Crispness Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Hi I'm an ICT link governor (and a Technology Director in RL) and our Network Manager has told me that he has disabled right-click in the user profile on all the student PC accounts. I understand his reasoning ("What they can't access they can't fiddle with!", but is this common practice in schools or is he a little OTT? As an employer I want my employees to understand and use right-click because it is one of the most productive UI enhancements ever, IMHO. So I believe students should learn to use it at school. Who is right? Am I living in a fantasy world in expecting students to behave properly when given access to a PC? Ta
kingswood Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Hi I'm an ICT link governor (and a Technology Director in RL) and our Network Manager has told me that he has disabled right-click in the user profile on all the student PC accounts. I understand his reasoning ("What they can't access they can't fiddle with!", but is this common practice in schools or is he a little OTT? As an employer I want my employees to understand and use right-click because it is one of the most productive UI enhancements ever, IMHO. So I believe students should learn to use it at school. Who is right? Am I living in a fantasy world in expecting students to behave properly when given access to a PC? Ta I think your Network Manager is probably right! I have had the same issues here, with teachers stating that they "must" have right-click context menus not only in IE but in Windows Explorer. Although it is a great invention, it *can* give the willing student things that they perhaps shouldn't have. The compromise for me is to enable it for the lesson that needs it and then turn it back off. Still not nice though. Sorry. That probably wasn't the answer you wanted!
kxv2020 Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Many schools do disable right click - but I do believe it is wrong. As a user I would get very frustated and irrated by not using right click, and therefore I do not think it is acceptable to disable right click. I totally agree with you about students learning to use this right click - although I think the main reason why people look it down is because of Internet Explorer and the desktop wallpaper.
pallen Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Yup, disabled here. Too many times the kids were doings things they shouldn't have been doing and a decision was made to disable it. Yes, it is frustrating when you are used to using it, but as always there are numerous methods to achieve the same result. Although it probably is a case of a few spoilling it for the many, it saves a lot of problems by disabling it.
zag Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Disabled here as well, but I do agree its an annoyance. The kids simply use it to cause damage to our network, it is very easy to get around security with right click, for instance starting the command prompt. I would love to be able to enable it for all students but time and time again they have abused it.
cookie_monster Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 IMHO i think that right click is very handy, 'very' easy and will always be there everywhere else, making them use the alternatives is good education and helps students to not become too regimented in their thinking. The lazy option is available at home and in the work place, i've used a desktop without right click and the alternatives soon become second nature. The security issues that has been discussed on here before give us reason to disable it. I think this should be reviewed occasionally as most trouble is generated by a few individuals.
Ryan Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Not disabled here, and if i can possibly help it, never will be. As stated previously, they need to learn how to use it. Too many bloody staff can't use it. All you can do is try to lock down the damage they can do with it i suppose. I feel that learning to use this - pretty fundamental - feature is more important that setting getting fiddled with. Must dash, i think i just heard something break... 1
jcollings Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Right click is available here - we seem to have no trouble with it as we use group policy to lock out bits we don't want students to have access to. I agree it is important they learn how to use it.
ricki Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 We have problems with the kids hacking into things that they should not have access to with it enabled do its now disabled
strawberry Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 not available here, has too many security risks and everything that's there can be achieved by menu navigation.
sidewinder Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 disabled here too, it is frustrating if you're used to using it but its not as if the functions arnt available elsewhere
russdev Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Right click enabled here and gpos to stop students accessing stuff they should not. Russ
Joedetic Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 We had it disabled for some and enabled for others.
StewartKnight Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Disabled here too. In an ideal world, where students come to learn and don't "mess" then i'd enable it. However kids will mess, and if they can ruin something, they will do, just because they can.
Crispness Posted February 27, 2008 Author Posted February 27, 2008 IMHO i think that right click is very handy, 'very' easy and will always be there everywhere else, making them use the alternatives is good education and helps students to not become too regimented in their thinking. The lazy option is available at home and in the work place, i've used a desktop without right click and the alternatives soon become second nature. The security issues that has been discussed on here before give us reason to disable it. I think this should be reviewed occasionally as most trouble is generated by a few individuals. I think it is pretty obvious which side of the fence I'm on but I'm not trying to dictate policy. While some people might see it as a 'lazy' option, I see it as highly productive and in a commercial environment that is important. And by teaching students to do things in a different way, they are likely to follow that path into the future. If I am correct about the productivity side of it, then they are 'taught' to be less productive than some of their contemporaries. On average, that has to affect their life chances somewhat. I don't know how I'd manage without right-click. Thanks for replying anyhow.
Lithium Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 I get plenty of questions from students asking where the right click is on a Mac... We have right click enabled in places where it's needed and isn't a risk and places where it isn't, its disabled.... so they can view properties and retrieve their own previous versions of files, but they can't view the properties of drives, taskbars etc. It's a comprimise... you can't give them too much rights otherwise you can riot with it, or you can take so much away, that you get "Access is Denied" when you sneeze near it.
SteveT Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Hi As an employer I want my employees to understand and use right-click because it is one of the most productive UI enhancements ever, IMHO. So I believe students should learn to use it at school. Ta Alternatively businesses could put their money where their mouths are and provide the training their workers need (anyone here old enough to remember apprentices???) and leave schools to their role which is to "educate" their students. Computers in schools are a tool to enhance teaching and learning, they are not here to enable students to be trained for industry. A bit harsh maybe, but I get a bit fed up of schools being expected to do everyone elses work for them!!! a) Parents lack the skills to raise children with some sort of moral code? No problem ........... schools will be made responsible. b) Police/judicial system unable to stop kids carrying/using knives? No problem ........... schools will be able to fit metal detectors. c) Feral and drunk kids wandering our streets? No problem ........... schools will be made responsible for teaching them the dangers of alcohol. d) Parents unable/unwilling to care for their kids outside school times? No problem ........... extended schools, homework clubs. e) Parents unwilling to feed their kids properly? No problem ........... schools will be made responsible for this. Schools providing breakfast for kids FFS!!!! Rant over!!!
kennysarmy Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 (edited) ... On average, that has to affect their life chances somewhat. LOL Edited February 27, 2008 by kennysarmy
cookie_monster Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 (edited) "I feel that learning to use this - pretty fundamental" I'm not convinced, try using right click on a Mac they are becoming more popular and some students might end up working with them in future. Very few of our students ever complain about this as they're very good at adapting to small changes much better than adults, they very quickly find the alternatives and begin using them without issue. Some PC's in art and media have right click allowed and they use it seamlessly there and then switch back to not using it on general PC's i think this is useful as it encourages them to think their way around problems (which most of their contemporaries probably don't). Edited February 27, 2008 by cookie_monster
FatBoy Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Right click is available here - we seem to have no trouble with it as we use group policy to lock out bits we don't want students to have access to. I agree it is important they learn how to use it. Exactly the same here.... In my previous job they did lock down the right click which I always thought was wrong. Ok yes it does make people think differently and find different ways of doing the normal right click features but that is really a bad excuse for doing it. Staff and students should be able to use a PC exactly how they would at home and use it "normally" like in the real world. Not to mention all the IT exercises staff use to teach students that use right click to teach! Also jcollings is right the amount of other group policies you can use to disable 90% of the vulnerabilities are there. :-)
DMcCoy Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Hmm, I can't find anywhere where I have *removed* right click, only limited the choices that appear when you do. I can't quite work out what could be insecure about it. Anyone care to enlighten me? Oh, Macs have right click these days unless you use the horrible one button mouse.
cookie_monster Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Yeh alright not the best example. Anyway they don't have it here.
pallen Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 I think it is pretty obvious which side of the fence I'm on but I'm not trying to dictate policy. While some people might see it as a 'lazy' option, I see it as highly productive and in a commercial environment that is important. And by teaching students to do things in a different way, they are likely to follow that path into the future. If I am correct about the productivity side of it, then they are 'taught' to be less productive than some of their contemporaries. On average, that has to affect their life chances somewhat. I don't know how I'd manage without right-click. Thanks for replying anyhow. Not sure what your saying here. Are you implying that not teaching them the method of right-click the pupils are being disadvantaged? I dont really think that that holds up. A school should be teaching the principles of how things work and the procedure to follow in order to achieve a set of results. There are always numerous ways to obtain the desired result and different networks will allow different ways to achieve this. If you look at it another way, schools use various software to teach GCSE, not everyone uses Microsoft. It could be argued that by not teaching the so called standard office package that the pupils are at a disadvantage. This has been covered many times on here, but I believe that the pupils should be taught transferable skills how to do things. Different organisations use different software, have different restrictions, use different policies. The pupils should have the knowledge to work under different environments, not learn how to do things parrot fashion.
ArchersIT Posted February 27, 2008 Posted February 27, 2008 Hi Who is right? Am I living in a fantasy world in expecting students to behave properly when given access to a PC? Ta Unfortunately I think you are. I have several students who tell me that their aim is to hack the systems before they leave. I have pointed out that it is illeagle but they dont see the problem. The sanctions that stop normal office users from abusing the systems (disciplinary processes, affecting salaries etc) dont apply at school. They believe the worst that will happen is them being suspended or in detention and the "fame" that they would get by being able to do it seems to them to be worth it. Anyway - FWIW, right mouse click is disabled here - which is a shame (IMO) but I understand the reasons. Jonathan
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