dyoung5 Posted September 5, 2008 Posted September 5, 2008 Hi guys, I've been using this forum for a while, and its great! This is the first time I've got round to posting something, but I hope to keep it up now. Basically, we were looking at virtual servers, and decided to implement a basic system over the summer. We are using the now-free VMware ESXi server, hosting a few Windows servers and a Linux LAMP server (the one on virtual appliances is v-easy to setup). I'm loving the VMware software, its all so easy, but the only thing I can't figure out how to do is backup the vmx's and vmdk's. We use Symantec Backup exec 12, and don't want to have to install an agent on each virtual machine (£200+ per machine, not fun!). Does anyone have any experience with this and can you advise please? Thanks in advance, David
pete Posted September 5, 2008 Posted September 5, 2008 I assume you're using local disks, rather than NFS? How large are your vms?
dyoung5 Posted September 5, 2008 Author Posted September 5, 2008 I'm using a local RAID array. The VMs are generally less than 20gb each at the moment. We do have a server capable of hosting NFS shares and iSCSI arrays, but I dont want to use that as the main storage for VMs. David
tmcd35 Posted September 5, 2008 Posted September 5, 2008 I'll second esXpress, use the freebie version here.
dyoung5 Posted September 5, 2008 Author Posted September 5, 2008 Thanks for that recommendation. I've looked on the website, and it doesn't seem to support ESXi, only ESX. Am I right in thinking it needs to be installed via the service console (which ESXi doesn't have)? David
Guest Guest Posted October 8, 2008 Posted October 8, 2008 See this thread http://www.edugeek.net/forums/thin-client-virtual-machines/24946-esxi-backup-solution.html
dodben Posted December 10, 2008 Posted December 10, 2008 We used a product call iBac VIP from Idealstor to backup our VMs. We have 2 ESXi hosts and it is working pretty well. Info is below if interested. VMware Backup – iBac Virtual Infrastructure Proxy
Butuz Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 We do have a server capable of hosting NFS shares and iSCSI arrays, but I dont want to use that as the main storage for VMs. David But that's the best bit about using ESXi - if you use an iSCSI storage server to host all of the VM's - then if your physical vmaware server actually fails, you can simply use any old spare server (or god forbid workstation if your desperate), install ESXi on the server, hook it up to the iSCSI box and then right click on all your VM's and re-import them. That way you can get all your VM's back up in 30 mins or so. If your using local storage and your physical server dies - what are you going to do then? You have to get your physical server repaired before you can get your VM's back up - this will take longer than 30 mins - I garuntee! Thanks for that recommendation. I've looked on the website, and it doesn't seem to support ESXi, only ESX. Am I right in thinking it needs to be installed via the service console (which ESXi doesn't have)? David The ESXi version is on the way. Cant wait for it meself! Butuz
Theblacksheep Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 But that's the best bit about using ESXi - if you use an iSCSI storage server to host all of the VM's - then if your physical vmaware server actually fails, you can simply use any old spare server (or god forbid workstation if your desperate), install ESXi on the server, hook it up to the iSCSI box and then right click on all your VM's and re-import them. That way you can get all your VM's back up in 30 mins or so. Although there are alot of hardware restrictions for ESXi, most normal workstations wont work nor will many old server. Luckily our RM Xeons can have ESXi... FYI: VMware View (new) starter pack with 10 view licences, web based VM logins and has V3 with consolodated backup for about £700 to education.
plexer Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 VMWare View is for delivering virtualised desktops though? Ben
dyoung5 Posted December 11, 2008 Author Posted December 11, 2008 But that's the best bit about using ESXi - if you use an iSCSI storage server to host all of the VM's - then if your physical vmaware server actually fails, you can simply use any old spare server (or god forbid workstation if your desperate), install ESXi on the server, hook it up to the iSCSI box and then right click on all your VM's and re-import them. That way you can get all your VM's back up in 30 mins or so. Butuz There are a few reasons why I dont want to have the main datastore on the storage server: The server is Windows and has 3rd party software loaded. I don't want to start a big debate, but with a much lower footprint and no extra software, ESXi will be more stable. We sometimes need to reboot it for updates, etc. This would mean having to shut down our VM server as well. It only has SATA disks, whereas our VM server has SAS disks. I have found a script, which I run to snap the VMs and backup the snaps. But for most of the critical servers I have installed Backup Exec agents because of specific software, i.e. SQL server. David
Theblacksheep Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 (edited) VMWare View is for delivering virtualised desktops though? Yep, View is... but the View starter pack has: 1 V3 Enterprise licence (HA, VMFS, vSMP, DRS) 1 VirtualCenter Foundation (3 V3 servers) Virtual Desktop Manager 3.0 View Composer ThinApp 4 licensing for 10 desktop VM's. Use the full V3 licence as you want. Edited December 11, 2008 by Theblacksheep
dhicks Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 if you use an iSCSI storage server to host all of the VM's - then if your physical vmaware server actually fails, you can simply use any old spare server And if your iSCSI storage server fails... -- David Hicks
dyoung5 Posted December 11, 2008 Author Posted December 11, 2008 And if your iSCSI storage server fails... My thinking exactly. I'm guessing it wouldn't be as risky if we had a propper iSCSI SAN, as they generally have redundant PSUs, controllers, etc. and are more appliance based with less to go wrong right? Yep, View is... but the View starter pack has: 1 V3 Enterprise licence (HA, VMFS, vSMP, DRS) 1 VirtualCenter Foundation (3 V3 servers) Virtual Desktop Manager 3.0 View Composer ThinApp 4 licensing for 10 desktop VM's. Use the full V3 licence as you want. Where did you buy your licenses? Thanks, David
dhicks Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 I'm guessing it wouldn't be as risky if we had a propper iSCSI SAN, as they generally have redundant PSUs, controllers, etc. and are more appliance based with less to go wrong right? True, although bear in mind that any component that does fail is going to be more expensive to replace - you'll have to get a specific power supply to fit your particular SAN appliance. Where did you buy your licenses? Don't do it, use Xen, it's free... -- David Hicks
Butuz Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 Although there are alot of hardware restrictions for ESXi, most normal workstations wont work nor will many old server. Luckily our RM Xeons can have ESXi.... Are you sure? I have not come across any. I have my test ESXi server running on a crappy 3 year old RM P4 3.6 single core Workstation with 2 gig ram? Butuz
Butuz Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 There are a few reasons why I dont want to have the main datastore on the storage server: The server is Windows and has 3rd party software loaded. I don't want to start a big debate, but with a much lower footprint and no extra software, ESXi will be more stable. We sometimes need to reboot it for updates, etc. This would mean having to shut down our VM server as well. It only has SATA disks, whereas our VM server has SAS disks. I have found a script, which I run to snap the VMs and backup the snaps. But for most of the critical servers I have installed Backup Exec agents because of specific software, i.e. SQL server. David Agree with you - the iSCSI server needs to be a dedicated appliance to VMWare rather than a standard Windows server with an add on iSCSI initiator. Much much more reliable. Agree about SATA/SAS too, I would only use SATA disks for back up use or testing, I would stick to SAS disks for a production server. Butuz 1
Butuz Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 And if your iSCSI storage server fails... -- David Hicks Then it's no different to if your local storage had failed. Except that your local storage is tied in to the physical server's raid card, wheras the iSCSI storage is not tied to any server. A big benefit in my eyes. It's the HDD's that are 99% most likely to fail, as long as your using good reliable SAS drives (not Deathstar's) and are using Raid 5 with hotspare you should get 99%+ uptime. You want to be using "enterprise" class hardware if your virtualising your whole network - anything by HP/DELL/IBM/Adaptec should be ultra fast and reliable. If your basing your SAN on some kind of Buffalo or Netgear jobby then I guess you'd better prepare for downtime? My thinking exactly. I'm guessing it wouldn't be as risky if we had a propper iSCSI SAN, as they generally have redundant PSUs, controllers, etc. and are more appliance based with less to go wrong right? Thanks, David Yep. Redundant PSU, Redundant interface's, redundant hard drives. Couple that with a same day on site warranty and you should be laughing.
Theblacksheep Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 Are you sure? I have not come across any. I have my test ESXi server running on a crappy 3 year old RM P4 3.6 single core Workstation with 2 gig ram? Heres the ESXi hardware compatability guide: http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi35_systems_guide.pdf Still, if you've got it working on the P4, thats quality!
Butuz Posted December 11, 2008 Posted December 11, 2008 Heres the ESXi hardware compatability guide: http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi35_systems_guide.pdf Still, if you've got it working on the P4, thats quality! Ah - I never read the hardware compatibility guide so I guess the guide doesnt apply Have you tried the latest version? ESXi 3.5 seems to install on any workstation I try it on, it also doesnt sem bothered what storage you use, SATA, SAS, SCSI, etc. I tried an older version quite a long time ago and it was very restricted it would only run on SCSI drives etc. Butuz
Sandman Posted May 21, 2009 Posted May 21, 2009 ESXi 3.5 seems to install on any workstation I try it on, it also doesnt sem bothered what storage you use, SATA, SAS, SCSI, etc. Agree. Never had any issues here
OverWorked Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 Does EsXpress backup EXSi 4? I've looked on the website but can't see that it does.
JamieM Posted July 22, 2009 Posted July 22, 2009 Hi David Here is another suggestion for you, I been using lately a mirrored iSCSI target call StarWind, it covers ESXi and every fig else, cheek it Firs I suggest test the trial starwindsoftware.com/starwind-enterprise-server
mrmace69 Posted August 11, 2009 Posted August 11, 2009 Hello. This tool is also free and it will backup ESXi. Veeam FastSCP 3.0 for VMware ESX / ESXi - VMware file Management.
albertwt Posted August 19, 2009 Posted August 19, 2009 Yes, you can use VCB (VMWare Consolidated Backup) with Backup Exec 12.5 assuming you get the VMWare vSphere 4 Essentials license which comes with the following: 1. vCenter Mgmt Server 4 2. 3x ESX(i) licenses
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