that knowledge if anyone who can create an app or is well-versed in C# get a better wage outside the classroom?

  11. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by CAM View Post
    Will students studying C++ be taught a to code a basic 1980s style command line database or shown how to create a GUI-based application? What about apps instead?
    [old console you have to code games manually for] + Old code books + "Get on with it."

    They can learn by doing.

    Give teachers a month to play about beforehand, plus any techs/network managers/interested parties, so they can give advice. [Summer holiday training camp?]

    It'd be awesome.

    Let's do this.

  12. #42

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    Electronics manufacture in the UK (& EU) is more expensive because of health and safety legislation, environmental legislation, working hours directive & minimum wages etc. It makes the products less competitive than those produced in some parts of the world that pay lip service to such laws.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAM View Post
    But if the curriculum has become so basic that the kids are taught very simple things, where are the skills to teach pupils these more advanced concepts? Will our students be taught to layout websites with tables or CSS? Will students studying C++ be taught a to code a basic 1980s style command line database or shown how to create a GUI-based application? What about apps instead? Will the current cohort of IT staff have that knowledge if anyone who can create an app or is well-versed in C# get a better wage outside the classroom?
    Regardless, ANYTHING has got to be better than them being taught that an application is purely a GUI, an appearance, with no understanding of what lies underneath, any of the processes that the monkeyuser GUI enables, any underlying understanding of anything they're doing on a useful level - Office2k7 transitions - mass uprising of staff becuase it looks different. Same when we rolled from Studio MX to CS4.."it looks different, waah.". Really. Tables or CSS? If you asked, the answer I can guarantee in 99% of cases would be "umm, dreamweaver". 'nuff said.

    It's irrelevant. Understand what you want to do, the processes you need to do logically to achieve your ends, and it'll work regardless. There's not enough of that. What kids know now is a GUI. If I plonk a kid in front of..ooh, say Openoffice, some would be lost.."it's not word!". We still have staff bemoaning 7 vs Vista.."I want Office Vista back, or Windows 2007"...FFS, why? "Because It looked nice and worked better.".

    My arse. Too much pointless teaching of "surface" end user namby pamby IT now, no ruddy teaching of fundamentals and the way it actually works.

    Send 'em out to sit in front of MS Office apps and say "I know about PCs". Yes, quite. Erm, no. They're not learning much now IMO, merely parroting familiar movements. My 2 year old can do that, does it mean she's going to be a qualified IT geek by default at 6? I think not. Gods, I HOPE not. Both parents in IT, lets hope she does something normal..heh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirbendy View Post
    If I plonk a kid in front of..ooh, say Openoffice, some would be lost.."it's not word!".

    That's EXACTLY how my mum reacted when she "borrowed" my laptop.

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    So does this mean a move away from Microsoft services too, and a move to open source projects? Very interesting times...
    Last edited by CHiLL; 11th January 2012 at 03:09 PM.

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