Chromebooks are being asked for - I'm a total newbie, help!

[L3OUGH]

Hi everyone,

 

A new member of staff started at a primary school I look after. He's been previously based at a school that had nothing but Chromebooks and he swore by them.

 

The primary I look after is only small, so hasn't dabbled in Chromebooks. We have laptops and a small selection of iPads currently. The new guy is so eager to get Chromebooks he's already pursuing funding grants to get multiple class sets.

 

I need the down low from techies that have been using these, are they worth looking at?! I have done some quick research and found:

 

- They can be incorporated with AD using Google Enterprise licenses'? Which appears to be an annually paid for service? Is it free for schools maybe?

- It's important to make sure we get Chromebooks that will continue to be supported for a few years. (https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/6220366?hl=en)

- They appear to be the way forward? But from someone who has had 0 experience or even the need to look, I'm skeptical.

 

Do you tend to incorporate them with your Windows Domains or use them standalone on the Wi-Fi?

 

Any help/advice is welcome.

 

Thanks as always

L3

[DrBeaker]

We first had Samsung Chromebooks as a first batch of them a few years ago - the build quality was very poor to be honest. They purchased Acer and Asus ones before I left. I wasn't very involved with that part but I believe they enrolled them somehow into the Google Apps for Education (as we had gone to Google not 365). For the most part, on a separate WiFi SSID and students login with their Google account and can access everything.

 

For simple web browsing, google docs etc they're OK. IMHO I wouldn't buy one myself as they're far too limited (but that's coming from an IT viewpoint).

[L3OUGH]

Hmmm interesting. I have taken them to O365 so I'm not looking into syncing with Google Apps or setting them up in Google as well as O365.

 

Build quality is an interesting point. They'll get trashed in a primary school if they aren't robust. I have been initially looking at Dell 5190's.

[FishCustard]

The primary I look after is only small, so hasn't dabbled in Chromebooks. We have laptops and a small selection of iPads currently. The new guy is so eager to get Chromebooks he's already pursuing funding grants to get multiple class sets.

And what happens when Chromebook guy moves on - without whole-staff (or at least a decent proportion, including all of SLT) buy in they risk becoming expensive paperweights in a couple of years.

[pacapps]

One of the schools I support are currently moving to Chromebooks, so I have had to look into this myself. Only briefly as our support contract is coming to an end and the new Tec guy has been setting them up.

 

It would appear that AD integration is only possible with Intel based devices.

 

"Before you begin

Confirm your device is supported. To use Active Directory to manage Chrome devices you need Chrome OS version 61 or later and your Chromebooks must run on an Intel®-based platform. Chromebooks with ARM chipsets, such as the Samsung® Chromebook Plus, aren’t supported."

 

https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/7497916?hl=en

 

I know that this particular school purchased 30 Chromebooks based on the ARM processor for student use.

[L3OUGH]

And what happens when Chromebook guy moves on - without whole-staff (or at least a decent proportion, including all of SLT) buy in they risk becoming expensive paperweights in a couple of years.

100% something I'll bring up with the head. The school is so tight on money (they couldn't replace a laptop trolley when I bought a bunch of new laptops) so I'd be a bit annoyed if they did become paperweights.

One of the schools I support are currently moving to Chromebooks, so I have had to look into this myself. Only briefly as our support contract is coming to an end and the new Tec guy has been setting them up.

It would appear that AD integration is only possible with Intel based devices.

"Before you begin

Confirm your device is supported. To use Active Directory to manage Chrome devices you need Chrome OS version 61 or later and your Chromebooks must run on an Intel®-based platform. Chromebooks with ARM chipsets, such as the Samsung® Chromebook Plus, aren’t supported."

https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/7497916?hl=en

I know that this particular school purchased 30 Chromebooks based on the ARM processor for student use.

Yes I had also spotted this one! That's why I started looking at the slightly higher end Dell's. Although would obviously triple check they are compatible.

[TwistedHelixis]

None of the primary schools around me have them but all the community colleges do, and the feedback from them is that they are great, very easy to manage.

 

Build quality is an interesting point. They'll get trashed in a primary school if they aren't robust.

You can get rugged Chromebooks or sleek thin but could break ones.

 

It's going to be something that the primary schools do invest in as most in my area are already using G Suite.

[dhicks]

They can be incorporated with AD using Google Enterprise licenses'? Which appears to be an annually paid for service?

 

We manage our Chromebooks via Google's Admin Console - you pay a one-off fee of around £18 per device for a license to add a device to the console, you just remember to add that to the price of the device when purchasing. We sync user data from Active Directory to both GSuite and Office 365 - I've not investigated integrating Chromebooks directly with Active Directory, the management facilities given by the GSuite Admin Console seem fine.

 

We have 250-odd Asus C100PA "flip" Chromebooks that have screens that rotate fully around to turn into (rather chunky) tablets. They've proven pretty robust over about a year and a half in a private prep school, with less than 10% suffering broken screens and similar from general usage (they aren't taken home by the pupils, but are carried around by them during the day). We wren't that impressed by the warrenty provision - when we do have a broken screen we fix it ourselves on-site. Different types of school might have different usage patterns, of course.

[atcoates]

Hmmm interesting. I have taken them to O365 so I'm not looking into syncing with Google Apps or setting them up in Google as well as O365.

 

Build quality is an interesting point. They'll get trashed in a primary school if they aren't robust. I have been initially looking at Dell 5190's.

 

The Dell 3380 is a much more robust laptop, I'd be looking at those as well.

 

https://www.dell.com/en-uk/work/shop/cty/pdp/spd/chromebook-13-3380-laptop/ca002chb338013uk

 

Made for active education.

A 13.3-inch laptop built with advanced applications for modern learning and best-in-class durability to withstand every school day.

[mthomas08]

And what happens when Chromebook guy moves on - without whole-staff (or at least a decent proportion, including all of SLT) buy in they risk becoming expensive paperweights in a couple of years.

 

Exactly.

 

Don't do what the new guy wants just for the sake of it. Visit other schools and consider the wider implications. Do you need to buy devices for the sake of it? Is the new guy just trying to make himself look good in the eyes of SLT? (wouldn't be the first nor the last)

 

It has been a few years since I used Googles own office Apps but they were poor comparisons Vs Office 365. There was a list of functionalities that simply didn't exist - we'd google them to find that nope.. can't do it. Wished I kept the list. Things might have changed.

 

Test them first. Don't get multiple classrooms.. get one at most or get a few and see if students/staff can work with them in the exact same way. This is what frustrates me with education and schools.. people push for tech but don't test.. test and test.. then pick up the pieces later or you've just made a headache for teachers.. just so one person can look good in the eye of SLT?

 

Has your school signed up to G Suite? do that right away and get using it. Hasn't this guy already done all this or is he just wanting to buy them all?

[FishCustard]

Don't do what the new guy wants just for the sake of it. Visit other schools and consider the wider implications. Do you need to buy devices for the sake of it? Is the new guy just trying to make himself look good in the eyes of SLT? (wouldn't be the first nor the last)

 

I'd bet you a few Chromebooks this is exactly what he's doing. It's a "whole-school transformative project" line item for his CV. If he wants to use them in his own teaching, that's one thing - more power to him. But resist (or convince your SLT to resist) them being foisted on the whole school if people don't genuinely want them.

[Reboot_IT]

They are definitely worth looking at. I've been using them for over a year and have no complaints. It's quite a big decision to change from your current set up though, particularly if the current devices aren't ready for the skip yet!

 

However, if you are in a position where devices need refreshing, chromebooks are a cost effective option IMO.

[Ditto]

@L3OUGH - before I put thoughts forward, could you outline your the schools current arrangement in a bit more detail. Do you have a Windows Server network for staff and pupils, any WiFi, network infrastructure etc. I see you have iPads, or other laptops - how are they administered. Approx how many pupils and staff? Do have a total budget you are working with?

[DrBeaker]

Exactly.

 

It has been a few years since I used Googles own office Apps but they were poor comparisons Vs Office 365. There was a list of functionalities that simply didn't exist - we'd google them to find that nope.. can't do it. Wished I kept the list. Things might have changed.

 

Same here - wish I'd kepy my list too!

 

I've gone to do something more than the basic stuff in Google Drive apps - especially Google Sheets and Docs and found the same as you - no functionality to do that. E.g. creating detailed user manuals.

Googled it and no, nothing, can't do that - "feature request, provide feedback to us and we'll add it" kind of response. Good luck waiting for that feature to be added! So just reverted to good ol' office apps and job done.

 

Google Drive sharing you can't beat it (Not sure about Office 365 functionality, new to me in new role now) but it's lacking in features for power users like us techies! Basic document writing it's OK.

[Primus]

To be honest I pretty much live in G Suite now - functionality is pretty comparable with Office now - it's rare to find something that isn't possible now.

 

Now if they'd just add native ink support to Google Slides then I'd say there's nothing a normal teacher would need that they don't have in Slides, Docs and Sheets.

 

As a G Suite school we have lots of Chromebooks - almost as many as we have desktop Windows PCs now, other schools nearby have spent a fortune on staff CPD trying to get to grips with and use O365 and yet they've had little to no take-up. On the other hand we've run minimal CPD for staff - but offered lots for individuals or faculties and our take-up is huge. IMO and it is just an opinion G Suite is both way easier to administer and use for staff and students.

[mavhc]

First thing to do is sign up for GSuite, sync AD and passwords to it.

 

Then this guy who's so into them has to explain how he's going to train all the staff and students to use this new system, because without masses of training it won't work.

 

If you just take your MSWord file, slap it on GDrive, and then everyone downloads it, prints it, and fills it out with a pen, etc etc, then no point.

 

If you redesign your lessons to be collaborative, small groups working together to produce documents, websites etc, sharing in real time, using google classroom, then it's great

 

But you don't need Chromebooks for any of that, so you can practise on your current laptops and spend £0 until you're sure it works.

 

Doesn't really help if you want students to learn video editing, 3d modelling etc though, and if you don't have Gb internet with 100% uptime

[Primus]

First thing to do is sign up for GSuite, sync AD and passwords to it.

 

Then this guy who's so into them has to explain how he's going to train all the staff and students to use this new system, because without masses of training it won't work.

 

If you just take your MSWord file, slap it on GDrive, and then everyone downloads it, prints it, and fills it out with a pen, etc etc, then no point.

 

If you redesign your lessons to be collaborative, small groups working together to produce documents, websites etc, sharing in real time, using google classroom, then it's great

 

But you don't need Chromebooks for any of that, so you can practise on your current laptops and spend £0 until you're sure it works.

 

Doesn't really help if you want students to learn video editing, 3d modelling etc though, and if you don't have Gb internet with 100% uptime

 

I agree with all of that but you may not need masses of training - my experience with a staff that aren't exactly tech savvy indicates it's more user-friendly than the alternatives. Obviously some training will be required and some staff may need additional hand-holding.

[PotNoodleTech]

We've just deployed 200 more chromebooks, one for each year 7 pupil and one for each member of staff.

 

I would say the key to success with chromebooks is to use / already be using google for education/google classroom. If your teachers are already putting work up there for the pupils and assignments, chromebooks become instantly VERY useful.

 

If you are not using google for education then really, a chromebook is just a glorified web browser. Useful in it's own right, but comes into it's own when you embed google into your whole school.

 

Set up active directory syncing to your google, buy chromebooks with a long shelf life and android app (play store) compatibility and go for it.

[L3OUGH]

Thank you all very much for the responses.

 

A little outline of current setup then.

 

All staff and students in O365. Students don't touch it though, staff most certainly do.

Windows Server 2012 environment, all staff and students have AD accounts. 200 students ish.

2x trolleys of W7 laptops

6x iPad Minis managed by Meraki MDM

Ubiquiti Wi-Fi

The school is pretty rural and doesn't have the greatest of internet speeds or reliability.

 

We aren't setup in GSuite, I've never even looked at it really. 1 of the schools we look after uses Google for email but that's as far as it goes. They don't use it for collaborative work or setting student work etc.

 

My initial feeling is that, if we go down this road, it will be a flash in the pan. Yes he might use it in his lessons, but I cannot see the rest of the school getting behind it. They fear change as it is.

 

I'm going to have a sit down and stress my concerns to the HT ASAP. Now that the new guy has been given his O365 mail account he will be chasing the grants. I'm going to try and bat him towards more iPads if I can as it will fit in with the current environment better.

[TwistedHelixis]

Just a little side swing, but in all the primary schools I look after I had both Office 365 and G Suite to start with and ALL are now using G Suite. The staff just found it more natural to use and I gave no training, just a simple overview of each.

[ModeratelyGruntled]

My advice would be don't focus on the device or the product, focus on the processes and spend more time working with the people and the platforms. That way, whatever investment you make won't be 'flash in the pan'

 

I'm of the opinion that iPads are ten times more pan flashy than chromebooks, but it's been a few years since I was at primary level.

[mavhc]

iPads can do things that laptops can't

 

Chromebooks can't do anything laptops can't, but they might do it more cheaply.

 

You can't replace a laptop with an iPad

 

If you don't have good internet then fix that first, looking at £4k/year for fiber, no point getting chromebooks before that.

 

Meanwhile sign up for GSuite anyway, don't have to tell anyone

[DrBeaker]

Like everything I suppose - my mantra is the right tool for the right job.

 

Sometimes a tablet is exactly and only what you need. Sometimes you need the raw power of a desktop PC with high-end spec e.g. HD video editing etc. Personally IMHO give me the good old laptop + proper docking station (not USB 3.0 ones). That's the best compromise.

 

With the move to the cloud especially in Education I think Google is one of the biggest players in this arena e.g. Classroom, Docs, Drive, Gmail etc - Apps avaible for iOS, Android etc. Lost cost of devices i.e. Chromebooks compared to ageing laptops etc.

[dhicks]

All staff and students in O365.

 

Cloud Ready, who do a installable version of ChromeOS for non-Chromebooks, also do a version of "ChromeOS" but for Office 365 - basically like ChromeOS but with O365 integration instead. That might be an option.

 

Just anecdotally, when it comes to login integrations I tend to see more sites offering Google logins than I do O365 currently, although more sites (especially education-related ones) do now seem to be offer O365 login integration.

[PotNoodleTech]

Regarding Office365 v Google for Education, here I am using Office 365 for staff - staff communication as it has some nice tools that are useful in many different situations (better handling of MS Office documents, Planner, Teams, Onenote, etc). The problem with O365 is it has literally no educational value as a product for use in the classroom.

 

All pupil communication and staff to pupil communication is done on Google and this is a platform created for education with many areas that suit use with pupils in the classroom.

 

I also find separating staff-staff communication via using office365 leads to less potential issues as staff can't accidentally click a pupil / group of pupils and send the wrong email - as there are no pupils in our office365 address book.

 

Just my 2p!