Is Wi-Fi making your child ill?

[GREED]

If you think that is anything more than an anecdote then you've missed the point of science.

 

I bought some new trousers recently. I've slept well recently too. To link the 2 would be a logical jump that just doesn't hold up to scrutiny.

 

Or, to put it more succinctly: Correlation does not equal causation.

 

Also consider the placebo effect... switched off WiFi expecting positive results probably yielded positive results, if only psychologically

[localzuk]

Also consider the placebo effect... switched off WiFi expecting positive results probably yielded positive results, if only psychologically

 

Indeed. Never discount the power of the mind!! People at work often sing the praise of various nonsense treatments and how they have miraculously cured back ache or whatever. I have zero doubt that their copper bands or magnets between their toes do nothing, but have every confidence that the mind is very capable of making a person feel better simply because they believe it to be so!

[GREED]

Indeed. Never discount the power of the mind!! People at work often sing the praise of various nonsense treatments and how they have miraculously cured back ache or whatever. I have zero doubt that their copper bands or magnets between their toes do nothing, but have every confidence that the mind is very capable of making a person feel better simply because they believe it to be so!

 

I'm currently starting out with mindful meditation (ironically 4 days before the big TV announcement today). Taking control of the mind to make/train yourself to be calm and controlled and switch the mind off. No pills no tech no magnets... WiFi still on at home!

[ass17]

You can take the pee all you like but it works for me and that how it will stay. End of story! I don't believe in tablets for pain, so that's why I've never even taken paracetamol. My point is it works for me and that is all that matters, couldn't care less about anyone else.

[localzuk]

You can take the pee all you like but it works for me and that how it will stay. End of story! I don't believe in tablets for pain, so that's why I've never even taken paracetamol. My point is it works for me and that is all that matters, couldn't care less about anyone else.

 

Accepting that placebos work is not taking the pee. It's actual science...

[psydii]

Fun fact: When my school got its wifi infastructure installed (before I started) we had to have all wireless AP'S on their own set of switches. This was because parents complained it could be bad for their children so when the school wasn't using wifi they wanted us to turn off every AP in the school until someone wanted to use it again.

Needless to say I've never turned off the wifi.

 

Dead handy way of getting some decent new switches though?

 

I've been sat near a NICU and every available channel was in use 1,6,11 36,40,44,48,52,56,60,64

 

My laptop could make out 7 ESSIDs and about 10 physical radios, without moving.

 

Given the nature of my location, I'm pretty confident that some very smart medical and RF experts have given wifi a clean bill of health.

[jinnantonnixx]

This is interesting. There's a case going through the courts in Massachusetts. I'd be interested see what proof is forwarded as part of the complaint.

 

The parents of an anonymous student at the Fay School in Southborough, Mass., allege that the Wi-Fi at the institution is making their child sick, according to a lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court earlier this month.

 

The child, identified only as “G” in court documents, is said to suffer from electromagnetic hypersensitivity syndrome. The radio waves emitted by the school’s Wi-Fi routers cause G serious discomfort and physical harm, according to the suit, which was first reported by Courthouse News Service last week.

 

Massachusetts boarding school sued over Wi-Fi sickness | Network World

 

 

The PDF of the lawsuit is here: http://ftpcontent3.worldnow.com/wfxt/pdf/WiFi-lawsuit.pdf

It's heavy on anecdotes, but light on research.

Specifically, the Aerohive Network doubled the prior emissions in

Fay classrooms from 2.5 GHz to 5 GHz.

Hmmmm. Edited August 26, 2015 by jinnantonnixx

[GREED]

Maybe "my child says he doesn't feel well when he goes to school"

[Andrew_C]

Maybe "my child says he doesn't feel well when he goes to school"

and he refuses to wear his hat.

 

[GREED]

Somehow sciency it must end with his brain being microwaved

[unixman_again]

French woman gets €800 a month for electromagnetic-field 'disability'

 

The footnote echoes a question that I've often asked. Do they feel ill from the effect of TV & Radio stations?

[Andrew_C]

French woman gets €800 a month for electromagnetic-field 'disability'

“We can no longer pretend it is not a real psychiatric condition.”

So, this says nothing about the influence of EM radiation. If the woman convinced a judge that she thought she couldn't work due to Wombats living nearby, she'd have got the payout.

[dcwhitworth]

They sort of are being made ill by the wifi, or more specifically being made ill by believing they're being made ill by the wifi. It's called the Nocebo effect, it's the opposite of the placebo effect.

 

[frazzlesgrant]

"wind farms with wifi" haha

[comrade]

I think wifi causes cancer, in 30 years, we will see. Either way.

[localzuk]

I think wifi causes cancer, in 30 years, we will see. Either way.

 

That's quite an extreme claim, I think we need to know how you arrived at that opinion!!

[GREED]

So many parameters to take it account. Not least proximity, frequently... we would have had some signs by now... it would develop not just reach 30 years and boff... cancer!

[3s-gtech]

Wifi, or EM radiation? Odd that we're focused on EM radiation at 2.4GHz and 5Ghz, but all of the other frequencies we're bombarded with (from natural sources) are ignored. Looks like we're going to have to ban microwave ovens, the Sun (you can count the paper too), anything coming from space, the natural background radioactivity of everything on earth, and light.

 

It can't be the intensity that's an issue, because wifi pales into the background once you're a little away from it. True, I wouldn't sleep with a WAP for a pillow, but meh.

[jinnantonnixx]

The crux is whether the radiation under consideration is ionising or not, rather than the power output.

Radiation Basics | Radiation Protection | US EPA

 

Ionising radiation is best avoided where possible. We can see from the EM spectrum that UV from sunlight is damaging to the skin's DNA, while there is no evidence that radiation in what we call the radio spectrum causes damage.

 

There is an enormous nuclear reactor in the sky, and the damage to DNA from its radiation far exceeds that of any WiFi kit. Though of course with the weather in the UK, it might be a little difficult to believe.

Edited September 17, 2015 by jinnantonnixx

[GREED]

Yer... irony there that Brits get more cancer from WiFi radiation and not the sun...

[jinnantonnixx]

Yer... irony there that Brits get more cancer from WiFi radiation and not the sun...

 

I know you're jesting, and a sunny day is quite a novelty, but even so the figures aren't pleasant. In 2012 there were 2,148 deaths in the UK from malignant melanoma.

Skin cancer statistics | Cancer Research UK

 

Ultraviolet (UV) radiation from the sun is the main potentially avoidable risk factor for skin cancer, linked to an estimated 86% of malignant melanoma cases in the UK.

 

The upshot is that people who worry about household radio devices are worrying about the wrong things.

Edited September 17, 2015 by jinnantonnixx

[GREED]

Indeed. It was me mucking about, skin cancer is not in the least bit funny. Edited September 18, 2015 by witch

[Markopolo]

I think wifi causes cancer, in 30 years, we will see. Either way.

 

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

[farmerste]

If you want to know the truth about non-ionising radiation and its dangers you firstly need to understand that there are 3 real methods of scientific investigation.

1- the first method assumes that the ONLY way damage can occur is through heating the tissue, of course this is very minimal, so all results show no if little damage.

2- the second method is to test the dangers by applying a sinusoidal wave of frequency 'x' and this also shows very little negative effects

3- the third method actually applies the 'real world use' where data is been transmitted between the device and the wireless access point, and this has been found to mutate DNA and to actually damage cells too !!

 

most of the funding is for type 1 and 2 types of research that are likely to show little or no negative effects. type3 research almost always shows negative biological effects. over 70% if INDEPENDANTLY funded research shows negative effects.

 

using non-ionising radiation is like going out in the sun without sun cream in my opinion, but a healthy person should be able to 'shake off' the damage done.

 

if you want to read the scientific papers google powerwatch, they are all there listed, make up your own mind, but the one thing that EVERYONE'S body does is react to non-ionising radiation in a negative/threatening way.

[sonofsanta]

It's 8 years since the first iPhone. 8 years of everyone carrying WiFi and cellular radiation all but against their skin for the majority of their waking lives. It's the biggest data set you could ask for.

 

Have cancer rates gone up? No. They've gone down.