PaulHarrington Posted September 21, 2012 Posted September 21, 2012 @PaulHarrington Do these delays also cover schools wanting to move to Progresso from another system - SIMS etc The migration process for schools coming from another MIS system follows a different process. This includes building all assessment templates, behaviour management models and other configurations from scratch in the system. This has the benefit of starting from scratch without the need for legacy information. In our experience the majority of migration complexity is related to the transfer of legacy data & configurations and this is one of our key areas of focus to enable Facility customers to take advantage of Progresso without losing any of the advanced configurations they have setup in Facility. 1
SouthCoastSaint Posted September 24, 2012 Posted September 24, 2012 Disappointed to read this thread. I had a meeting with a Progresso rep a few months ago - and then last week out of the blue I had another sales call. I asked how a neighbouring school was getting on so that I could visit and see it in action to be told they had not yet migrated. However, no mention of any issues with the product or migrations. Even had a follow up sales email. I don't think they should be actively recruiting new schools until at least some of the major problems are ironed out.
Mdh27 Posted September 24, 2012 Posted September 24, 2012 Similar story for us. Due to go in May, then August, then November, now "possibly" January. We realised things weren't right when we were testing in the summer and it couldn't even produce a correctly formatted timetable. Now going back to drawing board. Whole experience has been so bad (awful training provision) that we don't feel we can trust it.
wensleydale Posted September 24, 2012 Posted September 24, 2012 @Mdh27: Welcome on board! @paul Harrington: At least someone at SERCO has woken up and read this thread! 1
PaulHarrington Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 (edited) Similar story for us. Due to go in May, then August, then November, now "possibly" January. We realised things weren't right when we were testing in the summer and it couldn't even produce a correctly formatted timetable. Now going back to drawing board. Whole experience has been so bad (awful training provision) that we don't feel we can trust it. As previously highlighted we delayed transition from Facility to enable us to focus on implementing the identified improvements to both product and process to make the adoption of Progresso for future schools run as smoothly as possible. This includes improvements to training. For those schools that have experience of the transition process and have suggestions for improvement, please contact me directly so that I can discuss these with you. In the meantime, we are continuing to contact those schools affected to arrange the appropriate support. Edited September 25, 2012 by PaulHarrington
EdWhittaker Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Hi One of our customer schools went with Progresso at the start of term. They've had what they describe as 'a nightmare' and have hurriedly reverted back to CMIS. I don't know any details.
GREED Posted September 25, 2012 Posted September 25, 2012 Hi One of our customer schools went with Progresso at the start of term. They've had what they describe as 'a nightmare' and have hurriedly reverted back to CMIS. I don't know any details. Seems to be the common theme, I spoke to a school just today explaining their disappointment with the whole situation... fortunately they are not yet at the stage of having Progresso, but were very close to it.
sudeshatilsley Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Our SMT are seriously considering Progresso, but reading all the issues schools have been having I think I'll have to try and sway them towards SIMS which is our only other option because of our LA. They don't support any other MIS as far as I know. We only ever hear negative comments about Progresso. Very dissappointing.
Tallwood_6 Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Why do you need support from your LEA cant you just just get it direct from the supplier?
GREED Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Our SMT are seriously considering Progresso, but reading all the issues schools have been having I think I'll have to try and sway them towards SIMS which is our only other option because of our LA. They don't support any other MIS as far as I know. We only ever hear negative comments about Progresso. Very dissappointing. That is very limiting if you will only consider LA supported MIS options, just about every supplier including us welcome direct support!
vikpaw Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 That is very limiting if you will only consider LA supported MIS options, just about every supplier including us welcome direct support! maybe the 'support' also consists of financial support as in they give a discount
Bromcom_John Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 (edited) That is very limiting if you will only consider LA supported MIS options, just about every supplier including us welcome direct support! Have to agree with Graham here. Direct support is a very real strength of our own delivery. It would be extremely worth your while to have your head enquire with the LA exactly what their reasons are for taking this stance. If only for the clarity. What have you got to lose? Worst case you get a new MIS system which may suit your school requirements. Best case you get to shop around and get the system best suited to your schools requirements. You may find that the LA is going to tender soon anyway... Edited January 14, 2013 by Bromcom_John
john Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 Must admit that our place has said before well its what we have already which is Facility / Progresso or SIMS when I mentioned others such as Aspen, Bromcom and RM (note that is not an order of preference / desire just 3 more vendors of MIS's I could think of at the time all would need to be looked into, tested, evaluated etc...) I was told no its SIMS or stick as we are as there isn't anything else worth considering and as the LA do SIMS we should have it as it makes life easier AKA be sheep and match the rest. I do think the financial element is a very big one though LA's bulk buy deals are criminally cheap compared to individual, I don't know the figures our place got but the LA is cheapest for its product followed by the current setup but as we do very little with the LA myself and the Data Manager felt external direct support is what we would want for any other MIS product and the £££ just flew up major style at that point. Could can buy a luxury car apparently or a row of houses in a socio-economically deprived area for the money we are talking so I was told! and that is before the ££ of all the other bits needed to appease other firms such as new PCs if its a client based solution rather than Cloud / Web based etc.... LA's should be banned from having these agreements and schools forced to work on there own that would blow apart this captive market and I think for the better as people would look at others such as those mentioned above and stop being sheep if they paid the true cost, or it could drive costs from the big names down to sensible figures if they are that high! 2
vikpaw Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 I'm sure at one point teh LAs were getting 'done' for not shopping around too!
sudeshatilsley Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 (edited) Support from the LA does include financial support. It would cost us a fortune to go with any other MIS supplier compared to the options we have at present. Plus SIMs would fit in nicely with a lot of our third party software, FrogVLE, EclipseMLS, Groupcall Emerge etc etc. There was a rumour that a school in Birmingham that had gone direct to a supplier with no LA support and ended up with a slightly better version of the MIS they would have got from the LA but paid a fortune, that supplier was SERCO!!! Edited January 15, 2013 by sudeshatilsley
Bromcom_John Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 Support from the LA does include financial support. It would cost us a fortune to go with any other MIS supplier compared to the options we have at present. Plus SIMs would fit in nicely with a lot of our third party software, FrogVLE, EclipseMLS, Groupcall Emerge etc etc. There was a rumour that a school in Birmingham that had gone direct to a supplier with no LA support and ended up with a slightly better version of the MIS they would have got from the LA but paid a fortune, that supplier was SERCO!!! It certainly would have been interesting to have been a fly on the wall during "those" negotiations. Most of the existing suppliers will be more than capable of interfacing with the products you mentioned. Don't allow "received wisdom" or "someone elses experience" to colour your expectations. It's always worth at least making the enquiries with alternate suppliers, even if you don't intend to go with them. You might be surprised at the replies you get and, worst case scenario, you may get some market research ammunition you can use to strong-arm a better deal out of your chosen supplier (even if it comes via the LA).
CAM Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 There is a hidden benefit for most schools using the same MIS, they can bounce off of other schools and get help. The borough I work at is primarily SIMS and this has been a huge benefit as I gained lots of knowledge and guidance from them in how to use SIMS, knowledge later used to help other schools in the borough when they contacted me.
GREED Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 Agree with John, just because SIMS interfaces with Frog, Eclipse, Groupcall et al, does not mean others don't. It is very worry to see a number of 'my mate down the road has it so it must work' or 'SIMS must work because so many still use it' comment still. Being selfish for a moment, Aspen is revolutionary it the way it works, the offer to schools and groups of schools in particular is outstanding. Yes we have only a few schools compared to Capita in the UK (at the moment, and globally I would say we probably break even!), so does that mean Aspen is not worth a look? And just to give support where support is due, I have seen the Bromcom system and it too is very tidy and should always be looked at before deciding SIMS is the 'only' choice out there. We know Progresso is having it's problems and I genuinely hope that the acquisition helps the product over this year.
dfriday Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Just to let you all know that we have been using Progresso for a year now, and it has proved to be a complete nightmare. Very slow connection times, regular unexpected or warned downtime. Almost impossible to extract data. If your implementation has been delayed, consider yourselves lucky and I would advise you to stick with Facility for as long as possible. 1
Tallwood_6 Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Looks like Advanced Learning have ditched the free migration path now as well, this combined with feedback such as above means i would really like to look at alternatives. Wanted to get a closer look at Aspen at BETT but it seemed unless you either looked important or booked an apointment you had no chance.
Bromcom_John Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 You should contact Graham direct, I am sure he would jump at the chance for his team to arrange a demo for you. I know we certainly would
GREED Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 (edited) Looks like Advanced Learning have ditched the free migration path now as well, this combined with feedback such as above means i would really like to look at alternatives. Wanted to get a closer look at Aspen at BETT but it seemed unless you either looked important or booked an apointment you had no chance. @Tallwood_6 I assure you that was not the case... certainly on the days I was there! Closer to the real reason was we were so busy I and my colleagues couldn't get to see everyone, which was a real shame. We did have a booking system which was full and so ad-hoc chats became few and far between! Regardless, I am sorry we missed you, we would be happy to speak to you specifically, about Aspen. PM me and we can discuss further. On a more general note, I gotta say I am surprised in some respects that AL are going to charge for upgrades... considering the 'bad press' Progresso has had in recent times... Edited February 7, 2013 by GREED
GREED Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 You should contact Graham direct, I am sure he would jump at the chance for his team to arrange a demo for you. I know we certainly would @JohnCondon were you at BETT, I did have a look round for you to say hi!
psydii Posted February 7, 2013 Posted February 7, 2013 Looks like Advanced Learning have ditched the free migration path now as well, this combined with feedback such as above means i would really like to look at alternatives. . Really? That was still on the table when I spoke to them at BETT. A move like that would remove a significant incentive to risk going with that particular new an untested offer. I note that SIMS.NET didn't really work quite as advertised for five years after its first demo at BETT... and only really hit it's stride after seven. MIS's take their time to mature... I also note that the equivelant LoB systems in business are generally an order of magnitude more expensive, and yet often held in similar regard vis a vis performance and reliability.
Tallwood_6 Posted February 8, 2013 Posted February 8, 2013 Really? That was still on the table when I spoke to them at BETT. A move like that would remove a significant incentive to risk going with that particular new an untested offer. This is what i was told by our account manager at BETT, the 3 orginal migration packages have now been reduced to 2 and both incure some charge although I havent got any further details on pricing from them yet they seem to be implying the the previous "free" migration package proved insufficant. @GREED i will drop you a PM H-Squared
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