Cat5e or 6 for gigabit copper network

[Michael]

I think imaging over wireless is a long, long way off. Would probably take days to image a few workstations

 

Wireless is generally a headache now as it's limited in bandwidth comparatively to wired, but as time goes on APs will get faster and will easily be more cost effective than running CAT6a everywhere.

[mjs_mjs]

Wireless is generally a headache now as it's limited in bandwidth comparatively to wired, but as time goes on APs will get faster and will easily be more cost effective than running CAT6a everywhere.

 

But you will still have to run cat5/6/7 to the AP... not forgetting that that 54/108/future speeds wireless bandwidth is shared amongst the devices connected. Where as cables is dedicated from switch to host.

[Michael]

But you will still have to run cat5/6/7 to the AP... not forgetting that that 54/108/future speeds wireless bandwidth is shared amongst the devices connected. Where as cables is dedicated from switch to host.

 

You're right, but you're looking at one or two ports per room at most. CAT6 wouldn't be a problem at this quantity, especially bending around corners whilst keeping it looking tidy.

[fafster]

As GrumbleDook mentions, check out the performance of the NAS. A lot of devices simply don't offer read/write speeds capable of taking advantage of gigabit networks. It may actually be cheaper to buy/build a fileserver that has the performance that you require.

[mjs_mjs]

As GrumbleDook mentions, check out the performance of the NAS. A lot of devices simply don't offer read/write speeds capable of taking advantage of gigabit networks. It may actually be cheaper to buy/build a fileserver that has the performance that you require.

 

i didn't really answer the question; if it's one room with a switch in the room or even next door - there will be little difference between 5e and 6. And i would got for 5e personally (asumming upto say 20m) With cat6/fiber uplinks back to the network. Get a gig switch and spend the money on improving the NAS.

[Cools]

I only ever install cat 6 for system back-bones for 10gbit speeds, 5e is well more then for enough desktops.

[Chunky]

One point that's not been considered:-

 

I'd take good quality cat 5e over cheapo cat 6 every day of the week.

(and a lot of the 5e cabling is marked as "gigabit certified" (despite cat 6 being correct)

Also, depending where you buy it, the price difference isn't much at all, and if you've any real concerns, go 6.

 

 

Chunks

[mjs_mjs]

I actually have to use cat6 cable for something - admittedly it's not computer orientated.

 

For those lampys out there, you can use cat6 for running DMX signals as it's certified up to 250MHz, which i think is the DMX baud rate. I've seen it being posted on professional sites and amateur that you can but only for perminant installs it would seem.

[Anglisc]

Another problem that may present it's self is when installing Cat6 its more prone to damage and it should only be bound together with velcro ties and not be forced at any point due to the cables internal construction.

[TronXP]

I actually have to use cat6 cable for something - admittedly it's not computer orientated.

 

For those lampys out there, you can use cat6 for running DMX signals as it's certified up to 250MHz, which i think is the DMX baud rate. I've seen it being posted on professional sites and amateur that you can but only for perminant installs it would seem.

 

 

We have a botched up cat 5e cable to some moving heads, has been working fine.

 

another place i tech at used to have all its mic sockets wired up using cat 5e from stage - patch panel. again works fine.

[IanT]

So,

 

With new blocks going up in lots of areas, all the new blocks will be having Cat6 installed (in our LEA anyway)

 

All current wiring in the other older blocks is Cat5.

If there are plans to upgrade other rooms to IT rooms in the older blocks should thay have Cat6 even though the rest of the block has Cat5?

 

Can you mix Cat5 and Cat6 in one buliding or does this not work?

Even thought the connectiion between the two blocks if 1gb fibre?

 

I've run a mixture of CAT5e and CAT6 at home to my patch panel........never had any problems.

[mjs_mjs]

We have a botched up cat 5e cable to some moving heads, has been working fine.

 

Botched being the key word. it'll work fine, like people using mic cables for DMX, but it doesn't meet the standard.

 

another place i tech at used to have all its mic sockets wired up using cat 5e from stage - patch panel. again works fine.

 

RANK, i've done this just to see what is was like, didn't like the sound through it.

[mac_shinobi]

[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabit_Ethernet]Gigabit Ethernet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

1000BASE-T (also known as IEEE 802.3ab) is a standard for gigabit Ethernet over copper wiring.

Each 1000BASE-T network segment can be a maximum length of 100 meters (328 feet), and must utilize Category 5 cable at a minimum. Category 5e cable or Category 6 cable may also be used.

Autonegotiation is a requirement for using 1000BASE-T[6] according to Section 28D.5 Extensions required for Clause40 (1000BASE-T).[7] At least clock source has to be negotiated, as one has to be Master and the other Slave.

 

 

1000BASE-T requires all four pairs to be present. If two Gigabit devices are connected through a non-compliant Cat5 cable with two pairs only, negotiation takes place on two pairs only, so the devices successfully choose 'gigabit' as the Highest Common Denominator (HCD), but the link never goes up. Most gigabit physical devices have a specific register to diagnose this behaviour. Some drivers offer an "Ethernet@Wirespeed" option where this situation leads to a slower yet functional connection[8].

[garrya100]

Before you commit to Cat5e, check out some of the newer Cat6 cable. It's not as bulky as the older Cat6, and not as expensive. It also gives you some degree of future proofing your network. While 1Gig to the desktop is not a big advantage yet, that day may come sooner than we realise.

 

P.S DMX512A runs at 250Khz, capacitance is a bigger factor for DMX cables due the rise time and lack of error checking on the receiving device. The standard does not require the transmission of all 512 channel hence the impossibility of any parity/error checking. All you have to do is transmit the start code and then the channel data you wish to send up to 512 channels.

 

(too many years running a production company, now I do it for fun!!)

 

BTW anybody want a Jands Hog 1000, I've got one I no longer require!!

Edited February 19, 2010 by garrya100

[Midget]

You have to weigh up the cost of cat6a install now versus ripping out your cat5e to install cat6a in the future. If you can persuade them to go with cat6a it'll save you hassle in the future, if not, cat5e will surfice, I know some unis who are still on 10mb/s.

 

Also chuck that sc101 toaster in the bin, it's total trash and you are risking losing a lot of work using it because they fail. a lot.

 

an old PC with FreeNAS on would be a safer solution.

[_Adam_]

What a mix of replies. I choose Cat6 due to the per metre cost difference between 5e and 6 being only a small component in running a cable, the fact that the tolerance over the 1Gb ceiling is higher to counter cable damage, and like others I realise it future proofs me a short while longer.

 

Still speaking only gigabit and not looking beyond either is fine for you, chances are your budget will dictate the end decision.

[Rydra]

Something to consider.... Cat5e has been around and in use for what, about 8-10 years? And it's still working.

 

Also consider, that cat5e will handle quite happily up to 1gb of transfer rate, while Cat6 will handle up to 10gb.

 

Something else that they don't frequently advertise.... cat6 cannot run parrallel to mains cables; it causes interferance.... Fun when installing in ICT room trunking, or on trunking to projectors, IWB's, or near pretty much every normal desk in existence!

 

I've just had my entire school rewired (BSF funding for my primary school, thanks to the high schools for taking the flak while I get the money), and they have put cat6 cable to each socket, approximately 215 wired sockets throughout the site. I haven't however invested in 200 cat6 patch cables,.

 

Most schools, do not (yet) need or warrant 1gb to desktop, except those doing bulk video editing.

For a start, for a single mini-suite of 10 workstations, running on 1gb connections, your going to be hard pushed to get a device that can handle moving data at max capacity between them all. Most network backbones between servers, switches etc run at 10gb at most, very few run above this yet.

 

Why does my teacher running a flash program off of the network share required a 1gb network connection, when my NAS is max 1gb connection to the switch, and there are 20 teachers attempting to access that one device?

 

PC with 100/1000mb connection <-> Cat5e rated to 1gb to panel on wall <-> Cat6(a) to switch up to 10gb<-> DC server with 1gb NIC... Add 100 workstations all talking to same said DC.... guess where the bottleneck is?

 

 

The short answer is, by the time we see a NEED for ALL devices to have a 1gb connection at minimum, cat6 will be long gone.

Storage devices such as NAS, and server side NIC's are not yet on the consumer level capable of handling that level of workload, though they are getting there. And half of the network traffic now is to internet connections, again these are not even close to matching the speeds required for most schools; my school is STILL running on a 2mb connection, which I can beat with my mobile broadband service costing me £5 per month!

[_Adam_]

There are other reasons to have 1Gb to the desktop for some schools. We package our applications using App-V and when an app is first launched you want to have it delivered ASAP to the desktop whether it's 40MB or 800MB.

 

And yes there are the video editing files which for us can occur from any PC, as well as other hidden traffic such as processing printing on the desktop which sometimes makes the file a lot larger.

 

One less frequent requirement of gigabit to the desktop is reimaging machines. It's not done often but it is nice to have when we do it.

[SeanVin]

 

...For a start, for a single mini-suite of 10 workstations, running on 1gb connections, your going to be hard pushed to get a device that can handle moving data at max capacity between them all...

 

...The short answer is, by the time we see a NEED for ALL devices to have a 1gb connection at minimum, cat6 will be long gone.

 

Couldn’t agree more. Ethernet is renowned for high latency and difficult to manage QoS. What is more likely to happen is a switch to more efficient protocols for example Fibre Channel over Ethernet or ATA over Ethernet, with high speed optical links between cabinets.

 

There has never been a compelling reason to use Cat 6, it was made redundant on the day somebody worked out how to push 1Gb over Cat5e. The economics of installing it does not make sense, particularly if you have a building full of Cat5e. (IMHO)

[localzuk]

I still can't come up with a valid reason to go to Cat6 for new installs here. We're having a building put up towards the end of the year, and I've been thinking about what type of cable to use. 1Gbit to the desktop is becoming more commonplace now, but I can't see the need yet. Thinking of a need for future 10Gbit to the desktop is just difficult. Looking at our existing network saturation, it isn't the network that determines the speed of things - it is hard disk speed and the like. Our network barely hits 5% utilisation. The only time any of the servers get near their 1Gbit connectivity limits is when they're doing backups.

 

The majority of the school's computing needs for the next 5 or more years is going to be done via Citrix thin clients, so high bandwidth connectivity is just not needed.

 

Can anyone provide me with a reason I should switch to Cat6?

[tmcd35]

 

Can anyone provide me with a reason I should switch to Cat6?

 

Surely it's about future proofing. You don't want to rip-out cabling in 10 years time just because someone cut costs? But you're right, you shouldn't switch to Cat6...

 

[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category_7_cable]Category 7 cable - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

Cat7a all the way - now were did I put those 100gigabit nics?

[localzuk]

Surely it's about future proofing. You don't want to rip-out cabling in 10 years time just because someone cut costs? But you're right, you shouldn't switch to Cat6...

 

Category 7 cable - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Cat7a all the way - now were did I put those 100gigabit nics?

 

Yes its about futureproofing, but there's always a limit. Otherwise we'd be buying Dual quad core Xeon workstations with 64GB ram and RAID arrays of SSD drives... and schools would build spare rooms just in case...

 

The justification I am hearing for Cat6 is that it can support 10Gbit. Great, what uses can anyone see for 10Gbit in 10 years? Gigabit has been around for a quite some time now, and I'm still struggling to find a reason to deploy it to the desktop here. We have it to one area of the school and it makes absolutely no difference to the performance of the machines.

[torledo]

There are other reasons to have 1Gb to the desktop for some schools. We package our applications using App-V and when an app is first launched you want to have it delivered ASAP to the desktop whether it's 40MB or 800MB.

 

And yes there are the video editing files which for us can occur from any PC, as well as other hidden traffic such as processing printing on the desktop which sometimes makes the file a lot larger.

 

One less frequent requirement of gigabit to the desktop is reimaging machines. It's not done often but it is nice to have when we do it.

 

There are plenty of reasons to want and require 1Gb to the desktop today, but existing Cat5e infrastructure should suffice, no ?

[localzuk]

There are plenty of reasons to want and require 1Gb to the desktop today, but existing Cat5e infrastructure should suffice, no ?

 

Precisely. That's why I'm not convinced by Cat6.

[mjs_mjs]

We're running 75 IT workstations on cat5e GIG ethernet. No issues. For our new installs we use cat6. Only because, well no real reason. Just because.