Chris4 Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 (edited) Hello, We're looking to getting a managed wireless solution for our primary school, so it'd be great to hear some opinions on this. We have 20 classrooms, of which only uses 1 teacher laptop each at present (that could be made wireless), as well as 20 netbooks that are occasionally used in KS2 classrooms. I'm looking to get a few quotes from companies to compare... so far I've got a quote from the Education IT Support at the city council for a Cisco wireless solution, as well an Aerohive wireless solution... Cisco 1 x Cisco AIR-CT5508-25-K9 Wireless Controller 24 x Cisco AIR-LAP1142N-E-K9 Access Points 2 x Cisco 24 Port Gigabit with 2 mini Gigabit and POE 1 x Installation and configuration Total = £17,800 Aerohive 24 x Aerohive AP120 24 x 5 year HiveManager Online + Support Total = £14,300 Each quote includes 24 access points - 1 for each classroom, plus other rooms; however this can be reduced once a site survey is performed (i.e. classroom sharing). Although the Aerohive solution got me excited when I first saw it, I'd probably pick the Cisco solution over the Aerohive at present, due to the local support we'd get and site survey included; whereas Aerohive seems more of a DIY job, though the cloud-based controller looks easy to manage. I done a bit of searching on this forum and I've contacted C-P-LTD regarding Ruckus Wireless which looks good. Does anyone has any suggestions, tips or comments to make that would help me out? I'm a university placement student and have limited knowledge in this area, so your opinions are greatly appreciated. Thanks, Chris Edited June 12, 2012 by Chris4
Millgate Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 What about Meru? Worth thinking about! Also, I can give you a quote for the Cisco kit and i bet it comes a lot cheaper! We'll have a lot of the kit in stock
glennda Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 Personally I would avoid the Cisco kit - my experience of it hasn't been great.
deano Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 We use all Cisco wireless kit and not had any issues. Very expensive but you get what you pay for!
bodminman Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 (edited) we are a Unifi school here and have been very impressed with it so far. if you are not looking to use all the fancy things you'll pay for with the big boys then you should seriously consider this kit. @m25man is the chap to fire any questions at. Edited June 12, 2012 by bodminman
SimpleSi Posted June 12, 2012 Posted June 12, 2012 Unifi is the way to go for a primary You don't need a site survey if your sticking one AP in each teaching area 24 APs at £65 each = £1K5 Each AP needs its own network point so if you don't have a spare one in each class you'd need to budget for that (£20 for a little 8 port switch in the classroom - £100/point at most to get a contractor in run extra wires (£3k max - prob a lot lot less) + few hundred for a central 24 port switch. The Unifi APs are centrally configured but run independently so I'd call them semi-managed There's not many contractors offering Unifi because there is no cut to be taken out of the hardware cost but I'm sure if you found a good installer in the area that you could just ask them to quote you for the infrastructure wiring and a labour plus cost for screwing the APs to a celing/wall Simon
Chris4 Posted June 13, 2012 Author Posted June 13, 2012 What about Meru? Worth thinking about! Also, I can give you a quote for the Cisco kit and i bet it comes a lot cheaper! We'll have a lot of the kit in stock I've contacted Meru for a quote, thanks. I don't have much idea on which companies are good or bad, this is my first experience. I've contacted you by email for a Cisco quote, thanks. Personally I would avoid the Cisco kit - my experience of it hasn't been great. What are your experiences exactly? we are a Unifi school here and have been very impressed with it so far. if you are not looking to use all the fancy things you'll pay for with the big boys then you should seriously consider this kit. @m25man is the chap to fire any questions at. What exactly do you not get with Unifi that you do with the big companies? @Avalon has contacted me by PM for a quote for Unifi, may contact @m25man too. Unifi is the way to go for a primary You don't need a site survey if your sticking one AP in each teaching area 24 APs at £65 each = £1K5 Each AP needs its own network point so if you don't have a spare one in each class you'd need to budget for that (£20 for a little 8 port switch in the classroom - £100/point at most to get a contractor in run extra wires (£3k max - prob a lot lot less) + few hundred for a central 24 port switch. The Unifi APs are centrally configured but run independently so I'd call them semi-managed There's not many contractors offering Unifi because there is no cut to be taken out of the hardware cost but I'm sure if you found a good installer in the area that you could just ask them to quote you for the infrastructure wiring and a labour plus cost for screwing the APs to a celing/wall Simon Despite the tempting price, and yes we'd need contractors for extra ports (which we need anyway), won't a semi-managed solution be more trouble-some than a completely managed solution offered by others?
glennda Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 My experience of Cisco was in a Large Secondary school - the devices just could seem to get the through put to support enough wireless clients. Another one to look at is Meraki which is a hosted controller. I've just put this into a company with 9 remote offices supporting 20/30 clients per site.
Edu-IT Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 Have you considored Ruckus? Possibly got a couple of places in Leicester you could go look at with Ruckus if you want to drop me a PM.
IrritableTech Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 My team and I have installed three ruckus installs (one secondary, two primary) and one Ubiquiti install. I love the Ruckus gear. It is excellent, however it is also pricey when it is compared to ubiquiti (plus ongoing support costs). I have been playing again this morning with the ubiquiti controller software. It is really straight forward and just works. A fantastic solution for a primary I would suggest. Ruckus is too, but takes a touch more setting up. We are probably looking at completing two more ubiquiti installs in the coming months. I would probably suggest you use some of your budget to pop extra network points all over the place (in the ceiling ideally) and buy ubiquiti. You'll need a pc to run the software on (and a lot of sockets in your racks for the injectors), but I bet you are looking at half the price of the solutions you've already looked at. If looking at Ruckus, speak with @CPLTD or @Net-Ctrl both excellent resellers to work with. We bought our box of three ubiquiti APs from an internet box shipper. 2
Chris4 Posted June 13, 2012 Author Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) My experience of Cisco was in a Large Secondary school - the devices just could seem to get the through put to support enough wireless clients. Another one to look at is Meraki which is a hosted controller. I've just put this into a company with 9 remote offices supporting 20/30 clients per site. Ok, thank you for your input. Sounds like it may have been set up incorrectly, rather than bad hardware. Have you considored Ruckus? Possibly got a couple of places in Leicester you could go look at with Ruckus if you want to drop me a PM. Yes, as I mentioned in my first post I've contacted C-P-LTD regarding Ruckus, however I'll take you up on that offer for more local companies, thank you. Edited June 13, 2012 by Chris4
sulamnart Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 We use Ruckus Wireless and HP Procurve E series here. Good value for money.
glennda Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Ok, thank you for your input. Sounds like it may have been set up incorrectly, rather than bad hardware. each AP into HP Gig Switches with multiple Gig fiber uplinks back to the core (E5406 ZL) (trunked) and Fiber directly into the Controller on its own Vlan. It wasn't that it was completely rubbish but you just couldn't get 30 Laptops in an area with multiple APs downloading profiles together (we had 70 AP's and 95% site coverage). Which in a classroom where you need 30 laptops isn't very good. Edited June 13, 2012 by glennda
Chris4 Posted June 13, 2012 Author Posted June 13, 2012 My team and I have installed three ruckus installs (one secondary, two primary) and one Ubiquiti install. I love the Ruckus gear. It is excellent, however it is also pricey when it is compared to ubiquiti (plus ongoing support costs). I have been playing again this morning with the ubiquiti controller software. It is really straight forward and just works. A fantastic solution for a primary I would suggest. Ruckus is too, but takes a touch more setting up. We are probably looking at completing two more ubiquiti installs in the coming months. I would probably suggest you use some of your budget to pop extra network points all over the place (in the ceiling ideally) and buy ubiquiti. You'll need a pc to run the software on (and a lot of sockets in your racks for the injectors), but I bet you are looking at half the price of the solutions you've already looked at. If looking at Ruckus, speak with @CPLTD or @Net-Ctrl both excellent resellers to work with. We bought our box of three ubiquiti APs from an internet box shipper. Which ever solution is used, it has to be easy to manage. The school doesn't have a full-time paid technician, I'm a placement student and don't have much experience in this area - come September the school will have a new technician of whom will probably have less experience than myself and he'll be the one managing this. I'll have a look to see if I can find a local supplier/installer of Ubiquiti. I've contacted @CPLTD for a Ruckus quote, thanks. Unifi all the way - excellent product - does what you need, once its set up its forgettable (as in you can leave it on and forget its there and it works) ive had upto 40 clients per ap with no bother. We have put over 400 into 30 schools and its not a problem. PM Me if you want to have a chat about it on the phone etc. Ok I may do that, thanks. each AP into HP Gig Switches with multiple Gig fiber uplinks back to the core (E5406 ZL) (trunked) and Fiber directly into the Controller on its own Vlan. It wasn't that it was completely rubbish but you just couldn't get 30 Laptops in an area with multiple APs downloading profiles together (we had 70 AP's and 95% site coverage). Which in a classroom where you need 30 laptops isn't very good. Hmm... okay thanks for letting me know.
Edu-IT Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 Do the rooms already have network points? Power sockets? If not then probably best to go down route of POE.
IrritableTech Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 Which ever solution is used, it has to be easy to manage. The school doesn't have a full-time paid technician, I'm a placement student and don't have much experience in this area - come September the school will have a new technician of whom will probably have less experience than myself and he'll be the one managing this. I'll have a look to see if I can find a local supplier/installer of Ubiquiti. I've contacted @CPLTD for a Ruckus quote, thanks. I agree totally. Both the Ruckus installs I have done in primary sit and run day in day out with no need for anyone to touch them. It looks like Ubiquiti is similar, however if the controller packs up on the ubiquiti network, the APs carry on regardless (assuming you're not using a captive portal). Download the ubiquiti controller software from their website. Load it up an have a play - you don't need any access points. If you do just note... it seems to run only on java v6 not 7 and if you run it on a 64bit machine, you need both java 6 32 & 64 bits installed.
witch Posted June 13, 2012 Posted June 13, 2012 I have Ruckus in one school and Meru in the other - I'm a part-time tech in both and have never had any issues - the systems dont need managing, they just work..
Smee Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 I've got Ruckus in my main primary, 3 buildings, main building on three floors (a big primary school!). Haven't had any problems at all with Ruckus since the day it was installed. Coverage really good even in places you wouldn't expect to get coverage at all. Am in leicestershire if you want to pop round for a look drop me a pm. 1
allen10 Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Hi All, I'm in the early stages of looking at improving network coverage in one of our buildings and having a read of previous posts, Ruckus looks interesting. The building in question is a 1950's solid concrete two story with 4 classrooms, we have 25 laptops over there predominantly used in one classroom with a Netgear AP in there and one in a neighbouring classroom and wireless performance is diabolical! Does anyone with previous Ruckus experience have any idea of rough costings for such an install or any recommendations? I'm also in Leicestershire and in the process of contacting a local company to see if we can trial a Ruckus AP.
Chris4 Posted June 14, 2012 Author Posted June 14, 2012 I have Ruckus in one school and Meru in the other - I'm a part-time tech in both and have never had any issues - the systems dont need managing, they just work.. Sounds great, thanks. I agree totally. Both the Ruckus installs I have done in primary sit and run day in day out with no need for anyone to touch them. It looks like Ubiquiti is similar, however if the controller packs up on the ubiquiti network, the APs carry on regardless (assuming you're not using a captive portal). Download the ubiquiti controller software from their website. Load it up an have a play - you don't need any access points. If you do just note... it seems to run only on java v6 not 7 and if you run it on a 64bit machine, you need both java 6 32 & 64 bits installed. Ok thanks, I'll look into it. I've got Ruckus in my main primary, 3 buildings, main building on three floors (a big primary school!). Haven't had any problems at all with Ruckus since the day it was installed. Coverage really good even in places you wouldn't expect to get coverage at all. Am in leicestershire if you want to pop round for a look drop me a pm. PM coming your way, thanks!
gshaw Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 Ruckus if you want the extra toys and long, proven track record or Unifi if you need the most stuff for the least budget (although not been around as long)
MatthewL Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 We use Aruba kit and cannot fault it, especially as we can turn our AP's to mini access points and connect in from home if need be as long as there is internet.
SimpleSi Posted June 14, 2012 Posted June 14, 2012 especially as we can turn our AP's to mini access points and connect in from home if need be as long as there is internet. Could you explain this a bit more please? Si
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