Industrial Action - One Rule for One?

[Hightower]

Just wondering if anybody can answer this question. We've received some documentation from the County on how to act next week with the strike (i.e. who should be at work, what the procedure for signing in is etc etc) and it states that teaching staff will lose 1/365th of their annual salary for each days strike they partake in - unless my maths is way out, this boils down to 1/7th of a weeks salary. Support staff will lose 1/5th of their weekly salary.

 

So, to simplify it, if me and a teacher both get paid £70 per week, and we both strike, the teacher will drop £10 from their wage for each day they strike, where as I would drop £14 for each day I strike.

 

1) Have I read this right?

2) Are my calculations correct?

3) If so, how is this fair?

[teejay]

One minute, that can't be right, teachers are contracted to work 195 days per year, so they should lose 1/195th of their salary.

[Guest Guest]

Type up the relevant bits of the doc and let us have a look. Hopefully you should have just paid more attention in Maths

[Steve21]

So, to simplify it, if me and a teacher both get paid £70 per week, and we both strike, the teacher will drop £10 from their wage for each day they strike, where as I would drop £14 for each day I strike.

 

1) Have I read this right?

2) Are my calculations correct?

3) If so, how is this fair?

 

Unless I'm missing something how do you work that out in terms of 1/7th vs 1/5th?

 

1/365th of (random number) 20k on a teacher vs 1/365th of a (random number) 15k techie is still same amount?

 

Doesn't matter how much you're earning, or what weeks you work, it's still 1/365th per day striking no?

 

Steve

[6Foot2]

This is the advice that went out to our staff:

 

...A High Court judgement in 2004 determined that a day’s pay for a full-time teacher is 1/365^th of their annual salary. For part-time staff, the deduction will be determined by the number of hours they would have worked on a strike day...

[andyrite]

Not sure about it but our teachers have been told 1/260th

[K.C.Leblanc]

Does this mean that if a teacher were to strike on a Friday & a Monday they'd lose 4/365ths?

[Hightower]

Type up the relevant bits of the doc and let us have a look. Hopefully you should have just paid more attention in Maths

 

Attached a screenshot of the relevant bit of the doc.

 

Unless I'm missing something how do you work that out in terms of 1/7th vs 1/5th?

 

1/365th of (random number) 20k on a teacher vs 1/365th of a (random number) 15k techie is still same amount?

 

Doesn't matter how much you're earning, or what weeks you work, it's still 1/365th per day striking no?

 

Steve

 

It says 1/365th of the annual salary, which is the same as 1/7th of a week salary (if it was 1/5th of a weekly salary like it states it is for support staff then it would have been 1/260th of the annual salary)

 

 

[Hokalus]

We've recieved similar information, Teachers loose 1/365th, Support loose 1/260th/

Where employees take part in strike action, this will be classed as a breach of contract for which pay will be deducted on the following basis: -

 

• Support Staff 1/260th of annual salary

• Teachers 1/365th of annual salary

 

For part time employees the deduction of pay will be that which would normally have been earned on that day.

 

This does not seem remotely fair :/

[Heebeejeebee]

Our staff have been told 1/365th as well. Support are not mentioned at all because, as we all know, we don't really exist.

 

HBJB

[PyROm]

We got a copy of a letter sent round from DCC:

 

"Deductions from pay will be made for each day of strike action. For non-teaching staff, the deduction from pay will be equivalent to one day`s pay based on the number of days contracted to work including annual leave. For employees who work variable hours, the deduction will be the pay, including allowances and other payments, normally due for the number of hours of strike action. For any teaching staff, a deduction of pay equivalent to 1/365th of annual pay will be made for everyone who fails to report for work."

 

Doesnt seem exactly fair.

[localzuk]

Teachers have managed, somehow, to wangle one of the best employment contracts available. That is why they have a different rule to support staff.

[Hightower]

Glad to see that it wasn't just my brain frazzled then, so everyone pretty much agrees that's how it reads and it's not exactly fair. Ho hum, have a good weekend everyone when it arrives.

[Guest Guest]

Glad to see that it wasn't just my brain frazzled then, so everyone pretty much agrees that's how it reads and it's not exactly fair. Ho hum, have a good weekend everyone when it arrives.

 

Yep your original calculations were correct.

 

I can't work out how it can be 1/365th. What happens when a teacher is sick on a weekend or a bank holiday, do they have to declare it as a sick day?

[CAM]

I should hope they get only 1/365th back but knowing teacher contracts, they'd probably strike over that too if they didn't get more then us.

[PyROm]

Our ssp forms ask for how many days you were off ill, including non-working days. According to our data manager all teaching staff are also meant to report if they are ill in the holidays and fill in an ssp (its never happened yet tho).

[CAM]

What is reporting illness on your days off meant to accomplish? I'd query that.

[witch]

I think it is because teachers are actually paid all year round(thus the 365) and support are not paid in the holidays or weekends (sometimes if you are term time your annual pay is divided by 12 to give you a salary every month).

The notion that teachers are paid for the weekends is an interesting one!

[6Foot2]

I think it is because teachers are actually paid all year round...

 

Some of us Network Managers/Technicians are also paid all year round. However we do not get the same treatment.

[witch]

That's my point though - you are paid for 5 day weeks and they appear to be paid for 7!

[PiqueABoo]

Teacher is contractually obliged to work extra hours[1], albeit as they see fit, beyond their "in school teaching" quota. AIUI somehow, the open-ended whatever-it-(reasonably)-takes got them the 1/365th.

 

That many of us work extra hours to discharge what we feel are our professional duties is irrelevant, our employees can't do diddly to make us do that via our 9-5 contracts. That some Teachers don't obviously spend many extra hours, that some have been known to get TAs to relieve some of the extra hours workload that is supposed to be theirs alone, that you (or at least I) don't often hear of an useless idle one being hauled up for not doing enough homework... is perhaps another thread.

 

[1] a teacher must work

such reasonable additional hours as may be necessary to enable the

effective discharge of the teacher’s professional duties, including, in

particular planning and preparing courses and lessons; and assessing,

monitoring, recording and reporting on the learning needs, progress

and achievements of assigned pupils.

Edited June 24, 2011 by PiqueABoo

[synaesthesia]

I'd say the same applied for support staff too personally. Therefore I'd say it's not fair - perhaps you should go on stri.. oh, yeah, hang on a minute.

[GrumbleDook]

Teachers are contracted for the whole year and are expected to work during that year for 195 of directed time, of which 190 days will be teaching children and other duties and 5 days will be just other duties. This also comes under the 1265 hours of directed work during that period.

 

Teachers are also expected to work “such reasonable additional hours as may be needed to enable the effective discharge of their professional duties” ... including planning and preparation, marking, recording and reporting ... and where / when this happens is at the discretion of the teacher ... but making sure there is work / life balance.

 

Basically ... the Head can direct their time for a number of things including staying late for parents' evening, Saturday sports fixtures, etc ... but it comes at the cost of because they can theoretically work 365 days a year then they have to have the right to be paid for 365 days (or those out of those 365 they do 'work' in). There are similar comparisons with Police and 'training shifts', the Army and leave entitlement, and a number of others (NASUWT did a good list of examples the other year).

 

As with all these things, some work far more than the time / days mentioned above ... and others don't. Most of my friends, those who are teachers, work far more than the above ... in fact, people I know who are teachers who don't ... they don't generally become friends ... with me or my teacher friends.

[Jose]

how does it work if you take time off unpaid, is it calculated the same way.

[MK-2]

so if you went on strike in support of the teachers, you'd lose more than them because of it. seems fair.

i'm sure when support staff strike for a support related issue the teachers will flock out in support too.........................