x16 Software running on x64 machines.

[NerdNamedMatt]

As a pre-warning, I don't work in education. Not sure if that is a big issue or not but hey-ho.

 

Morning all,

 

This one has been a huge issue since before I started this job, and now that I'm here it's taken to a whole new level.

 

Basically, our old IT guy ( who was a jack of all trades it seems, he now runs the production line) wrote a rather large 16bit program in Superbase about 10 years ago. Now being perfectly honest, I don't know exactly what the program does, it apparently integrates with Sage somewhere along the lines and tracks how much steel we have on site for manufacturing. I'm sure it does a lot more than that, but I don't really care about the intricacies of it so long as it works.

 

The issue I have is that we are slowly moving away from x32 machines and onto x64 machines. The 16bit software is simply not supported for x64 versions of Windows. So far my solution has been installing a VM onto the machines that require it and getting extra Licenses from VLSC which I don't really want to do (Only 3 machines so far, but still...). The company has approached different coders beforehand and asked for the project to be moved to work on x32 machines, but they were quoted ridiculous amounts of money because of how long it would take and the amount of coding required.

 

So my question is, does anyone know of a way to get x16 software to run on x64 machines?

[Trojan]

As far as I know it's not possible.

 

(Edit: Natively possible without VM or XP mode)

Edited April 29, 2015 by Trojan

[tmcd35]

 

So far my solution has been installing a VM onto the machines that require it and getting extra Licenses from VLSC which I don't really want to do (Only 3 machines so far, but still...).

 

I assume you are using either Windows 7 Pro or Windows 7 Enterprise? If that's the case use XP Mode, no additional licences required -

 

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/forums/windows/en-US/f5475e04-c0fd-4dce-b29a-6a8fb431c1f1/windows-xp-mode-licensing-for-corporate

[andyturpie]

Run in compatibility mode?

[3s-gtech]

Your current solution seems to be the easiest. You could also install Windows 7 x64 and use XP mode which means you don't need another OS license (obviously this isn't without its pitfalls).

 

Basically, 64 bit Windows versions don't contain the libraries necessary to run 16 bit software - this was to streamline them, reduce the amount of legacy stuff within (bear in mind how old 16 bit Windows is now) and basically shift things onward a bit. A VM is probably the most elegant solution I can think of, unless you fancy popping some extra stations in running 32 bit Windows 7/8.1 which will do it.

[localzuk]

Your options appear to be:

 

1. Continue with a VM as you are.

2. Set up a Windows Server 2008 Remote Desktop Server and see if the software will work with multiple sessions, if so Server 2008 original is in extended support until 2020. This will allow the clients to run it remotely.

3. Get the software re-written.

[tmcd35]

Another solution - if you want to be clever (from an end users perspective) is to run a Windows 2003/2008 server with your 16-bit software installed and user Terminal Services to present the application to the end users (just the application - not the entire RDP desktop).

 

*EDIT: Damn you @localzuk - option 2, snipped - beat me to it! lol.

Edited April 29, 2015 by tmcd35

[sted]

how many people use this software at a time?

 

could you set up an x86 pc/vm somewhere and have them remote into it to use the software if its not used all the time? infact i know server 2008r1 is pretty old but its the last x86 version of server and you could possibly install it on that and publish it as a web app/cant remember the name but runs it on the server but to users looks like its a local programme mode

[NerdNamedMatt]

I assume you are using either Windows 7 Pro or Windows 7 Enterprise? If that's the case use XP Mode, no additional licences required -

 

https://social.technet.microsoft.com/forums/windows/en-US/f5475e04-c0fd-4dce-b29a-6a8fb431c1f1/windows-xp-mode-licensing-for-corporate

Wow - Thanks for that. Didn't actually realize this was the case.

 

how many people use this software at a time?

 

could you set up an x86 pc/vm somewhere and have them remote into it to use the software if its not used all the time? infact i know server 2008r1 is pretty old but its the last x86 version of server and you could possibly install it on that and publish it as a web app/cant remember the name but runs it on the server but to users looks like its a local programme mode

 

We can have up to 15 people using it at once, so a TS is pretty much out of the question. I think it's just going to be a case of using VM's to be honest, just wanted to see if anyone else had any clever ideas.

 

Thanks all, but I think that the VM solution is going to be the only way right now. We simply can't afford to have it rewritten yet.

[JRowley]

To be honest, you really need to push for it to be rewritten, anything you do now is simply putting off the inevitable. For now I second XP mode as there is no cost involved but your company should budget for the rewrite in the next year or two in my view.

[sted]

in that case id find out exactly what it does do you might find something out there also does pretty much the same thing that you can just buy off the shelf or get adapted cheaper than reworking the existing programme.

[NerdNamedMatt]

To be honest, you really need to push for it to be rewritten, anything you do now is simply putting off the inevitable. For now I second XP mode as there is no cost involved but your company should budget for the rewrite in the next year or two in my view.

I'm a little skeptical on what i'm about to say here but the last IT guy has told me when they asked for a price to re-write the code it was going to be somewhere around the £85k-£90k mark. As a business with a profit turnover of £250,000 a year that's a pretty big chunk to be saving for.

 

I'm going to try and learn a little bit more about the ins and outs of the program and then go about getting quotes from freelancers myself. I don't think it should be anything like the £90k price point i've been told.

[JRowley]

I'm a little skeptical on what i'm about to say here but the last IT guy has told me when they asked for a price to re-write the code it was going to be somewhere around the £85k-£90k mark. As a business with a profit turnover of £250,000 a year that's a pretty big chunk to be saving for.

 

I'm going to try and learn a little bit more about the ins and outs of the program and then go about getting quotes from freelancers myself. I don't think it should be anything like the £90k price point i've been told.

 

That is a ludicrous amount, it would be cheaper to buy Visual Studio, do a course yourself and then rewrite it, or to bring a programmer into the company to develop the software from scratch.

 

Definitely ignore that price and have a look yourself

[sted]

I'm a little skeptical on what i'm about to say here but the last IT guy has told me when they asked for a price to re-write the code it was going to be somewhere around the £85k-£90k mark. As a business with a profit turnover of £250,000 a year that's a pretty big chunk to be saving for.

 

I'm going to try and learn a little bit more about the ins and outs of the program and then go about getting quotes from freelancers myself. I don't think it should be anything like the £90k price point i've been told.

 

its also possible they were quoted silly money as nobody wanted the job

[localzuk]

That is a ludicrous amount, it would be cheaper to buy Visual Studio, do a course yourself and then rewrite it, or to bring a programmer into the company to develop the software from scratch.

 

Definitely ignore that price and have a look yourself

 

Indeed. I'd be advertising for a full time programmer to do it personally! Get someone in-house!

[NerdNamedMatt]

its also possible they were quoted silly money as nobody wanted the job

I second this - The guy who originally created it is perfectly capable of bringing it up to scratch, but the only way he would agree to it is if he did it full time. Can't say I blame him, he's doing 2 peoples jobs as it is.

[JRowley]

I second this - The guy who originally created it is perfectly capable of bringing it up to scratch, but the only way he would agree to it is if he did it full time. Can't say I blame him, he's doing 2 peoples jobs as it is.

 

Actually he probably isn't, Superbase for windows was built on the 16bit Api, it simply wont run on 64bit versions of Windows. It's not really a standalone application either, Superbase is a database, so his application is closer to an Access database with forms, macros etc. atleast that is my understanding.

 

So for it to be rewritten to 32bit/64bit would require a lot of work as you would likely need to use a different database to power the application, and it would need to be written in a different language. So ultimately it is a huge job, but the price isn't realistic.

[bossman]

@NerdNamedMatt

 

It would also be advisable if possible to make it web based for future proofing, depending on the database requirements this shouldn't present too much of a problem.

 

Plenty of web developers out there who would look at this for you but as you have stated you will have to look deeper into the program to find out exactly what it does, maybe the guy who wrote it could help?

[mrforgetful]

16bit programs do not run in a 64 bit environment.

 

Unless you actually run it on a 32bit system and then cobble together some way to present that to the user.

 

Take this opportunity to move away from ancient programs like that. If it's that important they will have someone make another program to replace it. If it's not that important that they're willing to do that every 10 years, it's not that important for you to jump through so many hoops.