Little-Miss Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 We currently have 2 options for our planned install of electronic registration. We get the LA to do it for a cost and 2 days of a tech on site leaving me to get on with other buiness....or i do it myself which i would prefer. Now stupid question, im guessing that it is just a straight forward install of the program (adding users to MIS group, pointing SIMS to Connect.ini etc) on the machine as all the permissions are based on the users login not any sort of program installation.
vikpaw Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 yep. in fact you can do the test on an admin machine, with a teacher login. it's just a sims install on a pc. the server side will need a patch applied for LessonMonitor, but it's no biggie, just the usual routine you need for running updates (no small task, sole access etc.), but easily doable. 1
Little-Miss Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Ok, how does SIMS licensing work? Is SIMS a site license so we're free to install it as many times as we want? Lesson Monitor is this something we need to purchase? Sorry about the daft questions, ive had very little to do with the program up until now (recently setting up InTouch etc).
timbo343 Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) Yeah, basically you are right... SIMS is ok to install on however many machines you want BUT it is all down to your SQL license. If you license your SQL via per physical processor then you can install on how ever many machines you like... but if you license your SQL via CAL (can be more expensive) then you can only install it on however many CAL licenses you have. As for lesson monitor, yes you will need to purchase it and it is a simple install to do, its only a small patch. I see your using intouch?? I dont want to put a spanner in the works, but we found that Capita was charging a fortune for intouch, we decided to go with teachers2parents. Edited January 8, 2011 by timbo343 1
Little-Miss Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Yeah. I think there may have been better out there. I was never consulted and one day got told that we were having InTouch setup and they needed me to do the technical bits. Admin kinda do their own thing and rely on the LA for support, which is fine by me, 5 computers i dont have to worry about and we do pay a small fortune for the support. As SIMS is now being installed onto my Curric machines im going to have to start having more involvment now. Im a bit confused now. We had a quote that was for the 21 machines, but it never included any mention of licenses. Is it possible that there is an agreement already setup with Capita and our LA?
timbo343 Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 I dont know then. I dont understand why you have had a quote for 21 machines, unless you are licensed per machine with regards to the SQL server therefore you have to buy more licenses. All i know is that we pay about £260 a year for 1 SQL process license as it's much cheaper to do it that way. You might want to go back to whoever gave you that quote and find out why they have quoted those 21 machines. Like said, all you are paying for is an icon on the tool bar which gives you access to take the register. I seem to remember a figure of £1500 been mentioned. Then the fun really starts, as you put sims in the classroom, teachers im sure will forget to save (preserve) the register and your admin team will have a nice job of chasing the staff.
vikpaw Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) As advice above, it's the sql access you pay for, however in many primaries it's set up per seat as it's cheaper for small numbers. As you expand, it might be worth comparing cost for putting it on all machines as to whether per proc is better. What I found at some of my old primaries also, was that due to lack of in-house support, they were charged to install sims on to each machine, and it works out extortionate. There is no need for it. An sql cal should only be a few quid if that is what you need. Usually what you need to pay for is the licence, and up front maintenance, and usually they stipulate that you also buy some training at the same time, in order that they agree to support you. I'd ask for a breakdown of the costs, and ask to be kept in the loop with decisions so you can 'plan ahead' and deal with any 'conflicts' that may arise - it's a reasonable request. With an LA deal, they may licence sims for you and other schools in bulk, then charge you a reduced fee, dont know how it would work with dinner money. Edited January 9, 2011 by vikpaw typo 1
PhilNeal Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 It sounds to me as if you are being quoted for time to install SIMS on 21 machines. To be frank 2 days seems excessive and with SOLUS3 you can do it from an office at city hall. 1
Little-Miss Posted January 9, 2011 Author Posted January 9, 2011 Thats what im thinking Phil. Im guessing as there wasnt any mention of licenses on the quote that we must be part of an LA deal. We also got told Dinner Money wasnt going to cost us anymore so maybe that included too...... *sigh* got some investigating to do havent i! lol wont please the LA though cus they obviously want the money. But id much rather put that towards the cashless system we want installed!
Little-Miss Posted January 9, 2011 Author Posted January 9, 2011 Skimming through the quote it is purely installation....
steve Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 One thing to note is each teacher will be better off having an individual SIMS login linked to their personnel record. That way when they logon to SIMS they can access registers directly from the SIMS Homepage. 1
vikpaw Posted January 9, 2011 Posted January 9, 2011 Typical support day is 6 hours. So that's 12 hours to install 21 machines!! That's just over half an hour per machine to just hit simsinst.exe then 'next' through the wizard. The only potential complication could be permissions on the box, but i doubt they will plan ahead for that, they'll do it as admin. Whoever ends up doing the work Little-miss, it'll be worth testing the upgrade process, because that's normally a large hurdle on client side. The install will be easy, but when SIMS is upgraded you want to be sure the users suffer as little as possible on next run. Though as @PhilNeal said if you can get SOLUS3 working that will sort that out. I'd rather spend the money on them getting SOLUS working for you then you can deploy to where you want rather than someone sitting at 21 boxes over 2 days! They'll probably be a whizz at Minesweeper after all that time 2
Little-Miss Posted January 10, 2011 Author Posted January 10, 2011 Ok, when i log into SIMS on my workstation i have the option to take a register, obviously there is no register there as im guessing im not associated with a class but could be wrong. Does this mean we have Lesson Monitor already on the system or is this normal behaviour?
vikpaw Posted January 10, 2011 Posted January 10, 2011 (edited) You can always take a register, because attendance is built into the core i think...? In fact most primaries don't need lesson monitor if all you want to do is take the statutory attendance am/pm. We only had attendance for a very long time, when we moved to using lesson monitor, the options were already there but it just needed a licence patch to be applied. If i'm wrong and the attendance module is an exta add on, which i doubt it would be as it's statutory, then you might need a patch to get that working. To test go to take register icon and then choose another teacher by clicking on the binoculars, then you can view someone elses register. But even then, until things are setup, you may not see much. pastoral structure needs to be okay, timetable setup if using lesson monitor, also from the tools | setups menu there are attendance/lesson monitor specific configs to sort out to make sure it is all as you want it. EDIT: get hold of the manual, there's a nice mammoth read, especially all the built in reports. Edited January 10, 2011 by vikpaw addition 1
Little-Miss Posted January 10, 2011 Author Posted January 10, 2011 Ah! So i can take a register for AM/PM and Lesson Monitor is completely different! Excellent. There does seem to be an issue with updates if i click solus so thats something i need to have a look at. Thank you!
Little-Miss Posted January 11, 2011 Author Posted January 11, 2011 Ok, as you suggested, if i tried to use SOLUS it failed. So i added the line "SIMSSetupsDirectory=S:\SIMS\Setups" as suggested via the capita site and it started installing patches and now SOLUS now loads. So....im hopefully getting somewhere. So can SOLUS be used to install SIMS or is it just updates?
GREED Posted January 11, 2011 Posted January 11, 2011 I believe the plan was for SOLUS 3 part 2 to be able to deploy SIMS workstation from the interface.
ChrisJ Posted January 12, 2011 Posted January 12, 2011 So can SOLUS be used to install SIMS or is it just updates? Not with the version you're running. Not sure of the current status of SOLUS3 with Birmingham. Easy enough to install sims on a classroom workstation, though I have seen a few schools with issues after sql2008 migrations. But that shouldn't be too much of a concern since pretty much all of the schools have been done now, so I'll assume you're in that list
Vstar Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 to just hit simsinst.exe then 'next' through the wizard Just what I was looking for! Why does SIMS have eight programs that could install it?
Sivadam Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 SOLUS3 version 3.2.74 has been available for a couple of weeks or more!
ChrisJ Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 Skimming through the quote it is purely installation.... It's worth noting the installation usually covers schools where the classroom workstations are unable to see the admin domain and the mapped S:\ drive so often covers this process too (alongside the clicking Next, Next Next ) 1
Little-Miss Posted January 13, 2011 Author Posted January 13, 2011 lol no criticism meant there. I'm usually quite happy with Link2ICT's service! Just felt the cost was a little steep!
Gatt Posted January 13, 2011 Posted January 13, 2011 I created a batch file that silently installs sims during MDT/SCCM Deployment, and also copies a pre-configured Connect.ini and SIMS.ini file to the PC
GREED Posted January 14, 2011 Posted January 14, 2011 Just what I was looking for! Why does SIMS have eight programs that could install it? SIMSINST.exe is the package installer, the other .exe files are the individual components. The workstation component is SIMSApplicationSetup.exe
mac_shinobi Posted January 14, 2011 Posted January 14, 2011 Not sure if it is still the same - just saw a few mentions of permissions for sims and re call that in the sims directory where all the installation files and everything else is there are a number of bat files ( one of which is called simsperm.bat ) which if and when ran on the local client machine should rectify all the permissions that are required which you run after installing sims ( if memory serves me right ) All the stuff is in the adobe pdf guides. Not sure how much use this will be but just my $0.02
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