ihaveaproblem Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 Maybe a stupid question to some of you. I don’t see why we still use them. Why don’t we use emails and a scanner? Surly it's cheaper and more eco-friendly? Must be some valid reasons why we do:) I just don’t know them!
dobsonl Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 we use a desktop computer in reception that has a modem in, can send a fax from any program in school by sending it to the fax printer Works a treat and don't have to move out the office to send those annoying things.
Chris_ Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I think this image is relevant... http://www.thedoghousediaries.com/comics/uncategorized/2010-02-05-27c71fd.png 2
ihaveaproblem Posted October 6, 2011 Author Posted October 6, 2011 So other than people dis-liking change there is no valid reasons why fax is better than scan/email? A couple of months back I was helping a friend set up a PayPal business account and even PayPal requested us to fax off some information and even when asked they wouldn’t accept email/scan. I just don’t the point... Why are people so afraid of change…
synaesthesia Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I often get asked to "fax" things usually from banks and insurance people. They all get told the same thing "I'm sorry, this is 2011 and I'm not trotting off to the library or museum to find a working fax machine. Is there a reason you can't accept email?" Only once has someone answered yes - "because it can be forged" "Ok, no problem - so if I forge this document and fax it to you, that's legally binding?" "erm - well, thats our rules, sir" "No worries, if you can't accept it by email then I'll go elsewhere".
Guest Guest Posted October 6, 2011 Posted October 6, 2011 I think it's something to do with how Fax's are considered an accurate / true copy of a document in a legal sence. I think it goes that a faxed copy of a contract is considered in the Courts as quite super-duper. Personally I quite like sending a fax, it's got an old-world quality that makes me feel nostalgic for my first internet connection.
laserblazer Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 I used to service a Mufax fax machine in 1972. It comprised of two units the size small oven. One was a transmitter and one a receiver. They could be connected back to back, which made fault finding a bit easier. The paper had a china clay coating, which was burnt off by a hot stylus revealing the black backing. There was a bit of a smell and they weren't fast.
SYNACK Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 The reason it threefold, the main one is thanks to lazy lawyers. By law faxed documents are acceptable and emails are not, this alone would keep fax machines around. Reason two which is closely related to reason one is because there is no filter with fax, it goes from point a to point b with no spam filter etc. when you send it you know that a machine at the other end has recived it or if it has not, it also shows up on a phone companies records as a call which helps the whole legal thing. Reason three is the compleity, hardware, format shifting one were faxes are easy because any thickwit who can use a phone, can use a fax machine. They only require a phone line and there is no issue about knowing stuff like supported formats at the other end etc. I agree that fax is stupid given many modern advances but there is no real equivilent that is as simple, universal, tracked and accepted as a fax.
laserblazer Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 Unless it's a plain paper fax, I think it still has to be photocopied for it to be legal.
synaesthesia Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 None of the legal things goes anywhere near an actual explanation as to why - because there is no reason other than legal red tape/laziness and a dislike for change. Phone numbers can be forged as can fax receipts just as easily as an email. I personally *hate* the fact that legal people, who are supposedly intelligent enough to serve us all in the cause of justice, are unable to see reason or accept that something might just be better. It diminishes my faith in these people and the very reason that I don't have legal representation costs on things like my car insurance - I will rip people to shreds on my own in a properly constructed manner fit for the modern era - not in a way that some moron in a wig suggests might be best.
Jawloms Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 because any thickwit who can use a phone, can use a fax machine. Don't you believe it! There's always the "Do I need a 9" question and don't even get me started on which way up the paper goes! I have also heard stories of people being surprised that when they've sent their fax, "it's still here!" Yes that's correct, it's not supposed to physically send the paper down the phone line. You get to keep your original!
SYNACK Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 None of the legal things goes anywhere near an actual explanation as to why - because there is no reason other than legal red tape/laziness and a dislike for change. I agree, these are not my reasons, just the ones that are used by the legal/old professions. Thermal faxes were fun though. I heard a trick from a phone company employee to deal with fax spammers. Since most at that time used thermal paper and sheet feeders what you could do was get two bits of black paper and then fax that off to the number. As the paper went through you would tape the bits end to end so that the two peices formed an infinite circle. This kept the line busy with an infinite fax and due to the whole thing being black cranked up the thermal element on the reciving side to the max for a very long period of time often resulting in catostrophic failure of the remote fax machine Unfourtunatly the satisfaction of making a spammers machine catch on fire is no longer avalible to us with later methods and is possibly the one true loss. 3
jdoyle Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 probably for the same reason(s) we still use cheques, land lines and why teachers still hold onto VHS tapes and players. For some, fax machines are a way of avoiding having to deal with IT geeks. For others, when the network is down or running slow (or in the control of evil villains as seen in Hollywood movies), the fax machine/line still works.
sparkeh Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 Don't you believe it! There's always the "Do I need a 9" question and don't even get me started on which way up the paper goes! Those are very valid questions I have to ask the secretary everytime I need to send a fax!
Hightower Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 I still use a fax machine. Makes a perfect transfer for tattooing every single time
synaesthesia Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 Thermal faxes were fun though.... ... Unfourtunatly the satisfaction of making a spammers machine catch on fire is no longer avalible to us with later methods and is possibly the one true loss. That just made me laugh - what a cracking idea! Shame we can't do the same for email spammers somehow, at least without befriending someone at Anonymous
p858snake Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 Because [under Australian law at least] they are legally admissable in court where as emails are not (even digitally signed), which is why the legal and banking industry still use them because they have no currently legal alternative for this type of stuff (apart from sending paper copies with couriers). My dad works in the finance industry which results in documents being sent back and forth between the banks so it has to be done this way.
laserblazer Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 I still use a fax machine. Makes a perfect transfer for tattooing every single time How do you get your body part in the slot?
Hightower Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 How do you get your body part in the slot? That would be funny if I hadn't put 'transfer' in there.
JMB Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 The best description I ever heard of fax machines was a telephone-line based network of low quality printers. We got a spam fax the other day, advertising something pointless. I was amazed people still send these. In this day and age of email and texting and such. Can't help but wonder if there's a really old spammer, still working out of an old warehouse, utterly and stubbornly resisting change, insisting that he'll still make his million pound scam by sticking with faxes. Must dig out the spam fax we got. See if it was for a job lot of Betamax videos or something.
laserblazer Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 That would be funny if I hadn't put 'transfer' in there. This was actually asked by a young policeman after a guy was had up for sending obscene faxes!
Pyroman Posted October 7, 2011 Posted October 7, 2011 I'm not sure about other countries but faxes aren't actually the preferred method for legal documents because you can forge the time stamp by setting the clock on the machine to a different time. The only legally acceptable form is STILL to use a telex machine because the time is set at the telephone exchange on the kit they have there so it's impossible to forge the time stamps Source: I used to work for BT
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