PS4 Announced

[Theblacksheep]

PS4 factsheet

 

* 1 PS+ account will allow all on console to play online

* PS+ account not required for additional streaming services like netflix

* Single player games can be played offline

* Region free

Edited June 11, 2013 by Theblacksheep

[sparr0wn]

<3 gotta love that its no DRM

[Hefferzzzz]

And none of those take into account people who pirate to test

 

 

 

That really doesnt make it right though does it? Regardless of whether you buy it afterwards or not....

[sonofsanta]

That really doesnt make it right though does it? Regardless of whether you buy it afterwards or not....

 

I am not sure I understand your logic here. If a pirated version is used to check system compatibility - because refunds for PC games are a PITA, be they Steam or an opened retail copy, and because a lot of developers no longer provide a demo that would perform a similar task - and, once compatibility is proven, the game is purchased and the developer rewarded, where's the immorality?

[Hefferzzzz]

I am not sure I understand your logic here. If a pirated version is used to check system compatibility - because refunds for PC games are a PITA, be they Steam or an opened retail copy, and because a lot of developers no longer provide a demo that would perform a similar task - and, once compatibility is proven, the game is purchased and the developer rewarded, where's the immorality?

 

It may be more to do with the beligerant bad mood I am in today.

 

Where is the morality in illegally obtaining a product to use and then if you like it, you might reward the person who created that product?

[Guest Guest]

The (non mandatory) PSeye is going to be £44

 

Extra PS4 Controllers are going to be £49-£55

 

On the face of it the xbox looks far more expensive than the ps4 but if you want the PSeye, which tbf (although I can't really be assed to stand up when playing a game) you really should have to make the most of the new gen console, that makes the PS4 only £35 cheaper than the xbox.

 

I wonder how much the xbox pads will be. If they come out at say £35 that close the gap even more.

[synaesthesia]

It may be more to do with the beligerant bad mood I am in today.

 

Where is the morality in illegally obtaining a product to use and then if you like it, you might reward the person who created that product?

 

Physical products have laws that state you can return products for that reason. Game demo's are getting increasingly worse and some studios don't even bother with them. I certainly don't waste £25 (yeah, that's £25 for a AAA title, not £55 - sorry, little dig!) on a game to find it's utter turd!

[Theblacksheep]

On the face of it the xbox looks far more expensive than the ps4 but if you want the PSeye, which tbf (although I can't really be assed to stand up when playing a game) you really should have to make the most of the new gen console, that makes the PS4 only £35 cheaper than the xbox.

 

I wonder how much the xbox pads will be. If they come out at say £35 that close the gap even more.

 

No-one needs the PSeye. Good decision to leave it out, most people don't want these silly add-ons.

Edited June 11, 2013 by Theblacksheep

[Hefferzzzz]

Physical products have laws that state you can return products for that reason.

 

No they dont. You cannot return something under law just because you dont like it. Some stores will do it out of 'customer service' but they are not obliged to.

[JJonas]

And none of those take into account people who pirate to test [Like I do. Like it > Buy it. Don't like it > delete it.] or download cracks to play what they've bought [Like I have... Stupid Uplay.]

 

 

Thats what LoveFilm is for

[sonofsanta]

It may be more to do with the beligerant bad mood I am in today.

 

Where is the morality in illegally obtaining a product to use and then if you like it, you might reward the person who created that product?

 

Apart from the fact that morality and legality are not the same, a counterpoint: where's the morality in forcing me to pay up front for a product only to find out it doesn't work and then arguing over a refund? Perfect recent example: Sim City's botched launch, where people asking for a refund on a game they couldn't play because EA's servers were broken were threatened with having their accounts banned, therefore locking them out of other games legally bought on that account.

 

Other games which, incidentally, would have been safe had they been pirated. A lot of the time, a pirated product is demonstrably better than a purchased product WRT gaming. There are a few companies who have realised that the way to combat piracy is just to provide a better product than the pirates (CD Projekt of The Witcher games come to mind) but unfortunately, most are still punishing the paying customer in order to target the pirate who remains unaffected by any such measures. Similarly with movies: that damned annoying anti-piracy ad I have to sit through on every DVD and BluRay, but never on any downloaded media (or Netflix - which is why I do most of my watching through that service now).

 

I should say, I pay for all of my games through Steam/GOG/Humble Bundle, watch movies and episodes through Netflix and buy music from Amazon. So I am not trying to argue from an entitled "but I wants my free things!" position.

[synaesthesia]

Games you buy online are (distance selling act) even for open games. It's an abused system but it's there. Point still stands though, I'm not going to be ripped off by any idiot and it's one reason I think people in general (groups of people) are muppets for letting the likes of Sony and MS dictate their future to them.

I don't spend as much these days because of doing that but that's because I don't want to be wasting money on crap products when I have far more important things to spend money on (kids). Humble bundles and steam sales are working against me though

 

What are the next round of DVD anti piracy ads going to say?

 

"You wouldn't test drive a car?"

 

...

 

There's a very good reason I dislike consoles, Apple and EA Games. And it's all to do with morality and getting a fair deal for ALL involved parties.

Edited June 11, 2013 by synaesthesia

[tmcd35]

Sounds to me as if the PS4 has even this area covered! (assuming your broadband will support it). Every game will be available digitally day 1, and every game will be playable as a limited free trial. I'm guessing they'll use Gaikai to instantly stream the trial. And I'll guess, based on my experience with PS+ on the PS3, that the trial will be time limited to an hours play.

 

There you go, what's your excuse for pirating now?

[X-13]

There you go, what's your excuse for pirating now?

 

On PS4? Nothing.

 

On PC and Xbone... Exactly the same as it always was. No demos and/or [censored] DRM.

[Theblacksheep]

Sounds to me as if the PS4 has even this area covered! (assuming your broadband will support it). Every game will be available digitally day 1, and every game will be playable as a limited free trial. I'm guessing they'll use Gaikai to instantly stream the trial. And I'll guess, based on my experience with PS+ on the PS3, that the trial will be time limited to an hours play.

 

There you go, what's your excuse for pirating now?

 

Beat me to it on Full game trails, a very good feature of PS+ right now with PS3's, but expanded more for most PS4 games.

[X-13]

a very good feature of PS+

 

Oops. Reason for piracy, right there.

 

Demos locked behind a pay wall.

[CAM]

I find it ironic how publishers want to crack down on piracy for being illegal yet they happily flout the law with their desires to trash the used games market. Don't think you owe these publishing outfits any respect, they lost mine years ago with their board members crowing about fleecing the public and "turning a $50 sale into a $150 sale." Or taking a profitable game and killing it then trashing the studio through arrogance (Hello NCSoft)! Don't think they care for the developers either.

[gshaw]

Think this might be the end for me and consoles now

 

The suits have really taken over this time - MS with mandatory spycam, phone home and 2nd hand restrictions then Sony nearly had it sorted but announce they're going to start charging for the online component... thanks but no thanks. My 360 went back in the box at the start of this year as I'd had enough of paying £35 every couple of months for the "privilege" of Xbox Live, not doing that again.

 

The worrying thing is the next generation of kids growing up with these consoles will see this level of monitoring and control by large companies as perfectly normal

Edited June 11, 2013 by gshaw

[tmcd35]

Oops. Reason for piracy, right there.

 

Demos locked behind a pay wall.

 

I'm pretty sure it's no longer a PS+ feature and open to all - happy days! (on PS4)

 

Think this might be the end for me and consoles now

 

Sony nearly had it sorted but announce they're going to start charging for the online component... thanks but no thanks.

 

Less than £5 per month and you get a free game every month! Is it really too much for Sony to ask for to provide an additional service? Good old "everything has to be free on the Internet". Sony could always not have an online component and leave it entirely up to individual game devs to sort it out themselves. How much did someone say the PC CoD servers cost a few posts back?

Edited June 11, 2013 by tmcd35

[X-13]

I'd had enough of paying £35 every couple of months for the "privilege" of Xbox Live, not doing that again.

 

I'd accept pay-for-online, if you had the option of private servers.

 

As in, pay £x for access to a server provided by the devs with an SLA [uptime, patch availability, community support regarding toxic players, hack blocking, wa'eva] OR you connect to/setup your own.

 

 

Good old "everything has to be free on the Internet".

 

That isn't the issue.

 

The issue is buying a game and having part of it locked behind an additional pay wall by a company who have [censored] all to do with the server costs... If there even are any. XBL was peer to peer, but you still have to pay for it.

Edited June 11, 2013 by X-13

[sonofsanta]

The best example of the arbitrary nature of XBox Live was the need for a Gold account to use Netflix. What has Netflix got to do with XBL? If anything, tying it down like that was a worse service because it prevented you from using that account elsewhere (playing a Games for Windows Live game on the PC) as an account could only be logged on in one location. The more you used your account and invested in services for it, the more you were punished.

 

EDIT: in summary, MS full of hubris, Sony offering a better device for a better price, but PC still best

Edited June 11, 2013 by sonofsanta

[CAM]

The problem is even a private server needs to phone home at some point. Counter-Strike would phone home to the WONID service and later Steam even though the servers were privately run and could be set up by anyone. These days the chat system, achievements and matchmaking all require a connection to the platform servers to pass messages on, add friends, handle notifications and so forth. Servers also pass metrics, anti-cheat and lobby information back to publishers. Even if developers handled their own multiplayer systems, you would still have to connect to the platform for these services.

 

I do prefer Steam's method though. You get trading cards that you ignore and not pay a penny whilst someone else buys the cards and Steam gets a cut of sale and you get some spare change in your pocket if you sell your cards. It's pennies but adds up on a macro scale.

[gshaw]

I'm pretty sure it's no longer a PS+ feature and open to all - happy days! (on PS4)

 

 

 

Less than £5 per month and you get a free game every month! Is it really too much for Sony to ask for to provide an additional service? Good old "everything has to be free on the Internet". Sony could always not have an online component and leave it entirely up to individual game devs to sort it out themselves. How much did someone say the PC CoD servers cost a few posts back?

 

Yes when the service is poor and falls over every time a new game / download comes out, when your details get leaked after hacks and so on. Then on top the publishers add their own servers (yes EA I mean you) that are even worse.

 

As someone said above it's not like you even get dedicated servers or anything worthwhile, only the cost.

[mac_shinobi]

If you got one gtx titan for aprox £900 and then a reasonable mobo, 4gb ddr3 ram, dual core i5 cpu or even an amd and a psu + case, optical drive and a 250 gb 7,200 rpm hdd. How much would that come to ?

[tmcd35]

As someone said above it's not like you even get dedicated servers or anything worthwhile, only the cost.

 

I think @CAM made a good point as to what you are paying for...

 

These days the chat system, achievements and matchmaking all require a connection to the platform servers to pass messages on, add friends, handle notifications and so forth. Servers also pass metrics, anti-cheat and lobby information back to publishers. Even if developers handled their own multiplayer systems, you would still have to connect to the platform for these services.

 

Even these servers need maintenance and bandwidth.

 

Personally it doesn't bother me either way. I extremely rarely play multiplayer. That, and I'd happily pay out for PS+ whether or not the online gaming are included or free. I think there's more than enough value in plus without the multiplayer component.