what do you think of RM Integris ? we have SIMs at the moment !

[sjpage10]

as the subject says

 

we will be looking at 'RM Integris ' and would really like some opinions on the system ?

googling 'RM Integris' brings up a lot of primary/ junior schools !

 

 

at the moment we host our own sims and though can have its issues it is reasonably OK and what people are used to!

 

we only have our internet services that are out sourced everything else is done in house

 

we are a secondary school with aprox 800 students

 

 

 

your input greatly appreciated

 

thanks

 

Stef

Edited September 25, 2015 by sjpage10

[Oaktech]

I'm not a data manager, but I don't believe Integris is suitable for secondary schools.

 

We have it here at a junior school, and whilst it is a bit slow and a bit picky about what browsers it run in it is perfectly adequate for our needs.

[halbaradkenafin]

We've got Integris here (secondary school) and it's okay but I barely touch it. I know there have been various problems with it for our regular users that have eventually been solved (I think, they've stopped complaining to me about it anyway). From my limited experience of it and SIMS (used at the last job) I'd have to say I much prefer SIMS. SIMS support was considerably better than RM (potatoes are better than RM support at times) and being hosted on site you didn't run into any real latency issues if everyone was using the internet, at least not more than you'd be getting anyway, and you don't run into the problem of not being able to use it if your internet connection goes down for any reason.

[sjpage10]

thanks for the replies any more would be really appreciated !

 

does anyone one know the cost as well ?

[bobsmith]

When I last looked at Integris S2 (the secondary version, G2 is primary) it was pretty cheap in comparison to both Facility CMIS and SIMS.

 

It looked quite cool, they've got something like discover called RM Analytics (I think) - but it's all web based.

 

It did strike me that it was designed for primaries first, then upgraded to cope with secondaries - so I'm sure you'll find limitations.

 

My biggest factor when deciding on MIS is the migration from your current MIS to a new one, it's such a faff, and you lose so much during a transfer that if it ain't horribly broke I wouldn't try to fix it.

[Banjo]

I know of a primary school who got Integris free last year from RM. I don't know of the on going cost after year one. The people in the school who used SIMS wish they hadn't changed MIS.

[Oaktech]

I know of a primary school who got Integris free last year from RM. I don't know of the on going cost after year one. The people in the school who used SIMS wish they hadn't changed MIS.

 

The ongoing cost for Integris for a mid size primary is very small - we've got options for 1, 3 and 5 year contracts and whilst the renewal price which may change slightly based on pupil numbers next year when the contract goes live but all of them are in the low thousands.

 

Just don't try and leave with your data.

[Banjo]

SIMS is around the three and half pound per pupil mark for primaries. 300 pupils works out at just over £1000 pounds, not a great deal of money if you ask me in the grand scheme of things.

[blahblah2]

We have Integris and are looking to go to SIMS. It does not seem to suit our needs.

[ChristineAndrews]

Hi,

 

There are quite a few MIS suppliers out there, some are secondary or Primary only, some not. I suggest you ignore other people's opinions and contact the suppliers for a demo and then decide which is the best for you. Just search for School MIS

 

All the best with your search

[matt40k]

does anyone one know the cost as well ?

 

https://www.digitalmarketplace.service.gov.uk/g-cloud/services/6535335265697792

 

Capita pricing is unfortunately not as open or standard. It varies so much.

[SimonRushton]

The 'Final report of the Commission on Assessment without Levels ' has just been published and marks a watershed. It has some pretty good advice, not about what systems are good, or not, but about what whole school priorities will need to be, from now on, in terms of what to expect of their systems. Thanks to 'life without levels' your school (every school) has a great opportunity to define what it values, and therefore wants to measure, and to challenge suppliers to show they can support your school's individual and different priorities. So; step 1: Ask SLT if they have read it (they should have), step 2: get SLT to define the school's requirements, step 3: Put them to ALL the suppliers Focussin on how their generic systems cope with individual differences.

[vikpaw]

I agree with the above in terms of look at your priorities as a school and how each MIS can match that list. They each have strengths in different areas. Change is always hard, and the staff will always be resistant. The key is management support, make sure they lead the discussion.

 

We moved from SIMS to DoubleFirst Engage which is great for us. We were really strong users of SIMS and still use some elements, replicating all the things people were already used to doing was hard, but we chose the new system for certain features and benefits and we have way more flexibility now, for our needs.

 

I wouldn't choose an MIS based on how easy it is to transfer the data, it's a strong factor, but sometimes you have to take a hit to make things work. I transferred a lot of data manually after the initial migration but it was worth it in the end.

[Cheryl1968]

From an administration point of view I personally wouldn't move from SIMs to Integris, it would be a downscale. Integris has many usability features but is rigid on administration and reporting. Take pupil data sheets as an example. On SIMs you can print to a word document and manipulate the document to print on a single sheet. On integris it is printed to pdf and the office staff have to print single sided and staple sheets together. The same applies to labels and many other reports.

 

I recently moved from 8 years with SIMs to Integris and contacted both to check on development, transfer opportunities, costs etc. Only Capita got back to me. I haven't heard from Integris despite a reminder. They don't seem to be interested in the administration of information management and we have moved away from it for assessment and baselines. So what we are paying for is simply to store pupil basic data. Attendance doesn't link directly to school meal register. It has no finance capability.

 

If you went for Integris you would be ignoring the administration of pupil data completely and causing a headache for office staff. It would provide no benefit to teachers and I couldn't be more under enthusiastic about a software product if I tried. Our council is one of the most under funded in the country and cost is the only factor that we are stuck in the stone age with Integris to the point we are using excel spreadsheets to compile data as opposed to using this fundamentally flawed software.

[PotNoodleTech]

Hi,

 

There are quite a few MIS suppliers out there, some are secondary or Primary only, some not. I suggest you ignore other people's opinions and contact the suppliers for a demo and then decide which is the best for you. Just search for School MIS

 

All the best with your search

 

Hi Christine Andrews form Bromcom. That's some charming advice! You do realise you are on an IT support forum where people post their opinions on order to help other people out? I guess you told people to ignore everyone else on this forum, and google search as you are aware your company Bromcom are placed at the top of the Google search?

Edited October 19, 2015 by PotNoodleTech

[Oaktech]

Hi Christine Andrews form Bromcom. That's some charming advice! You do realise you are on an IT support forum where people post their opinions on order to help other people out? I guess you told people to ignore everyone else on this forum, and google search as you are aware your company Bromcom are placed at the top of the Google search?

 

Ooooh... not declaring a commercial interest, the Gods of edugeek take a dim view of that... @Dos_Box?

[ChristineAndrews]

Hi All,

 

Didn’t mean to cause an issue having worked in schools using both SIMS and CMIS and now working for my present company, I thought I was in a position to offer my opinion, like many of you do.

 

I still think the best advice is to ask the suppliers for a demo and see for yourself, what one person likes another does not, the one you like may not be my company.

 

I have made no attempt at covering up who I work for, this will be in my details if you look, obviously Abutters did.

I did not name the company I work for, Abutters did

I have no control over what appears top of the list when doing a Google search, if my company is top of the list then it is because it is the most popular at this moment and not because it is alphabetical, would you have bought this up even if SIMS had been top of the list I wonder?

 

If in my trying to help I have broken any rules then I apologise [maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned either SIMS or CMIS]

[Oaktech]

Hi All,

 

Didn’t mean to cause an issue having worked in schools using both SIMS and CMIS and now working for my present company, I thought I was in a position to offer my opinion, like many of you do.

 

I still think the best advice is to ask the suppliers for a demo and see for yourself, what one person likes another does not, the one you like may not be my company.

 

I have made no attempt at covering up who I work for, this will be in my details if you look, obviously Abutters did.

I did not name the company I work for, Abutters did

I have no control over what appears top of the list when doing a Google search, if my company is top of the list then it is because it is the most popular at this moment and not because it is alphabetical, would you have bought this up even if SIMS had been top of the list I wonder?

 

If in my trying to help I have broken any rules then I apologise [maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned either SIMS or CMIS]

 

Generally speaking people who work for a company have a username that reflects who they work for, and AFAIK there is usually a requirement for the company to become involved with edugeek in the way that VeryPC, Millgate and ICTDirect do

[matt40k]

Surely it depends if they are posting on behalf of their company or off their own back sure? Otherwise we'd all have SchoolName_Forename or whatever.

 

I think Christine was trying to say was not to treat opinions as facts - saying something is rubbish is a opinion which is pretty worthless. You can't put it down as a business reason for rejecting a system. Saying something can't do a particular is technically a fact, but its worth checking with the supplier that it is correct. Facts can be checked and are measurable. Not to say opinions are worthless, asking for opinions on support is a good example, you'll have to do a bit of refinement however with your questions - generally primary schools will want quick fixes with min input\output required by them, secondarys might want the same but more output so they can be more independent going forward - ie how it was fixed.

[Bromcom_John]

Generally speaking people who work for a company have a username that reflects who they work for, and AFAIK there is usually a requirement for the company to become involved with edugeek in the way that VeryPC, Millgate and ICTDirect do

 

I am unaware of any requirement to have a company name in my profile name?

I certainly do not and neither, for that matter, does Phil Neal.

 

I've been told that, as long as we aren't advertising or soliciting feedback that breaches the usage, it should be fine.

 

Colleague defence rant over Back to the Original topic.

matt40K is correct, through many years experience with school trying to find new suppliers and software solutions. Nothing beats doing some solid research.

 

John (@ Bromcom)

[vikpaw]

It's lucky your username doesn't reflect your profession / company John and @john for that matter.

 

Generally sponsors have their name in the username, and also a badge to show their status. Lay users often don't reflect their company name, but having it in your profile is good, and possibly for those that are not well known, it can help to put in a disclaimer in posts.

 

We do like to encourage technical support and input from companies.

 

If in doubt - please just report the post and we can investigate and take action if required.

@ChristineAndrews - to EduGeek - we do encourage valid user opinions here, that's what we're all about, once you've been here a while you'll pick up the gist.

[PhilNeal]

@JohnCondon - it's in my user profile!

[pcstru]

I agree with the above in terms of look at your priorities as a school and how each MIS can match that list. They each have strengths in different areas. Change is always hard, and the staff will always be resistant. The key is management support, make sure they lead the discussion.

I'd say make sure users lead the discussion - or at least make them feel they have.

 

We went live with our new MIS in September. Our project to that point ran over two and a half years - the first year of which was just assessing our requirements and then how the suppliers stacked up against those. Amazingly one supplier just didn't turn up to their demo, while another withdrew from the market mere days before they were due to present. Following the appointment of the supplier, we spent a year looking at data transfer and our own business processes, aiming to make a like for like transition (no re-engineering business processes) and delivering training to various support departments and hundreds of teachers. Our go live in September was pretty smooth and now, with the system having had half a term of bedding in we will now start to look at re-engineering actual business processes to take advantage of new functionality in the software and where beneficial consolidate functions into a single system.

 

I'd say the most important thing in the process was engaging users and allowing them to develop and operate with a sense of ownership. This wasn't something being imposed on them from a great height by distant management, this was their own choices with ample opportunities to have their say and drive the process forward within their business area. Now, there is no moaning, griping or frustrated tears - just teams of people who know they are where they are through their own choices and who, as a result, are motivated to solve any issues themselves. Generally users are very positive about the new software which in a school of 2000 students and hundreds of users of the MIS, is perhaps the most important thing of all.

[vikpaw]

I'd say make sure users lead the discussion - or at least make them feel they have.

You don't want to go round in circles too long, or end up with a vote for Excel and Paper. Seriously, last week I heard an argument for doing reports in Word, like the good old pass a floppy disk around days, and the only argument against was that after the teachers have done their bit, the office would spend a week having to manually upload them into the MIS!

[pcstru]

You don't want to go round in circles too long, or end up with a vote for Excel and Paper. Seriously, last week I heard an argument for doing reports in Word, like the good old pass a floppy disk around days, and the only argument against was that after the teachers have done their bit, the office would spend a week having to manually upload them into the MIS!

Well ... . We did use Word and Excel for report writing quite a few years back! We would generate word documents from the MIS, users would find them in shared areas with folder structures reflecting the Year/Tutor Groups. Completed documents were quality checked by HOF's or Deputies and when the approved, the documents were processed to extract the teacher generated content into CSV files we could upload into the MIS. This was actually much more useable than the MIS software's facilities for data entry and we could build in quality checking into the process - which had been a huge problem (and sadly wasn't entirely solved by the process).

 

I think there was leadership in our MIS project in the project governance and the overall framework. It wasn't a case of saying "you should choose this" but rather a case of "this is a good method for making a choice" or "this is a good method to assure the smooth implementation". Project management was then about keeping the method on track without worrying about the actual outcome. Actually, senior management were nervous and conservative and put a lot of store by "nearly everyone else is using X", it was a bit of a worry to me that they would overrule the users.