Apple iPad 2

[localzuk]

Compare it to the HTC Desire HD. The spec of that is in most cases the same as or better than the iPhone 4.

 

Just choosing one retailer - Expansys.

 

The HTC Desire HD comes in at £399.99 + whatever microSD card you want to put in it (£21 for a Class 4 16GB). So lets say £420.

The iPhone 4 16GB comes in at £659.99. That is £240 more expensive.

 

Are you *really* getting £240 more capability? No! Not in a million years.

 

The battery thing is hugely important to me. For £5 I can get replacement batteries for my phone. If I go travelling, I can buy a load of them, charge them before I go, and just swap them out when they're dead - and I don't need to go scrabbling round for a power socket etc...

[CHR1S]

The iPhone 4 16GB comes in at £659.99

 

Wow, I paid £499 exactly for mine not long after release, im guessing they are roughly the same price now.

 

£420 & £499 are far closer than your £660 most expensive quote I could find to prove a point analogy

[Haptic]

Have you bought it in the last 14 days? You can get the £100 difference back if you go into the shop AFAIK.

 

Actually, the lazy about with an iPad is perfect choice. Can spend hours on YouTube and various other blogger sites effortlessly.

 

Really? even if bought from Tesco? (Clubcard points ahoy!)

Yeah the battery life is pretty awesome also

[Tunster]

Wow, I paid £499 exactly for mine not long after release, im guessing they are roughly the same price now.

 

£420 & £499 are far closer than your £660 most expensive quote I could find to prove a point analogy

It's £510 now after the VAT hike. Comparing the £399 and £510 prices - £100 extra is well worth it. It pays for the Apps store hosting, MobileMe 'Find My iPhone' is included now and is very good at shutting down a lost phone, constant iOS updates, the Mac shops and their excellent non-sense support (especially for the first year warranty and just having to arrive at a store - rather than sending the phone somewhere by post), the extra development into the next phone. Pays more than just the hardware you see. The engineering and design as I keep saying surpasses the Desire HD (even though I do admire that phone and seen it in action) IMO. Also, what phone around the 400/500 quid mark gives you a 300PPI screen? (I refuse to say retina screen as that's just a marketing term).

 

Another thing, your SD card can broken in many ways if you decided to pop it in and out all the time. Big minus!

[Domino]

It's £510 now after the VAT hike. Comparing the £399 and £510 prices - £100 extra is well worth it. It pays for the Apps store hosting, MobileMe 'Find My iPhone' is included now and is very good at shutting down a lost phone, constant iOS updates, the Mac shops and their excellent non-sense support (especially for the first year warranty and just having to arrive at a store - rather than sending the phone somewhere by post), the extra development into the next phone. Pays more than just the hardware you see. The engineering and design as I keep saying surpasses the Desire HD (even though I do admire that phone and seen it in action) IMO. Also, what phone around the 400/500 quid mark gives you a 300PPI screen? (I refuse to say retina screen as that's just a marketing term).

 

Another thing, your SD card can broken in many ways if you decided to pop it in and out all the time. Big minus!

 

Can we not go round and round in the iPhone debate *again*...

 

If you're happy with your iPhone -great

If you're happy with a Desire - great

 

Personally, I found the iPhone too restrictive after a year or so of usage - and the move to android has given it a lot more 'play' potential, which I love :-)

 

However, its not for everyone - and other than any argument, you have to admit the popularity of the iPhone has kicked the smartphone development business up the butt more than anything else, so we're all winners!

[Tunster]

Really? even if bought from Tesco? (Clubcard points ahoy!)

Yeah the battery life is pretty awesome also

 

I would give an Apple Store a ring or the technical/or sales support line to clarify. I've seen that info go around the MacRumor forums and it's been done with the iPhone or iTouch before when people have bought the older product so close to the new release.

 

Apple - Legal - Sales Policies - U.K. Retail Sales

It's there in black and white under the "Pricing" section. What other companies do that?

Edited March 4, 2011 by Tunster
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[localzuk]

Wow, I paid £499 exactly for mine not long after release, im guessing they are roughly the same price now.

 

£420 & £499 are far closer than your £660 most expensive quote I could find to prove a point analogy

 

That was the first one that turns up in a google shopping search for me.

[Tunster]

That was the first one that turns up in a google shopping search for me.

Of course Google are going to tamper with the price of a rival product .

[ZeroHour]

For those replacing iPads with iPad 2, money to burn and no excuse to replace, its a little thinner (which is nice) but not much lighter (which was the big issue) with exactly the same screen. The original doesnt particularly feel slow so why get a faster version for the sake of it? and lets face it when would you use hdmi out often enough to justify the expense. Remember also if you find browsing slow os 4.3 has speed improvements for all there.

 

For me an apple fanboy is someone who refuses to admit that they even have any issues (Apple products, not the user ). Those are the apple users I dont like, the ones who slate windows and have nothing negative to say about apple!

I can admit the faults in windows and I see the faults in apple products but when someone says "its not a fault/I dont need that (copy and paste for example)" etc and then shout how they couldnt live without the feature and apple are brilliant for bringing it, please wake up.

[LosOjos]

I'd love to know the f-in troll is on this forum that keeps neg repping people whenever they say something bad about Apple - I'm a goober am I? Pathetic - no need for personal insults!

[CHR1S]

That was the first one that turns up in a google shopping search for me.

 

Was being pedantic mate, just having a bit of a friendly wind up

[GrumbleDook]

The nice thing about the HDMI out for me is the desktop mirror instead of having to rely on people coding to use the APIs (which was the way folk were planning to do stuff).

 

Airplay wil be improved for more Apple Apps, but the APIs need to be easy to use for other apps to. That way you would not have to use the adaptor to get *everything* from the iPad screen onto another display. As it is with airplay, you have to pick up a new AppleTV for do it (not a bad price for the device ... arguments for or against iTunes, etc not withstanding) but that is another £100.

 

I'll be pulling down the GM Seed over teh weekend to try out for both the iPad and AppleTV so will find out how much has improved, but I still would like to get to the stage of a device we can hand around kids, hooked into a media system with display, still allow the multi-touch interactivity and be fun to use. Whilst some would see it as a small thing, for me this is a large leap for how the device can be used ... but I am looking at a particular area that i know some others will not be.

[synaesthesia]

...with Apple kit being premium devices...

 

Therein lies my argument. I agree that the phones and iPad etc are what I would consider "premium quality". Their PC's and laptops however are *not*.

 

And yes, I will agree that it really is daft to berate anyone for liking one product over another - after all, you use what you like and like what you use. What's the point in using something just because other people say you should?

 

Please be careful of the difference however, between berating Apple/their products and their users. Most of their users will be unaware or ignorant of what Apple do/have done to get where they are now (some innovation, some re-branding, lots of bull) but then again you can say the same of many companies in the modern world.

[Tunster]

Therein lies my argument. I agree that the phones and iPad etc are what I would consider "premium quality". Their PC's and laptops however are *not*.

I'd love to know why you consider them not to be "premium products". Just curious really although I appreciate your opinion. When look at each angle for premium quality;

 

the chassis' are top quality (how many chassis' are made of pure aluminium?)

hardware is well ahead of the top consumer CPUs for PCs (I'm talking more about their Mac Pro desktops - I'll admit the MacBook Pro, Mac Mini and iMac's are consumer orientated and don't exceed spec against most of the PC market)

although personally, the OS side of things is easy peasy top to toe. Considering my aunt who's an amateur computer user managed to put together and setup an iMac from scratch without my help. Even getting the iMac onto the internet and setting up e-mail.

 

They're just a few examples, but the reason I think we're not seeing the desktops/laptops coming down in price is because they're making a fortune on the iPhone/iPad/iTouch and App Stores. There's no need to bring any price down and they have to bridge a gap between the PC market and themselves. Apple products are different and if you want one, you have to pay for it. They accept they won't be able to saturate the PC market and steal sales from Microsoft on an OS level.

 

One more thing, even Samsung have just pulled plans for their 10" Galaxy tab in the light of the iPad 2. Key reason; pricing. If we consider Apple products to be premium, how can Samsung defend pricing their products £150+ more than the highest spec iPad. That's an estimate anyhow. But it's made the whole market rethink again for sure some thought the iPad 2 would go up in price.

[tech_guy]

I have both an iPad and a HTC Desire. Sometimes I don't know which to stroke first

[mattx]

I have both an iPad and a HTC Desire. Sometimes I don't know which to stroke first

 

Dirty boy.

[mattx]

You know what ? As my new job is going to pay me a bit more of the old 'beer vouchers' I may get an ipad. I'm not joking by the way. Just to keep up with Tech ' steve jobs lover lover ' Guy.

Will it connect to my wireless printer anyone know ? An Epson Stylus SX420W.

[ZeroHour]

mattx: rep before - rep now _, meeting tech_guy has infected you with something I suspect best get that checked out, its fast acting.

[mattx]

mattx: rep before - rep now _, meeting tech_guy has infected you with something I suspect best get that checked out, its fast acting.

 

I remember when the tablets first came around [ a few years ago wasn't it ] - the technology was pretty awful then - I've only used an ipad a few times but was impressed with the touch element. I will have a go with different types too and then will make up my mind but it may have to be the ipad2..... [ if it works with my printer ]

If I do get one I will take a photo of me using it at home and you can all mock me.....

[tech_guy]

I am really Tom Jones.

[synaesthesia]

Tunster: That opinion is based on the failure rates for kit when I was working in IT recycling (and the amount of it I still repair privately now). The chassis has always been form over function - solidly built certainly and I don't think many people on the planet will deny they are pretty, but they more often than not are murdering the contents. Airflow is minimal, stock temperatures which really are too high for the components. The unibody kit is supposed to act as a heatsink however it's not particularly efficient at that without the air involved. The mainboards and components used are typically of the quality you expect from Asrock or low end ECS kit - certainly not something I'd pay that amount of money for. The MBP's have had power regulation problems for as far back as I can remember, putting undue stress on the rest of the components. This is something that I've seen from just about all manufacturers at some point but most of them actually make attempts at putting it right; also it's something that only really started to be a problem from when they started punting x86 kit (I'll still swear at the PowerPC kit but for entirely different reasons - I'm still physically scarred by some of the old G4 kit!)

 

Generally for the money, I like to see people getting value for money which is something I find difficult with a majority of Apple's kit. I have no objection to their existence or use, certainly within education. I firmly believe young adults need exposure to all the popular formats to properly set them up in the future - like it or not, this hardware is very commonly (questionably, maybe) used in the media industry and therefore I like to see them being used in media departments. Just because one (or many) people don't like something, naturally doesn't mean that students should be without that experience. It certainly used to grind on me in the "good old days" when Macs were prominently used for DTP - like today, the success of the hardware seemed to be entirely due to the software being used (and tied to it). Thankfully those ties are mostly severed with the exception of the admittedly excellent OS X.

 

Absolutely sick of the sight of iPhones - not because of any personal dislike of the product, but I appear to know far, far too many people with a penchant for doing nasty things to them involving keys, pavements, cars and pets. Find it odd that I've only had one other smartphone come to me for neglect based repairs, maybe it's just a popularity/obscurity thing

 

Of course these are my opinions, feel free to pick at them Same goes for the iPad2. I don't personally feel they have a huge amount of purpose in education but that could be swayed if I see the right application; rather like Interactive Whiteboards. I'll certainly only get dismayed at an Apple user if, like other religious people, they start getting pushed down people's throats without a thought for alternative solutions.

(Yes, I tend to think of Apple as a sort of religion or faith. It makes it easier to avoid slandering those who have a particular faith or loyalty)

Edited March 4, 2011 by synaesthesia

[mattx]

I am really Tom Jones.

 

Is that why I was throwing my boxers at you last week ?

[LosOjos]

At the risk of getting more negative rep (I've had a few beers, screw it!) this just popped up on stumble, thought you lot might like it:

 

http://scoopertino.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/apple_water_page-1024x998.jpg

[vikpaw]

I have both an iPad and a HTC Desire. Sometimes I don't know which to stroke first

 

I have a desire for an iPhone5

[jamesb]

I'd love to know why you consider them not to be "premium products". Just curious really although I appreciate your opinion. When look at each angle for premium quality;

 

the chassis' are top quality (how many chassis' are made of pure aluminium?)

 

I don't regularly bounce my devices around the room (not that an aluminium chasses would really help with that anyway) and I'm not an executive who needs to have everything in shiny metal. Plus whether aluminium chassis which can conduct heat well enough to cause burns aren't really my thing.

 

hardware is well ahead of the top consumer CPUs for PCs (I'm talking more about their Mac Pro desktops - I'll admit the MacBook Pro, Mac Mini and iMac's are consumer orientated and don't exceed spec against most of the PC market)

 

So one particular desktop range are reasonably well-specced? Then again, a quad-core machine starting at $2499 (Apple store pricing) isn't really my idea of being ahead of spec. My laptop's got a better proc than that, and was cheaper (double the memory too, and a better graphics card). Hmm, nope, not really seeing how that's well ahead of top consumer CPUs for PCs.

 

although personally, the OS side of things is easy peasy top to toe. Considering my aunt who's an amateur computer user managed to put together and setup an iMac from scratch without my help. Even getting the iMac onto the internet and setting up e-mail.

 

Purely anecdotal - my grandfather who's an amateur computer user was quite capable of setting up his desktop machine, getting on the internet, and uses it to write his sermons when he gets invited to speak at the local church, among other things.

 

They're just a few examples, but the reason I think we're not seeing the desktops/laptops coming down in price is because they're making a fortune on the iPhone/iPad/iTouch and App Stores. There's no need to bring any price down and they have to bridge a gap between the PC market and themselves.

 

Yep - same as the budget-designer type clothes (I mean lets be honest, if you want a PC along the lines of a proper designer label you'll go Alienware).

 

Apple products are different and if you want one, you have to pay for it.

 

Different isn't automatically better. It's arguable if they're really different at all in most cases. It's this sort of attitude that makes me feel like railing against them, the same sort of pretentiousness that people get about designer clothing, for reasons that are just as flimsy.

 

They accept they won't be able to saturate the PC market and steal sales from Microsoft on an OS level.

 

Yep, quite true.

 

One more thing, even Samsung have just pulled plans for their 10" Galaxy tab in the light of the iPad 2. Key reason; pricing. If we consider Apple products to be premium, how can Samsung defend pricing their products £150+ more than the highest spec iPad. That's an estimate anyhow.

 

Estimate from where, just out of curiousity?

 

But it's made the whole market rethink again for sure some thought the iPad 2 would go up in price.

 

Wow. Samsung's become the whole market overnight. I'm still waiting for a decent reason for tablets to come along, at the moment they seem to be (mainly) overpriced toys and content consumers. Once someone manages to put something worthwhile on one, then I'll be interested.