[sims] Is Solus3 playing up?

[localzuk]

Oh how I'd love simple msi installation of Sims, with msp and msu files for updates or simple replacement msi files. *dreams*

[matt40k]

Your assuming that Capita only release 2 a year, not every 5 mins. I mean the only other software that updates as frequency as SIMS is your antivirus!! In the real world you'd be under a pile of installers figuring out which one you've deployed and which you still need to apply and in what order and trying to get onto supportnet to check you have the latest version and that they haven't withdrawn it just before deploy it. Or you'd assume your DB would upgrade, but it'll fail and you'll be rushing to uninstall all the client so you can push out the old version. You know I'm right, no stick with SOLUS3 and wait for it to be plumbed into SCCM.

[sparkeh]

That'll be like Microsoft bringing the start menu back.

No it wouldn't, that makes no sense.

 

Oh how I'd love simple msi installation of Sims, with msp and msu files for updates or simple replacement msi files. *dreams*

Agreed, this would be awesome. Fingers crossed it happens this time

Your assuming that Capita only release 2 a year, not every 5 mins. I mean the only other software that updates as frequency as SIMS is your antivirus!! In the real world you'd be under a pile of installers figuring out which one you've deployed and which you still need to apply and in what order and trying to get onto supportnet to check you have the latest version and that they haven't withdrawn it just before deploy it. Or you'd assume your DB would upgrade, but it'll fail and you'll be rushing to uninstall all the client so you can push out the old version. You know I'm right, no stick with SOLUS3 and wait for it to be plumbed into SCCM.

You are deliberately over complicating things. There is no need for it to be like this.

[localzuk]

That's the beauty of msu and msp files, they can be applied by whatever rules the developer sets. Keeping on top of them is pretty simple too.

[matt40k]

So you would just logon to Capita and download them, run the DB upgrades, deploy. Check back regularly to see if they need to rolled back? Or any more that need applying?

[sparkeh]

So you would just logon to Capita and download them, run the DB upgrades, deploy. Check back regularly to see if they need to rolled back? Or any more that need applying?

I can only comment on how it works here but under SOLUS 2 we worked like this: The LA sent a bulletin informing us of an upgrade, we ran SOLUS 2 to upgrade the server, grabbed the new setups from the server and allocated them out using whatever software distribution software the school used (we avoided letting sims apps update themselves). We rarely applied any other updates outside of main updates unless there was an issue that required a patch, then this would be released via SOLUS sent by the LA directly.

This seemed to work ok, msi rather than exe would have been nicer but it worked. I can't see why SOLUS can't be used to keep you informed of the latest versions and download the latest msi or msp or msu the way it used to download the old setup exe (I am right in thinking that SOLUS 3 no longer gives you the setups?).

Edited August 15, 2013 by sparkeh

[localzuk]

Most school installations involve a set of updates each year. We rarely have extra updates and they're done after being organised via our lea where that get released to SOLUS or as a patch to run directly.

 

So, it'd be just like now. The support desk would provide us with the updates as and when needed.

 

Either that, or per-school SCUP catalogs.

Edited August 15, 2013 by localzuk

[sparkeh]

Either that, or per-school SCUP catalogs.

^ even better.

[Griff]

Last day in school for me tomorrow so its not up if anyone from Capita is reading this and would like to offer to remote in and do the upgrade for me oh but il get the caretaker to open up for you because some of the agents don't work properly so you will need to just pop in and do those ones manually cheers I will pm the postcode across.. some 3 week old milk in the staff room fridge if you fancy a cup of tea while you are doing it...

[matt40k]

SOLUS3 doesn't give you .exe no, well it sneaky and hides them from you. Capita still provide them, Suffolk provides them on request. SOLUS2 doesn't update all the setups either, so makes sense to get the full set. So if your happy to spend the time and do it manually, you still can.

 

I can't see why you wouldn't use S3 at the moment - other then Capita's unreliable service. Thing you need to remember is software cycles are becoming more faster, look at SQL - 2000, 2005, 2008, 2008r2, 2012, 2012 r2, 2014 - Azure cycle is something like weekly at the moment! Capita will follow, unless they want to fall behind so expect it to increase and remember, Capita will be pushing cloud based SIMS in the next few years, just like MS is pushing Office 365 over Office 2013 so this is pretty academic.

[localzuk]

If they include proper integration capabilities then I don't see a huge issue with that.

 

But Capita are highly unlikely to make this sudden change. Why would they? They aren't losing customers at the moment, the money is coming in nice and steadily. They've got loads of third party partners integrating with their systems.

 

Reason not to use S3? Because its yet another tool for updating software where there doesn't need to be one. Use systems that exist already. But maybe that's just my '*nix' thinking coming out - use existing tools, string them together and do the job you want, rather than reinventing the wheel and increasing your development costs.

 

Capita keep saying that there are schools that don't have the capability to run such a setup? Its about time those schools modernise. Centralised network management has been around in schools for over a decade. If some schools still don't have that sort of setup, then they're a little behind the times.

 

You can't support every little odd, non-standard, setup. But you can support standards and ask people to follow them.

 

Adobe release their flash updates via a catalog for SCUP and it works well. I just deploy the original setups via SCCM (can be done other ways too), and then WSUS (or in our case SCCM) keeps it up to date with all the security patches released. They release them pretty darn regularly too.

Edited August 15, 2013 by localzuk

[sparkeh]

Capita keep saying that there are schools that don't have the capability to run such a setup? Its about time those schools modernise. Centralised network management has been around in schools for over a decade. If some schools still don't have that sort of setup, then they're a little behind the times.

The annoying this is that there was the capability to support those schools in S2, the clients updated themselves. Job done. Capita put the schools in that position by taking away that capability.

[matt40k]

SOLUS2\SIMSLOAD was born in the era where users had local admin, a trojan was a batch file you wrote and replaced the Microsoft Word shortcut. Users shouldn't update software - bad idea, that leads you to ClickOnce stuff, very nasty, putting applications in user profiles. Very bad. Bad, bad, bad. Excuse me whilst I go wash myself to get rid of those horrible memories.

 

I think it's time you got a promotion @localzuk, your starting to talk like those people who came up with the BCSF idea, before it got corrupted!! Problem you've got is you've said MS tools, but then someone else will say something else, like CentraStage (which works over HTTP), then someone else will say something else. I agree, someone needs to say, use this, job done, next problem. Thing is, Capita has. If they say SCCM, then someone like CentraStage will say it's unfair and sue Capita. Logic doesn't last long in the real world.

 

Going back to the SIMS in the cloud point, they can't be like Blackberry, they've got to keep pushing, otherwise Aspire\Bromcom\etc will use the speed at which they can push out changes to take over. Capita knows this. How many times have you had a change\bug that requires an application change and you've been told to wait MONTHS.

[apearson]

Well, according to supportnet, as of 15:20, it is meant to be working again, but I'm still getting the module load error.

[Ghostgame]

Keep trying.

Its been intermittent for me in that sometimes it works, sometimes it don't.

Just keep trying until it does.

[apearson]

Keep trying.

Its been intermittent for me in that sometimes it works, sometimes it don't.

Just keep trying until it does.

 

Supportnet says the problem is fixed. If I have to keep trying, surely then, it isn't

[Ghostgame]

If you do experience any further issues then please do let us know. We will be monitoring calls and forums to pick up if performance issues re-occur in addition to monitoring the servers directly.

 

As the man says, let them know.

[apearson]

My post above just did that!

[Ghostgame]

Could always be a bit more direct and ring them

[apearson]

If the school wasn't closing at 4:00pm, I would do!

[John_Howarth]

SOLUS 3 seems to be working again now. I can authorise patches and releases to schools as normal and they're being deployed as I type.

[PhilNeal]

We've upgraded 200 schools this afternoon via Solous3 so I'm more confident that it is back up and running properly.

[apearson]

Time to reopen my case with Capita I think. Still getting the module not loaded error.

[Griff]

Same still getting it

[JonathanWood]

Hi Griff and apearson,

 

if you message me your contact details I will get a member of our support desk to contact you as a high priority to investigate this further,

 

Regards,

Jonathan Wood

SIMS Product Manager