Highway Code Hierarchy of Road Users

[jthompson]

The problem with merging is that I find that the type of drivers who tend to be on the right think it means "everyone stupid enough to be in the slow car lane must wait until all of us superior drivers have passed" rather than it being a 1:1 merge.

 

I can't wait for the advent of technology to allow for upvoting and downvoting of other road users. Enough downvotes and you get kicked off.

[LeMarchand]

I can't wait for the advent of technology to allow for upvoting and downvoting of other road users. Enough downvotes and you get kicked off.

 

I foresee drivers who abide by the Highway Code/law getting kicked off by those who see them as obstacles.

[Davit2005]

I can't wait for the advent of technology to allow for upvoting and downvoting of other road users. Enough downvotes and you get kicked off.

 

That is a good one

[jthompson]

I foresee drivers who abide by the Highway Code/law getting kicked off by those who see them as obstacles.

 

Oh, it'd be totally unworkable and plagued with misuse and abuse. Many's the time, however, that I've felt my IT admin privileges twitching helplessly whilst witnessing other drivers falling foul of the AUP, as it were.

[Andrew_C]

Ahh... but your vote would be weighted by how many up-votes you'd previously received.

[jthompson]

Ahh... but your vote would be weighted by how many up-votes you'd previously received.

 

A convoluted, mandatory reputation system designed to stifle undesirable behaviours. If you're not welcoming that with open arms then you must have something to hide!!!

 

/s

Edited January 27, 2022 by jthompson

[MartinT]

Take heed...

 

[mikeprice]

I foresee drivers who abide by the Highway Code/law getting kicked off by those who see them as obstacles.

 

I would get downvoted many many time for doing 29 in the 30 limit going past our estate - judging by the number of drivers who seem to take exception to it

 

and as for the 20 limit on the main road approaching the grandkids house!!!!!!

[mw184]

Had my first one today. Driving down a very busy road on the way to work. Pedestrian on the pavement on my side of the road walking along the path and then just turned out into the road with no warning. They didn't look to check if it was safe at all. Had to do an emergency stop and he shouted at me that he had right of way. I only just missed him because I was looking out for someone to do it. I am very worried that these new rules means more people are just going to walk out into the road and expect all road users to be able to react in time, even if they are only a couple of meters in front of the car. If I had been in a HGV, there would have been no chance. And I wasn't even doing 30 because of how busy the road is.

 

Just to add, this is not a hate post against pedestrians as 99% of them never cause issues. it is just the minority that I am very worried will cause accidents and use their interpretation of the new Highway Code rules to try to justify it. Time for a dash cam I think.

[Garacesh]

They didn't look to check if it was safe at all. Had to do an emergency stop and he shouted at me that he had right of way. I only just missed him because I was looking out for someone to do it. I am very worried that these new rules means more people are just going to walk out into the road and expect all road users to be able to react in time, even if they are only a couple of meters in front of the car.

Even as someone aware of this rule change, I still look 2-3 cars behind and check nobody is indicating before crossing. I can't understand why anybody wouldn't.

At best, it's just a courtesy, at worst, it's your own safety.

[mw184]

Even as someone aware of this rule change, I still look 2-3 cars behind and check nobody is indicating before crossing. I can't understand why anybody wouldn't.

At best, it's just a courtesy, at worst, it's your own safety.

 

I do a lot of walking as well as driving and I always check before crossing as it is still safest to do so. What annoyed me most about this was it was on a straight road with no junctions on it. They just suddenly turned and stepped out. It all happened in seconds with no warning at all. Not at a crossing and not at a junction. Just on a busy long straight road which was full of cars all travelling down it. I don't know why they thought it was a good idea just from a safety point of view. If it was at a junction I could understand more, as things (particularly where I live) change very quickly at junctions as most of them are blind and you cannot see a thing either in a car or on foot, so I would have been ok if it was a junction. It was the fact that it was on a long straight road without a junction for quite some distance that annoyed me.

[JSpaced]

Even as someone aware of this rule change, I still look 2-3 cars behind and check nobody is indicating before crossing. I can't understand why anybody wouldn't.

At best, it's just a courtesy, at worst, it's your own safety.

 

But it's not anymore. According to the Highway code, the people responsible for YOUR safety as a Pedestrian are, in order: HGV drivers, LGV drivers, cabbies, car drivers, motorcyclists and cyclists. After that long list of Nannies is exhausted, it would then be down to you, the pedestrian, to ensure you're safe to cross. So just step out. They HAVE to stop. Apparently.

 

My favourite gripe is when the pedestrian steps out three metres down from a crossing, crosses in front of traffic, then on the other side, walks the three metres PAST the crossing!

Edited February 2, 2022 by JSpaced

[mavhc]

"The hierarchy places those road users most at risk in the event of a collision at the top of the hierarchy. It does not remove the need for everyone to behave responsibly."

 

Walking into the road without looking isn't behaving responsibly, so it's the pedestrian's fault

 

Unless you were driving badly of course, over the speed limit, distracted, with brakes that don't work, etc

[JSpaced]

"The hierarchy places those road users most at risk in the event of a collision at the top of the hierarchy. It does not remove the need for everyone to behave responsibly."

 

Walking into the road without looking isn't behaving responsibly, so it's the pedestrian's fault

 

Unless you were driving badly of course, over the speed limit, distracted, with brakes that don't work, etc

 

Ah, right. I was basing it off a summary infographic, which means there's already misinformation out there about the changes:

 

[mavhc]

So to sum it up: Don't cause people to die, you bunch of idiots, do we have to spell every single thing out?

[JSpaced]

So to sum it up: Don't cause people to die, you bunch of idiots, do we have to spell every single thing out?

 

"a common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools"

Douglas, Adams. Mostly Harmless. Vol. 5. Pan Macmillan, 2009, p. 113.

[JSpaced]

I appreciate that, but I don't really care who's more responsible for my safety on paper - that isn't going to do me any good when I step out in front of a lorry and end up in the ICU

"Well we did ask for this...", says one ofsted inspector, trailing off his sentence and annoyingly making it seem like we haven't tried to prep for their arrival, despite the two preconfigured laptops sat on the table not two metres from them.

[/rant]

 

I think the primary concern is litigation. It SOUNDS like the driver of a truck filled with calor gas tanks is expected to slam on his brakes as a mother of three jumps out from between two vans with her buggy, because the driver of the truck "bears the responsibility".

 

Anyway, back on topic, as you say.

 

"Yes, we want you to help us, but no, not like that. In a way that allows us to seamlessly integrate with... whatever it is our laptops DO, without bothering us about it. Make it just work."

 

Yeah, no, hotspot yourself or shove off to Costa and use their Wi-Fi.

[JSpaced]

I don't know about you lot, but I was done talking about this...

[Garacesh]

Ah, right. I was basing it off a summary infographic, which means there's already misinformation out there about the changes:

 

Yeah, I don't really understand that diagram.

As an ex-cyclist (and admittedly as someone that only cycled for a year and half so not exactly a 'seasoned veteran', but still..) there is no force on this earth that would cause me to overtake a vehicle that had stopped in traffic like that.

Either the car has indicated that it is going to turn right, in which case, why the heck would I be overtaking it on the right? That's just a stupid maneuver.

Or it's not indicating at all, in which case it's a toss-up as to which way it's turning, and I'm not risking it being the previous issue.

(If it was indicating left I'd overtake in principle, were it safe to do so, but in practice, 99.99999% of times if the car is indicating left, it's probably not going to be hanging around in the main road for very long, due to the way traffic flows, so no real point.)

[Davit2005]

But it's not anymore. According to the Highway code, the people responsible for YOUR safety as a Pedestrian are, in order: HGV drivers, LGV drivers, cabbies, car drivers, motorcyclists and cyclists. After that long list of Nannies is exhausted, it would then be down to you, the pedestrian, to ensure you're safe to cross. So just step out. They HAVE to stop. Apparently.

 

My favourite gripe is when the pedestrian steps out three metres down from a crossing, crosses in front of traffic, then on the other side, walks the three metres PAST the crossing!

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-highway-code-8-changes-you-need-to-know-from-29-january-2022

 

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/updates

 

Note should and musts as far as I see it anyway :-)

 

people driving, riding a motorcycle or cycling must give way to people on a zebra crossing and people walking and cycling on a parallel crossing

 

or

 

when people are crossing or waiting to cross at a junction, other traffic should give way

 

if people have started crossing and traffic wants to turn into the road, the people crossing have priority and the traffic should give way

 

As far as my personal safety as a pedestrian I'll still be looking.

Edited February 2, 2022 by Davit2005

[Koldov]

The way I see it (and it is difficult to encompass a moving situation in one infographic) is that you should possibly just take it as it appears in the picture and that is the placement of all parties when the manoeuvre is just about to take place.

 

On the right hand side the cyclist is on the outside of the car (as discussed in this thread the cyclist can be anywhere on the road he wants) it could be that there isn't room on the inside or any number of reasons as to why the cyclist decided to go up the outside... but the car, if it turns now will knock him off.

 

"People cycling passing slower-moving or stationary traffic:

 

The updated code confirms that people cycling may pass slower-moving or stationary traffic on their right or left.

 

They should proceed with caution as people driving may not be able to see them. This is particularly important:

 

on the approach to junctions

when deciding whether it is safe to pass lorries or other large vehicles"

 

On the left hand side of the picture the cyclist is coming up on the inside and the car is also going to actually turn into him and knock him off.

 

Of course that in either case, any sensible cyclist should not overtake a car that is indicating to turn on either side and the car driver should be aware of what is around them before turning is common sense.

 

"People cycling are asked to watch out for people driving intending to turn across their path, as people driving ahead may not be able to see them."

 

But the Highway code now states it as a rule that you SHOULD NOT (note 'should not' instead of 'must not') turn in front of them if it will cause them to swerve or stop. It does not remove the need for everyone (including the cyclist) to behave responsibly. IMHO this is not 'breaking the law' but these rules now updated could be used as evidence in court of dangerous driving/without due care and attention.

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/the-highway-code-8-changes-you-need-to-know-from-29-january-2022

Edited February 2, 2022 by Koldov

[jmak]

Ah, right. I was basing it off a summary infographic, which means there's already misinformation out there about the changes:

 

The info-graphic quite clearly says that pedestrians have priority at junctions when the vehicle is turning into a different road. The change is that this now applies when turning from a minor into a major road (it was always the case the other way around) and that it now applies for pedestrians waiting to cross (previously it was only for those already crossing).

 

Obviously when driving, your fundamental rule should be "try not to crash" whatever other idiots do, but a pedestrian who steps out into moving traffic doesn't have priority

[HarryMonkey]

"a common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools"

Douglas, Adams. Mostly Harmless. Vol. 5. Pan Macmillan, 2009, p. 113.

 

Make something fool proof and they just design better fools.

[FN-GM]

Had my first one today. Driving down a very busy road on the way to work. Pedestrian on the pavement on my side of the road walking along the path and then just turned out into the road with no warning. They didn't look to check if it was safe at all. Had to do an emergency stop and he shouted at me that he had right of way. I only just missed him because I was looking out for someone to do it. I am very worried that these new rules means more people are just going to walk out into the road and expect all road users to be able to react in time, even if they are only a couple of meters in front of the car. If I had been in a HGV, there would have been no chance. And I wasn't even doing 30 because of how busy the road is.

 

Just to add, this is not a hate post against pedestrians as 99% of them never cause issues. it is just the minority that I am very worried will cause accidents and use their interpretation of the new Highway Code rules to try to justify it. Time for a dash cam I think.

 

Sounds like natural selection to me....

[mikeprice]

There is a lot of misinformation going round

 

people are stating that a pedestrian can just walk into the road whenever they want and if a car/bicycle/bus/lorry/mainbattletank runs into them then it isn;t their fault

 

which is total rubbish

 

very very little has changed

 

some advise has been made clearer - and the idea of letting a pedestrian cross if they are waiting in a minor junction and a car (etc) is turning in from a bigger road may be newish

 

stuff about cyclists riding in the middle of the lane - and hence stopping the whole of civilisation - is nothing new - just advise to be more visible - and is specifically says it is for quieter roads and the slower vehicle (e.g. cyclist) should move over if a faster vehicle wants to pass

hence - the car (etc) proceeds as before

 

which is just as before - just clearer

 

 

 

Looking at the comments sections of the Express and the DM (yes I know but I was curious!!) is almost threatening murder of all cyclists at times

 

Of which I disaprove - especially cyclists on ebikes!!!!