embc changing dns to new provider

[sparkeh]

Anyone else asked embc to do this yet?

Requested it a couple of days ago and not a peep out of them - its not that difficult to change TAG and name servers right?

 

(guess all the resources are going into servicing the people who are staying with them :/ )

[glennda]

I can't comment on that but TBH you don't want them to change the name servers over yet.

 

You want them to transfer the tag to new provider provide you with a DNS zone, make the changes to it and then put on your new nameservers. Then with new provider change the nameserver records with nominet.

 

As they may change them over to a dns server which doesnt have a full record.

[sparkeh]

I can't comment on that but TBH you don't want them to change the name servers over yet.

 

You want them to transfer the tag to new provider provide you with a DNS zone, make the changes to it and then put on your new nameservers. Then with new provider change the nameserver records with nominet.

Everything is ready to go. The new provider has the zone setup, email is all setup, a copy of the website has been moved over, just waiting for embc to makes their change.

I know that the new provider can do the ns bit but I guess we are a bit stuck until the tag is done?

[glennda]

Everything is ready to go. The new provider has the zone setup, email is all setup, a copy of the website has been moved over, just waiting for embc to makes their change.

I know that the new provider can do the ns bit but I guess we are a bit stuck until the tag is done?

 

Ah ok - have EMBC given you a copy of the zone they have? I just know when i did it there was some old records I didn't know existed (point to various odd bits) so is worth double checking that.

 

And No you are right as long as its a uk domain with a tag its easy. .Com's are a pita

[sparkeh]

Ah ok - have EMBC given you a copy of the zone they have? I just know when i did it there was some old records I didn't know existed (point to various odd bits) so is worth double checking that.

 

And No you are right as long as its a uk domain with a tag its easy. .Com's are a pita

Yeah they gave a copy

Was hoping to get this done before start of term next week, fingers crossed :S

[synaesthesia]

They're inundated currently and response times are not quick. Something they perhaps should have been better prepared for, although my views on this are already well known and I've past caring We had to shout REALLY loud to get a couple of my schools done.

[Edu-IT]

Think I made the right choice a few weeks ago to move the domain away to somewhere completely separate, by the sounds of it. Good luck Sparkeh.

[glennda]

As a last resort if EMBC are not doing as they should in a reasonable time frame you can ask Nominet to force the change but as I saw that really is the last resort they charge £10 + vat to do this

 

Change registrar | Nominet

[TonySheppardNCC]

Changes of DNS are progressing and are being monitored by LAs. Most people are simply asking for a copy of the zone file and asking for the tag to be released. Some are asking for a more managed change such as mentioned above (copy of zone file, replicate DNS with new DNS host, ask for Name Servers to be changed to new Name Servers, ask for TAG to be released to new Registrar, request embc to close down the zone file, set destination on MailMarshall to your new mail server address, change MX records to your new server address, ask embc to remove account on MailMarshall).

 

Some of the above will vary as to the order depending on how and if you are moving mail services, moving connections, etc ... so there is no single perfect example of how to do it and it is expected that if you are taking on separate services that you are capable of organising migrating of services (which most here are).

 

DNS hosting (which is different to DNS resolution) is a core service that needs to be considered and planned carefully.

 

Although it is too late to mention this for this migration, you can be sure that schools will migrate again in the future. Those schools who have moved most smoothly specified the date of most of the above actions when making calls to the desk, they made the calls several weeks in advance and kept the desk informed of any changes to their project plan.

 

For some schools this wasn't needed as they had very simple setups or have simply opted to drop their .sch.uk domain. I will shortly be sharing a paper about the role of .sch.uk domains in schools and part of it is a recommendation that schools still take control and ownership of this domain.

[mats]

We're waiting on EMBC too. Their sluggishness is matched only by the shoe-dragging that's going on at RM at the moment.

[Edu-IT]

What is happening with regards to static IP addresses and that, will KCOM transfer all those with them?

 

I've just had a thought also. Our new MailMarshal service has been pointed at the internal IP address of our server by Capita. I assume after the switchover that will still continue to work, as Capita servers must be on the same 'network' and able to see our internal IP?

 

@TonySheppardNCC @GrumbleDook

[sparkeh]

Well, it took over a week but the change has been made and are propagating.

I thought that a week and a half was plenty of notice to make a simple change like releasing the tag and changing name servers but hey-ho.

[Edu-IT]

Well, it took over a week but the change has been made and are propagating.

I thought that a week and a half was plenty of notice to make a simple change like releasing the tag and changing name servers but hey-ho.

How silly do you feel now!

[sparkeh]

How silly do you feel now!

Hehe... yeah...

Well everything has moved over now so I can breathe a sigh of relief.

[Edu-IT]

So, it's begun! Anyone else nervous for tomorrow?

[SchoolsBroadband]

So, it's begun! Anyone else nervous for tomorrow?

 

Well I'm not going to lie I am a little. Despite us continuosuly emailing and calling every school that are using our service in EMBC I'm worried some still haven't done anything. Still we're here to help and ready and waiting to make everything work. Just give us a call if you've lost your emai / DNS and we'll pressure EMBC / Capita to get it sorted straight away.

 

Thanks

 

Dave

[Edu-IT]

Anyone found the OH relay to be blocked now after last night?

[sparkeh]

So, it's begun! Anyone else nervous for tomorrow?

I was nervous until about lunchtime yesterday, when everything was up and running and transferred, big relief

 

Lesson for next time, don't rely on your current provider to get things sorted for you in a timely manner and migrate well in advance

[synaesthesia]

I think even with the wealth of information put together by the Schools Broadband Working Group in Northants there was still a fair bit of information missing but that was only apparent when "The Time" came around. EMBC didn't do a huge amount to help (in my personal opinion and experience) but thankfully the guys at our new provider have been very good and very patient, despite being extremely busy with everything going on! I think the majority of us will have extensive notes on what to do next time round though (this is likely to be a more common occurrence now we're on our own of course!)

[Smee]

I've just been contacted by a school who haven't sorted out their email :$ I think they just expected it to suddenly appear as if by magic even though they knew they wouldn't be using EMBC. Ho Hum

[PeterH]

Anyone found the OH relay to be blocked now after last night?

 

Yep it appears to be a DNS problem, it can't resolve relay.inthehive.net or any other inthehive.net subdomain. Have reported it to the OH helpdesk who were very pleasant and helpful but didn't seem to take on board that it's a DNS problem. No outbound email though until they've fixed it.

[synaesthesia]

I've just been contacted by a school who haven't sorted out their email :$ I think they just expected it to suddenly appear as if by magic even though they knew they wouldn't be using EMBC. Ho Hum

 

Bet they're loving that.

 

"Can we get them back?"

 

No.

[Jambo_C]

Yep it appears to be a DNS problem, it can't resolve relay.inthehive.net or any other inthehive.net subdomain. Have reported it to the OH helpdesk who were very pleasant and helpful but didn't seem to take on board that it's a DNS problem. No outbound email though until they've fixed it.

 

Yep, same problem here, no outbound mail. I looked at MailMarshall and the last outbound email to reach MailMarshall was at around 7:30 last night. I just logged a call with Capita and the lady on the helpdesk claimed it was a DNS issue with KCOM. She said they're looking into it.

[TonySheppardNCC]

What is happening with regards to static IP addresses and that, will KCOM transfer all those with them?

 

I've just had a thought also. Our new MailMarshal service has been pointed at the internal IP address of our server by Capita. I assume after the switchover that will still continue to work, as Capita servers must be on the same 'network' and able to see our internal IP?

 

@TonySheppardNCC @GrumbleDook

 

Apologies for the delayed response, I've been out of the office.

 

All incoming Firewall rules should have been transferred 'as is' as KCOM. The MX Records will point at whatever service you chose (eg MailMarshal within the OH service) and then the pointer from MM will go to the specified service (eg OHMail, in-house server, etc). You have kept your existing emPSN WAN IPs so there would be no change there either.

 

If you have taken services from a mixture of different framework suppliers, or are mixing in-house and framework services, then you will have to go through and check that the various services are then sending traffic to the right place.

[TonySheppardNCC]

I think even with the wealth of information put together by the Schools Broadband Working Group in Northants there was still a fair bit of information missing but that was only apparent when "The Time" came around. EMBC didn't do a huge amount to help (in my personal opinion and experience) but thankfully the guys at our new provider have been very good and very patient, despite being extremely busy with everything going on! I think the majority of us will have extensive notes on what to do next time round though (this is likely to be a more common occurrence now we're on our own of course!)

 

The information in the toolit was pretty agnostic and it was intentionally left for suppliers or schools to come up with options / case studies / FAQs to fill in the gaps. Because of the position of NCC staff it would have been difficult to write 'exit' or 'transition' instructions for services we do not manage and/or have not be part of a procurement to deal with.

 

I would say that it is likely that the movement of some or all services, and the connectivity to/from them, will be a pretty common occurence in the future, but this will partly stem from a desire to change because of schools feeling they are not getting what they want and partly from believing that the grass is greener elsewhere.

 

It is also likely that the cost of change will be missed and it should be a factor when considering options in the future. There is sometimes little benefit to be gained by saving £2000 only for the man hours to cost more than this to do the change. The other consideration is that a change should bring an impact on education (a positive one that is) and quantifying that can sometimes be difficult.

 

If people are writing up their experiences and would like to share them then I would ask that all comments are kept constructive and not delving into 'blame management'. Lessons Learnt are an invaluable addition at the end of any project to help with future projects or even the management of steady state services.