Primary sole tech/secondary support tech - which to choose?

[znova]

Hello,

 

Would you prefer to be the sole support of several Primaries or a junior tech at a secondary school?

 

As a part of my degree I have to go on a placement. My choice is either to stay at the school I currently support and add a few feeder schools to my list or to go for a specific placement job at a secondary school. So far in my career I have always done the solitary support and so the secondary schools' job appeals because it might be nice to see things done differently and learn. On the other hand, the Primaries do have an advantage in shorter hours/flexible working time; the secondary placement is pretty much set(full time, doesn't work that well around the kids). Money doesn't come into the equation.

 

Which would be better for the experience?

 

Bearing in mind when I finish my degree I actually want to do the job I do now - part-time hours just to occupy the brain (and I guess to prove to myself I can do something well) - not a money-spinning career working all hours.

 

AAAAAAHHHHHH!

 

Which would you rather do and why?

[Jiser]

Yo I did kinda same thing as you though I had a year out in the 'real world', then worked part time in an Infant and Junior school for a year half in final year of uni and then a few months after. Its nice to be the sole tech, be the person everyone comes to, 'respected', get to make decisions, meet lots of people etc.

 

However I made the move to Secondary for lots of reasons and if you want to get more experience and learn more thats your best bet. Also as a team member you can learn of them and experience team working which seems to be so important nowa days.

 

IMO you should definitely move to Secondary even if the money is worse and you are at a Junior level, just for the exposure to new things, experience and working within a team. It doesn't have to be for ever either. There is a big difference between levels of schools, no.1 there many times the size.

 

What looks better on the CV an admin of St.Clements Juniors with 40 computers or admin of St.Andrews Secondary School with 600 + computers and associated things such as Exchange server etc etc. Anyway you probably get my point.

Edited June 3, 2009 by Jiser

[witch]

IMO you should definitely move to Secondary even if the money is worse and you are at a Junior level, just for the exposure to new things, experience and working within a team. It doesn't have to be for ever either.

What looks better on the CV an admin of St.Clements Juniors with 40 computers or admin of St.Andrews Secondary School with 600 + computers and associated things such as Exchange server etc etc. Anyway you probably get my point.

 

 

As the person who took said job after Jiser moved on, I actually agree that exposure in a secondary school would be a good idea if you haven't had that...

 

But I DON'T agree about the '40 computers versus 600 computers' argument.

 

Yes I only look after 100-odd machines but I am TOTALLY responsible for the network and can put all that experience in my CV. I am currently getting involved with specifying and installing the VLE, as well as deciding what sort of new server I need and how the whole network is to be sorted out in the future.

I know some secondary school techs who never have any input or involvement in, for example, AD or Group Policy as the more senior members of the team do all that.

So it all comes down to whether you think you will learn new things and get something out of the move - if you do, then do it - it certainly won't harm your chances of going back to being a primary tech at a later date.

If you don't or can't due to other commitments, then continue in your current positions but perhaps speak to the techs at the secondary schools in the area - they may be happy to let you come and see how and what they do at a time convenient to you.

This is how I learn - I have managed, with the help of Edugeek and other contacts, to create a large support network of people who are (bless them) happy to help me and explain things I don't understand

Edited June 3, 2009 by witch

[Jiser]

You want inspiration look at this link: My First Year In IT - CertForums

 

He achieved a hell of allot in a year.

[contink]

Sole tech in a number of primaries can be much more stressful than being part of a team in a Secondary.

 

I took a few years to get comfortable enough to expand past my one initial primary and only after a lot of time spent building up experience. Of course this place didn't exist then.

 

Overall I think the key thing is that in a primary you will be looking at multiple roles (much the same way teaching is in Primary) from toner changing all the way up to server management, AD maintenance and more. It's quite a baptism of fire plus as it's a placement, there's only so much you can hope to achieve as many things in Primary are long term 3 year+ plans before you see real progress.

 

Just some thoughts for you.

[znova]

Yeah, I thought I fancied a bit of a change.

 

To be honest I've only just caught up with the backlog of Must-do things as there was a gap between technicians (and the previous tech was a mum of one of the kids in school; the head admitted to me she was not that IT-savvy ). Right now I'm testing some of the group policies (mess, just as well kids didn't find out the things they could do), clearing up the server and next on my to-do-list is some ghosting software. If I am to leave then might as well leave the network in a good shape.

 

There are a few secondary placements which are looming but I haven't applied for yet; however, I am now competing for jobs with students who didn't manage to get in anywhere else so might be a bit easier.

 

Jiser, money doesn't come into it. In fact I think some of the secondary placements are a bit better paid than what would be the sum of potential Primary jobs. It's just that I don't know if I want to commit to full-time work. I used to do this as a hobby, but it's grown a bit and I miss being a mum! I guess I'm not your typical IT tech.

 

Thanks for the input and keep it coming in!

[witch]

Yeah, I thought I fancied a bit of a change.

Jiser, money doesn't come into it. In fact I think some of the secondary placements are a bit better paid than what would be the sum of potential Primary jobs. It's just that I don't know if I want to commit to full-time work. I used to do this as a hobby, but it's grown a bit and I miss being a mum! I guess I'm not your typical IT tech.

 

You might not be typical but there are some of us on here who work part-time and combine it with childcare(and we are NOT all women!). That is why I suggested staying part-time at a primary but liasing with the local high school so that you can learn more without being committed to full-time work. I don't know how it is where you are, but here the school at the top of each pyramid has a requirement to help those further down. Generally speaking, people like us are a helpful lot!

Edited June 4, 2009 by witch

[mossj]

You want inspiration look at this link: My First Year In IT - CertForums

 

He achieved a hell of allot in a year.

 

TBH he sounds like a stuck up d*ck, a d*ck that did well but a d*ck all the same

 

I knew from the moment I had finished my initial training, that I was different to the normal bread of Helpdesk personnel. Rather than spending my time surfing the web, I had my head in a book reading and learning.

 

All helpdesk personnel just surf the web all day ?!?

 

P.S posting in my break before you comment!

[elsiegee40]

Yeah, I thought I fancied a bit of a change.

 

To be honest I've only just caught up with the backlog of Must-do things as there was a gap between technicians (and the previous tech was a mum of one of the kids in school; the head admitted to me she was not that IT-savvy ). Right now I'm testing some of the group policies (mess, just as well kids didn't find out the things they could do), clearing up the server and next on my to-do-list is some ghosting software. If I am to leave then might as well leave the network in a good shape.

 

There are a few secondary placements which are looming but I haven't applied for yet; however, I am now competing for jobs with students who didn't manage to get in anywhere else so might be a bit easier.

 

Jiser, money doesn't come into it. In fact I think some of the secondary placements are a bit better paid than what would be the sum of potential Primary jobs. It's just that I don't know if I want to commit to full-time work. I used to do this as a hobby, but it's grown a bit and I miss being a mum! I guess I'm not your typical IT tech.

 

Thanks for the input and keep it coming in!

 

zdenka, I think witch has said most of it... there are many parents on here working at schools; juggling the kids and our networks... and more mums than you might think! And as witch said, most primary techs are not just mums looking to fill their time. I agree whole-heartedly with her about the experience gained by being the only one in charge of a network. (Not that that's unusual; there is a rumour that witch, chrrb, Andie and I are actually quads living in different parts of the country!)

 

I'm in the same boat at my school... on my own, THE tech/network manager/ 'whatever job title happens to suit'... and my network only has 40 PCs (I'm part-time) The problems, decisions and challenges are the same no matter how many machines you have.

 

I learn by talking to the network of other techs I know either locally or on edugeek. Like witch, I'm not exactly fresh out of uni and have worked in industry for many years - nights and on-call weren't exactly compatible with my young family which is when I decided that a lifestyle and job change were necessary. If you want to widen your experience, adding schools to your portfolio will do the trick. No two are the same.

 

Sometimes, I detect a hint of superiority in one or two of the (usually younger) secondary techs who seem to think that the primary sector is less challenging. It isn't... it's just different! Being in sole charge of one or more small networks gives you the opportunity to do everything on both the hardware and software side; more schools will give you wider experience of different software and hardware. Being part of a team at a secondary can give you all that in one place, but there is the risk of you being restricted in the types of work you do as team-members may tend to specialise in the areas they deal with.

 

If you want to learn more about what's going on in your local secondaries, you always have the option of picking up the phone and asking to visit. I'm spending the day at one on Monday, picking brains and generally finding out what they are up to.

Edited June 4, 2009 by elsiegee40
forgot Andie!

[witch]

(Not that that's unusual; there is a rumour that witch, chrrb and I are actually triplets living in different parts of the country!)

 

And Andie - don't forget Andie!

 

 

 

Sometimes, I detect a hint of superiority in one or two of the (usually younger) secondary techs who seem to think that the primary sector is less challenging. It isn't... it's just different! Being in sole charge of one or more small networks gives you the opportunity to do everything on both the hardware and software side; more schools will give you wider experience of different software and hardware. Being part of a team at a secondary can give you all that in one place, but there is the risk of you being restricted in the types of work you do as team-members may tend to specialise in the areas they deal with.

 

I agree - I do think that sometimes they forget that we have to do everything. My particular problem is that I find it hard to learn without having someone there to go through it with me so that I can ask questions, and I am usually too worried about breaking something to have to much of a fiddle with my system myself. This is why I have tried to forge links with the pyramid schools, and now I have got involved with a local Network Manager's group (set up by Adams_dad) and that will help.

I am in a somewhat different position as well because one of the schools I work in goes up to Year 8 so I do have involvement with senior school things - in fact the LA deem us a secondary school anyway.

[elsiegee40]

And Andie - don't forget Andie!

 

Whoops - she's been added! Sorry!

 

My particular problem is that I find it hard to learn without having someone there to go through it with me so that I can ask questions, and I am usually too worried about breaking something to have to much of a fiddle with my system myself.

 

Snap... that's where edugeek has been my lifeline. When my local saviours aren't available... there's always someone on here!

Edited June 4, 2009 by elsiegee40

[znova]

Well a visit to a placement officer at uni put a bit of a spanner in the works. Placement has to be full-time for at least 9 months; if I work in school during from Sep to July, they will accept 25 hours a week. Which pretty much rules out the Primaries as I'm not going to be able to get as many hours as that each week ( I work 6 with possible 10 more).

 

There is another snag; we have to do a Professional development module during the placement which requires a line manager in the school to set goals for me, monitor progress, meet with uni tutors AND go to a full-day meeting at university. I can just about see how many schools will line up to take me with this baggage! Anyway, Primary school with a line manager?

 

AND I read the secondary school placement role descriptions: Maintanance of IT equipment, asset register, lending digital equipment, set it up, blah blah blah - basically general dogsbody not allowed anywhere near their server. Some of the other placements has dissapeared because - surprise surprise - they've taken on this year's placement student full-time and they'll finish their degree part-time.

 

Flipping great! Might have to be a general dogsbody for a year because I don't want to throw away 2 years of uni.

[witch]

Sorry to hear about all that - but it would still be worth looking at primaries - I work in two schools for a total of 30 hours. I don't have a line manager at one, but I do at the other, albeit the ICT co-ordinator, and I know that he would be happy to do the goal settings etc, even though he would have to ask me for the details as he isn't tremendously technical!

 

Are you doing your degree part-time? - If not, could you? Might take longer but you could work the hours you want.

Can you manage to work full-time? - I could now but I think my children are older than yours. It would be difficult to do a boring general dogsbody role for more hours than you really want, but I suppose you don't seem to have a lot of options ATM

[AngryTechnician]

There is another snag; we have to do a Professional development module during the placement which requires a line manager in the school to set goals for me, monitor progress, meet with uni tutors AND go to a full-day meeting at university. I can just about see how many schools will line up to take me with this baggage!

Try to find a school that currently takes PGCE students on a regular basis. They will have procedures and people in place to do all that and more due to the PGCE requirements; your requirements will be a little light refreshment for them!

[SimpleSi]

Hi Zendka

 

If money isn't the issue, then I'd recommend primary working as it is more a vocation than a job.

 

The drawback is, that most of your school head teachers will not realise that they need much more support than they are prepared to pay for

 

If your are able to be supportive to people who sometimes don't know much about IT and work on a budget of close to zero then its good!

 

You can get more involved with teaching children about IT which can be very rewarding.

 

Secondary technician work can be very boring if your network manager doesn't give you the freedom to experiment - in primaries, it is the end result that counts and how you get there doesn't normally matter.

 

At technician level, if you come to work to do your job and go home then secondary would generally suit you more.

 

Working in a good secondary with a good network manager can be very rewarding also.

 

regards

 

Simon

[znova]

I can see that most posts favour Primaries!

 

Personally I'd rather do a job I enjoy - another Primary part-time job's come up! - than a mundane one.

 

You know what, I think I am going to be a rebel and tell the uni placement team to stuff it! I will speak to my headmistress tomorrow about feeder schools and please please since she doesn't want me to go will she be my line manager. Although we do have an ICT coordinator so he might get landed with it.

 

yeah, I guess I wouldn't mind going somewhere where they will actually let you do something usefull but checking equipment registers and setting up stuff is not exactly my dream job. Funnily enough, the new job is a Primary right next door to the boring secondary above, you get to run the network and get paid almost double (in proportion to the hours).

 

Anyway, some of my uni mates have gone on to set up their own business, so who's going be their line manager then? I feel a fight coming on!!!

 

They'll probably think - not her again!!! I once got excluded from a lecture for being slightly late - they had a dogsbody on a door. I played merry hell and told the head of computing exactly what I thought of their support for mature students who have to arrange childcare etc. etc. He actually appologized - usual phrases "students first but on this occasion we failed..blah blah". The had reps from industry doing a presentation so wanted to create a good impression, stuff the students!!!

 

Anyway, thanks for your comments and wish me luck!!!

[somabc]

TBH he sounds like a stuck up d*ck, a d*ck that did well but a d*ck all the same

 

That sounds a bit harsh, they may just be quite young and have a lot of erm ambition, it may not be a terminal case of d*ckness.

 

This is quite good though - "different to the normal bread of Helpdesk personnel"

 

If you are going to say you are better than somebody do not make a mistake when you say it, rather lessens the effect. What he has achieved in a year is very good but not exceptional. Many of us if we were list our achievements and responsibilities could point to a similar or better story and I still believe passing certificates is more a matter of time and money. Although you could make the point that people who would seek out a community such as edugeek/certforums are already likely to be fairly committed to IT and have the drive and resources to push up the ladder so there is some self selection bias. The fundamental point of the story is that hard work and determination DO pay off and for that he should be congratulated.

 

All helpdesk personnel just surf the web all day ?!?

 

Yes they do, or would do if given the chance. However many people can surf the web and do their job which is fine by me. We should measure by results not how long someone spends staring at a helpdesk system waiting for another ticket to come through.

Edited June 4, 2009 by somabc

[contink]

One thing that you could think about doing is perhaps finding a secondary that is willing to take you on to provide support for their feeder Primaries. That way you would get the best of both worlds.. Support from a team, time in Primaries and an opportunity to lean on either side as required.

 

If you want just Primaries you could potentially look at a cluster and see if a small group of schools would band together to provide the necessary support and funding to provide the necessary hours.

 

Word of warning though... Every single one of my Primary schools are cutting back on finances as the budget just is not the same at all, on any fronts. Redundancies and more are being considered so don't put all your eggs in one basket and hope it'll work... Have a couple of plan B's just in case.

 

Good luck with it

[chrbb]

I think elsiegee and witch have said everything I could have said, (great minds think alike etc etc...)

I now only work in one primary and like most primary techs 'do a bit of everything', I've got a local company that have done work for us that I can call if desperate but edugeek, google and not rushing in too quickly to change things seem to be the best plan!

I think we may be in the same area, are you with county or city?

[apoth0r]

You can learn a lot from being in a team in a secondary, things you can take into the primaries if/when you decide to slot into that field. Nothing like talking with others about the subject areas you are passionate about