Apple Configurator + Supervised iPads + iTunes

[cbsc]

Apologies if this question has already been asked elsewhere, but I'm hoping someone can offer some guidance on the following...

 

We have x number of iPads that have been set up using Apple Configurator, that are 'supervised', and are used by multiple users (i.e. not on a one-to-one basis).

 

My first question is whether it's possible to import MP3 (or similar) files into iTunes, without purchasing them online? We are particularly interested in files that have been created by students (not on the iPad), so hold no copyright. If so, can someone please explain to me how this is done? Since the devices are 'supervised' it doesn't appear to be possible to sync the devices with any PC/Mac running iTunes - so it would appear that we would need to employ an alternative method.

 

My second question is whether it's possible to import MP3 (or similar) files into Garageband (or similar music Apps) using any method other than iTunes?

 

I'm aware that we can access music from cloud based solutions such as Dropbox, iFiles, etc. or a WebDav server but it appears that to work with music files using Apps such as Garageband the music needs to be located within iTunes. I'm sure someone else must have the same predicament, so I'd appreciate any advice on how you got around this.

 

Many thanks!

[jallsop]

There are apps out there that enable disc usage, and you can then drop the MP3 files into that app. You could also consider something like file explorer, which could then allow navigation to a public shared folder on your network, where the files reside. The students can then stream them directly, without having to store them, hence saving space on the iPads themselves.

[cbsc]

Many thanks jallsop for your reply.

 

The issue is that I believe the audio files need to be in iTunes for them to be imported and edited using apps such as Garageband and DJ Mixer Pro - which is the specific requirement.

 

I just need to know how, if at all, it's possible to get the files into iTunes. I'm hoping someone out there can offer advice. If there is a specific App that can move a file from a WebDav/cloud share into iTunes, I would appreciate it if someone could give me the name of it.

 

As previously mentioned, we are using Apple Configurator in supervised mode. All iPads have been set to use the same Apple ID, as suggested by Apple when using the VPP model.

[SovietRussia]

Many thanks jallsop for your reply.

 

The issue is that I believe the audio files need to be in iTunes for them to be imported and edited using apps such as Garageband and DJ Mixer Pro - which is the specific requirement.

 

I just need to know how, if at all, it's possible to get the files into iTunes. I'm hoping someone out there can offer advice. If there is a specific App that can move a file from a WebDav/cloud share into iTunes, I would appreciate it if someone could give me the name of it.

 

As previously mentioned, we are using Apple Configurator in supervised mode. All iPads have been set to use the same Apple ID, as suggested by Apple when using the VPP model.

 

How many iPads are you using with your Apple ID? Just out of curiosity as some people say its limited to 10 per ID

[Boon72]

How many iPads are you using with your Apple ID? Just out of curiosity as some people say its limited to 10 per ID

 

i've got 48 on 1 AiD

[cbsc]

i've got 48 on 1 AiD

 

Yes, there is no issue using the same Apple ID on multiple devices. This is Apple's recommendation as per their "iOS 6 Education Deployment Guide":

 

http://images.apple.com/euro/education/docs/ios_6_education_deployment_guide.pdf

 

So does anyone else have any suggestions? We are following the "Institutional Ownership" model as described on P.29-33 of the guide.

 

Are there any Apple Distinguished Educators out there that can offer advice? We would prefer not to have to switch to the "Layered Ownership" model, and rely on our students to upload files/music themselves - although that may be the only solution.

[jdell]

CBSC - your Apple configurator what is this running on ? I have been working on a similar project at our academy, if you can give me an over lay of what you are working with I am hoping I can help.

 

First thing is - What are you running Apple configurator on

Second - WiFi - what do you have in terms of coverage where these devices will be used/what system are you using.

Finally your ISP - who are you using (local goverment or 3rd party) and do you run your own firewall

[cbsc]

CBSC - your Apple configurator what is this running on ? I have been working on a similar project at our academy, if you can give me an over lay of what you are working with I am hoping I can help.

 

First thing is - What are you running Apple configurator on

Second - WiFi - what do you have in terms of coverage where these devices will be used/what system are you using.

Finally your ISP - who are you using (local goverment or 3rd party) and do you run your own firewall

 

Hi there,

 

We are running the latest version of Apple Configurator on an iMac with OS X 10.8.2 if that helps!

 

We have a managed Ruckus wireless system that covers the whole site.

 

Our internet is provided via the LEA, although it passes through our own firewall.

 

I'm not exactly sure that this information will help with the specific information I'm after. As I mentioned before, we're following Apple's shared ownership model by the book, and from a conversation I had with an Apple support managers he believes (nobody at Apple can give cast iron guarantees) that storing/sharing files within iTunes is possible once you've adopted this model.

 

Thanks in advance for any help you can offer!

[jdell]

First of all I found the same with Apple which is they dont really know how it will all work once in place, they are helpfull on very specific issues but allot of it is just hit and miss. I am going to have a read through my notes and I will get back to you.

[SovietRussia]

The Apple iOS in Education guide is very helpful, I recommend a read.

[cbsc]

The Apple iOS in Education guide is very helpful, I recommend a read.

 

I've most certainly read it! It's useful from a perspective of getting things set up at a basic level.

 

However, it's of no help regarding the question I have posted on this forum, and neither has anyone been at Apple. It would appear that they don't really offer 'support' as such for an Enterprise Deployment. I certainly haven't been able to get any thus far.

 

I've been able to figure out how to get files into Garageband by using the assign feature in Configurator, but I'm still searching for clarification regarding my first question above.

[Driftingashore]

I've never used it, but could you use something like i-FunBox (i-FunBox v2.1 | File Manager, Browser, Explorer, Transfer Tool for iPhone, iPad & iPod) to transfer music onto an iPad, backup that iPad, and have the others restore from that backup?

[Sean-OC04]

cbsc,

 

Just to clarify your questions a bit more...

 

You want to be able to import tracks onto the iPads that have been created on another Mac then imported into iTunes?

 

The only way I know of how to do this is to use the iCloud and the music app on each iPad as Garageband for iPad can not import a song stored locally, you have download the entire song first using iCloud, more info in link below..

 

http://help.apple.com/garageband/ipad/1.3/index.html#chs9b4455fc

[Driftingashore]

Hah, after a lot of confusion, I think I've just figured this out.

 

The key sentence is in this PDF: "Additionally, supervised devices can’t be synced with iTunes or with Apple Configurator on a different Mac"

 

Now, I think most people read this as "with iTunes; or with Apple Configurator on a different Mac", but it seems as if that's incorrect. I just tried syncing a supervised iPad with iTunes on the same machine as I have Configurator installed, and it worked. On any other computer, it fails.

 

So to summarise: you CAN use iTunes to load content onto your supervised iPads, but iTunes HAS to be installed on the same machine as the one you're managing them through Configurator on to do so. At least, that's how it's working for me.

[cbsc]

cbsc,

 

Just to clarify your questions a bit more...

 

You want to be able to import tracks onto the iPads that have been created on another Mac then imported into iTunes?

 

The only way I know of how to do this is to use the iCloud and the music app on each iPad as Garageband for iPad can not import a song stored locally, you have download the entire song first using iCloud, more info in link below..

 

http://help.apple.com/garageband/ipad/1.3/index.html#chs9b4455fc

 

 

Interestingly, that was the first thing the guy from Apple started to suggest, before I pointed out to him that according to the Deployment Guide iOS 6 in Education (http://images.apple.com/euro/education/docs/ios_6_education_deployment_guide.pdf) it states:

 

"iCloud services are for personal use only and should not be used by institutions"

 

P.37, under the heading "Understanding iCloud".

 

We have after all implemented the "Institutional Ownership" model, as we don't want students logging in with their own Apple IDs.

 

In answer to your question - yes we are indeed hoping to import music tracks onto the iPads that have been created on another device (Mac/PC/other iPad/Soundcloud, etc.). Most Apps attempt to import the tracks from iTunes, hence the reason we're keen to somehow get the files into iTunes.

Edited March 19, 2013 by cbsc

[cbsc]

Hah, after a lot of confusion, I think I've just figured this out.

 

The key sentence is in this PDF: "Additionally, supervised devices can’t be synced with iTunes or with Apple Configurator on a different Mac"

 

Now, I think most people read this as "with iTunes; or with Apple Configurator on a different Mac", but it seems as if that's incorrect. I just tried syncing a supervised iPad with iTunes on the same machine as I have Configurator installed, and it worked. On any other computer, it fails.

 

So to summarise: you CAN use iTunes to load content onto your supervised iPads, but iTunes HAS to be installed on the same machine as the one you're managing them through Configurator on to do so. At least, that's how it's working for me.

 

That's very interesting, because this is certainly not the case as far as we're concerned.

 

Naturally, this was the first thing we tried - but when you open iTunes (on the same iMac that's running Apple Configurator) it doesn't recognise the iPad and gives the standard message offering two choices of either restoring from a backup or building afresh.

 

Has anyone else managed to get iTunes working with an iPad that's previously been set up with Apple Configurator? The statement from the Apple Configurator Deployment Guide...."Additionally, supervised devices can’t be synced with iTunes or with Apple Configurator on a different Mac.".... would imply to me that supervised devices can't be synced with iTunes on any Mac (including the 'master') - which is also based on our own experiences.

[Driftingashore]

This is strange. Perhaps I'm suffering a very handy bug due to a subtle difference in the way we've set our devices up. Anyway, I'm running 10.8.3, Configurator 1.2.1, and iTunes 11.0.2.

 

Random things that may have caused this:

 

I completed the iOS 6 setup screen after supervising with Configurator - not before.

iTunes is authorised for the institution's Apple ID.

 

I was going to do some trial and error re-supervisions to see if I could reverse engineer the cause, but our internet connection is atrocious, and I can't restore until after 6.1.3 downloads.. which could be a while.

[cbsc]

This is strange. Perhaps I'm suffering a very handy bug due to a subtle difference in the way we've set our devices up. Anyway, I'm running 10.8.3, Configurator 1.2.1, and iTunes 11.0.2.

 

Random things that may have caused this:

 

I completed the iOS 6 setup screen after supervising with Configurator - not before.

iTunes is authorised for the institution's Apple ID.

 

I was going to do some trial and error re-supervisions to see if I could reverse engineer the cause, but our internet connection is atrocious, and I can't restore until after 6.1.3 downloads.. which could be a while.

 

Finally, I've managed to speak with someone at Apple who knows the product!!

 

They have confirmed my thoughts that once a device has been configured as "supervised" using Apple Configurator, it will not work with iTunes (whether on the original Mac, or an a different Mac). This is by design.

 

Driftingashore, I'm not sure how you set things up your end, but Apple have said what you described as impossible! Maybe you've inadvertently cracked their system Either way, it's not meant to be possible.

 

I was pointed in the direction of a useful video tutorial (for those starting out on the arduous task of setting up iPads)...although it was no use to me, as we have already set things up as described:

 

Apple - Education - Resources - Videos

 

From my own experience, and based on the conversation I had today with Apple support, I would not recommend (or wish on my worst enemy) the "Institutional Ownership" model. Interaction design at its worst, and an awful user experience for both IT personnel and students alike. Sadly, I can't see any real alternatives. We don't want to go down the "Layered Ownership" model, as this would involve our students having to create and use their own Apple ID and install their own apps. Interestingly, this would also officially preclude 2/5 of our students who are under the age of 13 (the others would need to seek parental consent):

 

iTUNES STORE - TERMS AND CONDITIONS

 

I realise there is no technical limitation, but we prefer to do things 'by the book'!!

 

Not sure what else to say, other than arrrrgggghhhhh!!

[JJonas]

They have confirmed my thoughts that once a device has been configured as "supervised" using Apple Configurator, it will not work with iTunes (whether on the original Mac, or an a different Mac). This is by design.

 

 

Does that mean that supervised iPads cannot be wiped and used with another computer running iTunes? or would you need to unsupervise them first?

[SovietRussia]

Not sure what else to say, other than arrrrgggghhhhh!!

 

I agree, im pulling my hair out trying to get Profile Manager to work, its really shocking, Apple put no thought into management and enterprise of these things, but are so keen to push it to Schools.

[cbsc]

Does that mean that supervised iPads cannot be wiped and used with another computer running iTunes? or would you need to unsupervise them first?

 

Yes, you can always wipe an iPad and use it on another Mac running iTunes. You just lose all the settings, data and apps! However, it's recommended to unsupervise them first to claim back the app codes that you've already allocated to it.

[cbsc]

I agree, im pulling my hair out trying to get Profile Manager to work, its really shocking, Apple put no thought into management and enterprise of these things, but are so keen to push it to Schools.

 

The only thing I'd say in defense of Apple is that they never designed the iPad to be used in an enterprise environment...and they developed the Apple Configurator product as an attempt at making enterprise deployment easier.

 

You can understand why Apple restrict certain functionality (in terms of enterprise deployment). It's to safeguard their profits. Simples

 

The problem is that in the mean time, CEOs / Headteachers are buying these devices, handing them over to their IT departments and telling them to "make them work!". The reality is that the iPads do not work when used as a shared device. The sooner people realise this, the better.

[Driftingashore]

Finally, I've managed to speak with someone at Apple who knows the product!!

 

They have confirmed my thoughts that once a device has been configured as "supervised" using Apple Configurator, it will not work with iTunes (whether on the original Mac, or an a different Mac). This is by design.

 

Driftingashore, I'm not sure how you set things up your end, but Apple have said what you described as impossible! Maybe you've inadvertently cracked their system Either way, it's not meant to be possible.

 

I'm posting this for the sake of my own sanity as much as I am to prove that it actually works for me

 

The vid shows the iPad in Configurator, then iTunes on the same machine, then iTunes failing on a Windows VM. Now I'm going to be spending hours trying to work out what the hell I did to cause this..

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n2i4dxKCCM

 

Excuse the frustrating lag of the poor old mac..

Edited March 20, 2013 by Driftingashore

[cbsc]

I'm posting this for the sake of my own sanity as much as I am to prove that it actually works for me

 

The vid shows the iPad in Configurator, then iTunes on the same machine, then iTunes failing on a Windows VM. Now I'm going to be spending hours trying to work out what the hell I did to cause this..

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n2i4dxKCCM

 

Excuse the frustrating lag of the poor old mac..

 

Excused!

 

That's very interesting, and I'd be interested to know if anyone else has managed to replicate this?

 

Unlikely, but I guess it can't be anything to do with it running off VMware fusion (I have no experience with the product)? I don't suppose you have another Mac (OS X only) that you could test/replicate this on? I have tried on a couple of different Macs, and the iPad won't sync with iTunes (once supervised).

 

You may want to remove your YouTube video before Apple catch on and put a stop to this treason!!

[Driftingashore]

I don't think it would have anything to do with Fusion - that's just running the Windows VM because I was too lazy to get up and install iTunes on a physical machine to make sure it wouldn't work anywhere else. Sadly I sold my other mac a few weeks ago, so don't have another to test with. I could try creating an OS X VM, but then Apple really would have reason to sue me!

 

I'm starting to wonder if it's something to do with when I played around with iFunBox - I tried to copy an iTunes Library from an unsupervised device (originating on the iTunes that is now working) over the iTunes library on a supervised device, and Configurator didn't like it until the iPad was unsupervised/resupervised. This is going to bug me for a long time, and I can't test things out because I can't get iTunes not to work on the master machine! Arg!

 

But if you want to buy an old macbook pro, I have one that's got some pretty nifty management features!