Google Meet / Google Hangouts vs. Zoom?

[Koldov]

I was informed the SLT will be trying to arrange some sort of Teacher's meeting soon probably via Zoom (unfortuantely having a hard time trying to explain why I disable the Teacher's laptop webcams via the password protected bios and how that means that I can't magically enable them remotely)...

 

However, I am going to send them various links on the subject of big schools or business actually banning its use (I am going to have a tough time explaining why if it's good enough for the UK govt. we shouldn't use it), but I have seen on here that the paid for version is better for some reason.

 

The thing is I am wondering that as we already have GSUITE up and running (sort of), if we couldn't use an app from that instead of paying for another product?

 

Could someone please clarify why I appear to have both MEET and HANGOUTS apps available which seem to have similar functions and which is better/preferable?

Edited May 8, 2020 by Zoom7000

[JATSO]

Zoom has now been banned by our LA now even though i had it blocked a while back.

We use Meet its free to use with GSuite.

Why pay for something when you have something already that is free.

 

"Hangout vs Meet

Google Hangouts Meet is Google's paid video conferencing software, provided as part of G Suite. ... Google Hangouts Chat is Google's paid team chat service, provided as part of G Suite. If you use Gmail with a company email address, you're already a paid G Suite user, meaning you can use Hangouts"

[mavhc]

Anyone with the link can join a zoom meeting, you need a school account and to log in to join the GMeet meeting. For teachers it won't really matter, but once you have pupils in meetings they'll just give the joining link to trolls to disrupt their own lessons, so might as well learn how GMeet works now.

 

Zoom does have a lot more features though.

 

You may be able to remotely enable the cameras, what model laptops?

[Koldov]

Why pay for something when you have something already that is free.

 

"Hangout vs Meet

Google Hangouts Meet is Google's paid video conferencing software, provided as part of G Suite. ... Google Hangouts Chat is Google's paid team chat service, provided as part of G Suite. If you use Gmail with a company email address, you're already a paid G Suite user, meaning you can use Hangouts"

 

Google Hangouts Meet is Google's paid video conferencing software, provided as part of G Suite.

 

Versus

 

Google Hangouts Chat is Google's paid team chat service, provided as part of G Suite (although there is a video option?).

 

But it's free?

 

What do they think 'paid' means.... (we haven't 'paid' for anything) I presume we can still use either?

 

I hope I don't appear pedantic, I'm just trying to get this straight in my head before I make my case to the SLT...

[JATSO]

Essentially they re-branded Hangouts to Meet but still have Hangouts confusing to say the least.

 

Have a read of this it might clear the mud a little

 

https://suitebriar.com/blog/google-hangouts-vs-meet

[Koldov]

Anyone with the link can join a zoom meeting, you need a school account and to log in to join the GMeet meeting. For teachers it won't really matter, but once you have pupils in meetings they'll just give the joining link to trolls to disrupt their own lessons, so might as well learn how GMeet works now.

 

Zoom does have a lot more features though.

 

You may be able to remotely enable the cameras, what model laptops?

 

I'm not really sure what the point is though (a bit like my business manager asking for a webcam for an online govenors meeting), what can't be dealt with via email/text/phone call...?

 

Hopefully for now it will just be teachers having a meeting to discuss the plan going forward... no pupils for now (or ever I hope)!

 

It appears that you can join a GMeet with just a link too (from the website info provided by @JATSO)?

 

"To us, the most attractive addition to video conferencing in the new and improved Meet from Google is that external participants can now join video meetings through the use of a shared link. Previously this could only be done through calendar invitations and special access permissions, which was a cumbersome process. This addition has created the ability for companies to quickly share a link, and have outside viewers (even if they don't use Google as their primary suite of productivity apps) join in on a meeting immediately. "

 

The laptops are HP 250 G6...

[crc-ict]

I'm not really sure what the point is though (a bit like my business manager asking for a webcam for an online govenors meeting), what can't be dealt with via email/text/phone call...?

 

Yes, there seems to be a lot of clamour for having webcams at the moment for these sort of meetings. Really not sure why it's considered so essential for all the participants to be seen, in fact I think it's a bit of a distraction actually. Something like this I reckon would be much better with just the 'chair' having a camera active.

[TwistedHelixis]

Anyone with the link can join a zoom meeting, you need a school account and to log in to join the GMeet meeting.

No, you can join using the URL or number, without an account I told.

[LeMarchand]

Yes, there seems to be a lot of clamour for having webcams at the moment for these sort of meetings. Really not sure why it's considered so essential for all the participants to be seen, in fact I think it's a bit of a distraction actually. Something like this I reckon would be much better with just the 'chair' having a camera active.

 

I think this is because IT people may often be wired a bit differently to "normal" folk. The latter like to have a face to speak to. I hate video calling - not least because I can't make gestures like "get on with it" or roll my eyes. And other gestures...

[Koldov]

Well, I made my case to the SLT...

 

Unfortunatrely this was the reply:

 

"I read about the security issues in Zoom. I think you can set your meeting so that attendees have to put in not only the meeting code, but a passcode as well now.

 

I tried Hangouts/Meet last week and it would only let me invite people on the same email domain and the Govenors do not have GSuite log-ins. Also, it seems you have to accept a request from everyone wanting to join"

 

Seems like that GSuite is going to be a little too much work....

 

Zoom it is then!

 

[TwistedHelixis]

Unfortunatrely this was the reply:

 

"I read about the security issues in Zoom. I think you can set your meeting so that attendees have to put in not only the meeting code, but a passcode as well now.

 

I tried Hangouts/Meet last week and it would only let me invite people on the same email domain and the Govenors do not have GSuite log-ins. Also, it seems you have to accept a request from everyone wanting to join"

 

Seems like that GSuite is going to be a little too much work....

 

And you counter argument is,

 

Meet is controlled from the school's own admin system, if something needs changing, such as allowing Meet to invite people outside the domain, its all possible, we have the power. You need to understand that Meet is starting at a secure level, but we can reduce the security bit by bit if needed. We can also have logs of all Meet meetings, and control if live streaming is enabled or if recording is an enabled option. Also Zoom is getting banned in some local authorities. Just thought you should have all the facts xxx

 

EDITED

Edited May 5, 2020 by TwistedHelixis

[fiza]

Didn't Google announce that you didn't need a GSuite account anymore to use Google Meet?

[Andycat]

Didn't Google announce that you didn't need a GSuite account anymore to use Google Meet?

 

Yes, rolling out now.

[Koldov]

And you counter argument is,

 

Meet is controlled from the school's own admin system.....

 

Awesome, have copied and pasted that almost word for word into my reply to the SLT!

 

Didn't Google announce that you didn't need a GSuite account anymore to use Google Meet?

 

Yes, rolling out now.

 

Thanks, if you have the time could you please post the steps or a link (both in the Admin page and for the end user)?

[DGardiner]

Well, I made my case to the SLT...

 

Unfortunatrely this was the reply:

 

"I read about the security issues in Zoom. I think you can set your meeting so that attendees have to put in not only the meeting code, but a passcode as well now.

 

I tried Hangouts/Meet last week and it would only let me invite people on the same email domain and the Govenors do not have GSuite log-ins. Also, it seems you have to accept a request from everyone wanting to join"

 

Seems like that GSuite is going to be a little too much work....

 

Zoom it is then!

 

We use meet with externals without issue - if they have the meeting URL they can join AFAIK

 

 

just tested incognito and got this, so it works without login

 

 

 

also "it seems you have to accept a request from everyone wanting to join"

isn this what keeps your very confidential meetings secure from prying eyes..... oh woe is me i have to accept a handfull of governors request to join a meeting

Edited May 5, 2020 by DGardiner

[fiza]

Here is the link to the announcement https://www.blog.google/products/meet/bringing-google-meet-to-more-people/

[DGardiner]

Didn't Google announce that you didn't need a GSuite account anymore to use Google Meet?

 

wasnt that just its now available on consumer accounts, im sure you could always join a meeting without an account you just need the url.

[dhicks]

Meet is controlled from the school's own admin system, if something needs changing, such as allowing Meet to invite people outside the domain, its all possible, we have the power. You need to understand that Meet is starting at a secure level, but we can reduce the security bit by bit if needed. We can also have logs of all Meet meetings, and control if live streaming is enabled or if recording is an enabled option.

 

Good summary. If users record Meet sessions they get placed in a "Meet Recordings" folder in Google Drive, and as GSuite domain admins we can access those recordings if needed for audit / safeguarding purposes. Also, for Education GSuite domains, there's no storage limit, so each teacher can record Meet sessions as needed without any worry about storage space or costs.

 

With either solution (and probably Teams as well), if you have an open URL that finds its way to the outside world, people have written tools to scrape public Zoom / Meet / etc URLs from any available source and post them in forums where people can go an "Zoom bomb" the meeting (I was on a non-school Zoom meeting the other day where a naked, fat sweary person turned up - an silly prank in this case, but not the sort of thing you'd want happening in anything school related).

 

Meet's integration with Classroom means there's no need for Meet URLs to be posted around by email / on websites - pupils log in to Google Classroom and connect to the Meet session for invidual lessons from there, teachers don't need to copy-and-paste URLs or join codes around.

[mavhc]

The laptops are HP 250 G6...

 

https://ftp.hp.com/pub/caps-softpaq/cmit/HP_BCU.html may work then

[mavhc]

Zoom join urls contain the password of course

[Koldov]

Good summary. If users record Meet sessions they get placed in a "Meet Recordings" folder in Google Drive, and as GSuite domain admins we can access those recordings if needed for audit / safeguarding purposes. Also, for Education GSuite domains, there's no storage limit, so each teacher can record Meet sessions as needed without any worry about storage space or costs.

 

With either solution (and probably Teams as well), if you have an open URL that finds its way to the outside world, people have written tools to scrape public Zoom / Meet / etc URLs from any available source and post them in forums where people can go an "Zoom bomb" the meeting (I was on a non-school Zoom meeting the other day where a naked, fat sweary person turned up - an silly prank in this case, but not the sort of thing you'd want happening in anything school related).

 

Meet's integration with Classroom means there's no need for Meet URLs to be posted around by email / on websites - pupils log in to Google Classroom and connect to the Meet session for invidual lessons from there, teachers don't need to copy-and-paste URLs or join codes around.

 

 

Ok, but Meet needs a URL to be emailed to a non GSuite user and then the host of the meeting then needs to accept?

Edited May 5, 2020 by Koldov

[DGardiner]

Ok, so Meet needs a URL to be emailed to a non GSuite user and then the host of the meeting needs to accept?

 

yep, i would make sure you log into admin and turn off the phone in details unless youre paying for edu ent - someone will undoubtedly call the USA number and get upset with their phone bill

[dhicks]

Ok, but Meet needs a URL to be emailed to a non GSuite user and then the host of the meeting then needs to accept?

 

Yes, if you're having a non-domain user join a Meet (as a guest speaker for a Classroom, maybe) you can email them a URL, the host then has to accept them before they can actually join the Meet, and the host can boot them out at any time. The host can also mute anyone, which comes in handy for a teacher hosting a class. Would be a handy feature to bring back into the physical classroom...

[keyboards]

We have suggest meet for everything as we're a google school, we don't endorse not support Zoom, 99% of took this onboard obviously a few haven't

 

In google we can control who can record, who can do different bits, we have logs of it, any staff using Zoom and circumventing their own IT policy deserve a massive bollocking(they won't get it)

 

We have provided as IT professionals a set of tools to do exactly what they need, it's a shame some staff or SLT feel they are better than our judgement or well laws and guideliness too, if an incident happens on Zoom no-one has any logs of it or even proof of anything

[mavhc]

can you disable join via url in GSuite? Because anyone with the link can say they're whoever they want to pretend to be

 

- - - Updated - - -

 

if an incident happens on Zoom no-one has any logs of it or even proof of anything

 

Just like in real life then