Apple: Love it or hate it.

[Arthur]

They aren't the same card though are they? Why exactly do you think one is £80 and the other is £300?

You may find it hard to believe, but both cards do use exactly the same GPU - the Juniper XT. One of the main differences between the FirePro V5800 and the Radeon HD 5770 is that the drivers for the FirePro are optimized and certified for the major CAE and digital content creation applications like AutoCAD, Pro/ENGINEER, Houdini and Maya where accuracy and reliability are absolutely essential. The additional certification obviously takes time (and therefore money) which is why the cards are more expensive. You also have to take into account the target market. While you and I would hesitate at paying an additional £220 for what is essentially the same graphics card, most companies would not.

 

The FirePro V5800 is designed to be AMD's powerful mid-range performer that provides support for driving three displays, offers 2.5x the computing capability over their previous-generation mid-range ASICs, and has 1GB of GDDR5 video memory. The V5800 core is derived from the Juniper XT GPU, which is the chip found in the consumer-grade Radeon HD 5770. There are 800 stream processors to be found on this GPU, 64GB/s of memory bandwidth and its power consumption is less than 75 Watts. (Source)

 

The certification of AMD FirePro and AMD FireGL accelerators by software application vendors assures professional engineers, designers and animators that the AMD FirePro and AMD FireGL line delivers a stable and high performance workstation graphics environment on both Windows and Linux platforms.

 

The rigorous and exacting certification processes, conducted by software vendors, puts AMDs FirePro and FireGL graphics accelerators up against a battery of simulations and real-world scenarios, ensuring compatibility and stability required by workstation users. AMDs quality assurance engineers also carry out comprehensive compliance, performance and functionality verification tests, and work closely with application and workstation vendors to refine the AMD FirePro and AMD FireGL products, thereby creating the highest level of reliability and performance. (Source)

 

 

So of course it's a biased comparison

Obviously. I'm starting to think Localzuk is the only person in the thread who truly understands what I am saying. To do a fair and unbiased comparison, you have to limit yourself to the components the OEM offers.

 

I am not sure if the same can be done with Apple.

Apple Mac graphics cards are slightly different because the firmware needs to be able to support EFI-based systems. A standard graphics card won't work. This means the range of graphics cards you can choose from is very limited (I think the AMD Radeon HD 5770/5870 and nVidia Quadro 4000/FX 4800 are your only options unless you get something older). Perhaps this situation will change when the computer industry stops dragging their feet and make UEFI standard on all computers? I hope so.

[mac_shinobi]

Perhaps this situation will change when the computer industry stops dragging their feet and make UEFI standard on all computers? I hope so.

 

When UEFI becomes available does this ( hopefully ) mean that PC graphics cards will be compatable with apple macs so I can just shove any graphics card in a mac that has the correct graphics card slot ( so my 2008 mac pro ) I should hopefully be able to take a UEFI PCI Express x16 graphics card and it work or is that not the case because of the firmware on the apple mac graphics cards being different altogether ?

[SYNACK]

When UEFI becomes available does this ( hopefully ) mean that PC graphics cards will be compatable with apple macs so I can just shove any graphics card in a mac that has the correct graphics card slot ( so my 2008 mac pro ) I should hopefully be able to take a UEFI PCI Express x16 graphics card and it work or is that not the case because of the firmware on the apple mac graphics cards being different altogether ?

 

Depends on if Apples implementation is the same standard as what the new PCs ship with when they run EFI. It probably is but we are talking about Apple here.

[MK-2]

enough of this geek talk, lets get the topic back on track.....

 

apple, love it....nom nom nom

http://lifelogic.co.uk/images/apple.jpg

[localzuk]

Depends on if Apples implementation is the same standard as what the new PCs ship with when they run EFI. It probably is but we are talking about Apple here.

 

Which, knowing Apple, is not normally the case, lol!

[Norphy]

Even if it is, don't count on third party graphics cards working properly as there probably won't be OS X drivers for them!

[mthomas08]

*Apple hate it

Grrrr

 

Anyway I will not buy a MAC, besides the fact I work in IT to me there really is not a need for me to have a MAC. Although I have just purchased an IPhone4 which will turn up today. It replaces my phone and my ipod so it makes sense, I got it with sat nav so another bonus. My Ipod lasted for 5 years so hopefully this one does the same. I am not a Gizmo man, I dont fancy all the fancy new toys because they are a lot of money for some thing you should be using. Like a car, I brought a fiesta titanium new model 1.6 although I wanted a fancy car there wasnt so much a point so I still got something which has some good style, good engine and not expensive.

[Guest Guest]

While you and I would hesitate at paying an additional £220 for what is essentially the same graphics card, most companies would not.

 

And why is that? Why, when your livelyhood depends on it, do you go for the certified option over the cheap option? Why does a certified professional get payed more than one who isnt?

 

You can't possibly say the fair way to compare is to limit yourself to the components the OEMs offers, otherwise lets compare the Acer Revo to the Mac Mini; graphics card is similar, ram the same, HD the same, CPU... "but the atom is all the OEM sells".

Fair enough if we were comparing the 5770 to the 5750, where the price difference is only a few bob, but we are talking 3 and a half times the cost here, and teh difference between professional grade and consumer, not a fair comparison at all.

Edited January 20, 2011 by Guest

[mac_shinobi]

 

love apple - Wish I had that many as per the pic ( I mean apple macs not actual apples )

[soveryapt]

I have heard fresh lines can be pain with sky, I was previous a BT line with another provider (not bt) and moving was really easy and fast.

 

This was a line converstion from a BT line, so the line was in existance, but we were taking out a new number on it as the previous owners had taken their number with them. The line went active (for incoming) 2 weeks after the order, so I though great, BB on it's way soon, the line then went active about a week and a half later for outgoing, but Sky denied all knowledge of the line.

 

At first they tried to tell me that the line wasn't active and that if I checked I'd find the number was the same as the old number and that in fact our new number hadn't yet arrived, so I did the old BT Line Test facilities and it read back a different number to the old one (I had the old one as I'd been in contact with the vendors about a few things) so I rang Sky on the landline itself, and they still denied it existed .. I asked them (knowing full well they have call recognition CRM in place) to look at the number I was phoning from and they realised that it was the number they had assisgned, but still didn't believe that the line was active and on their system.

 

They said to hang up and try dialing 150 and that I would find that it still said "Welcome to BT customer services" or whatever their welcome message is, I asked the guy to phone me on my mobile whilst I was on as I'd already been trying to get through for I don't know how long, which they did, and I did the 150 and even put the received up to my mobile "Welcome to SKY Customer Services" was the message .. but they still didn't believe me ..

 

You don't know how angry I was at all of this. I asked one guy for compensation so he said we can't give you compensation for something you don't have, so that was it, he got a blow by blow account with names of people I'd spoken to, dates and times at which I'd spoken to them, the fact that they had cancelled the order 3 times themselves because they had f$$$$$ it all up (and yes, I did use that word, but was gracious enough to put "pardon my language here but it's the only word to describe your service so far" in front of it) and that this was the 4th order I was in and he wants to know why I want compensation ..

 

I then phoned them every day, once in the morning before work and once in the evening after work to keep tracking progress and generally annoying them as this was over 2 months into it ..

 

Eventually it got sorted and the service from them, although it's only a 2mb line because I'm on a rural exchange, it has been steady and good, it was just that first hurdle, and I've not spoken to anyone who has gone with Sky Broadband who hasn't had similar issues. I actually asked the guy, during the run down, "and exactly who gave you this award for your Broadband, do you not feel that you have been conning them or don't you care because it brings you more people along to disappoint?"

 

Anyway [/RANT] lol ..

[somabc]

Who is winning the smartphone battle? Not Android or Apple!

 

Take China with 277 million smartphone users.

 

http://www.blogcdn.com/downloadsquad.switched.com/media/2011/01/iresearchgraphovistore.jpg

[featured_spectre]

that maths dont add up there!

 

65.2% on OVI

57.7% on MMarket

 

By my maths that alone is over 100%....

[somabc]

that maths dont add up there!

 

65.2% on OVI

57.7% on MMarket

 

By my maths that alone is over 100%....

 

That just proves how successful they are!

 

Or possibly that people use more than 1 app store.

 

Details: iResearch

Edited January 20, 2011 by somabc

[localzuk]

Also, remember that China is a very different beast to the 'West' when looking at technology.

[sted]

that maths dont add up there!

 

65.2% on OVI

57.7% on MMarket

 

By my maths that alone is over 100%....

 

would that be because some people have multiple phones say a y-phone and a nokia and are saying yes to both in surves, maybe they have a nokia as a works phone and a y-phone as personal?

[Arthur]

Fair enough if we were comparing the 5770 to the 5750, where the price difference is only a few bob, but we are talking 3 and a half times the cost here, and the difference between professional grade and consumer, not a fair comparison at all.

Perhaps a better question would be, why aren't Apple offering workstation-class graphics cards as a build-to-order option on their website? Most home users don't buy dual quad-core Xeon workstations so I am not quite sure why you are complaining about the price of the FirePro.

 

By the way, did you see the ridiculous image Nephilim posted on page one of this thread? He is comparing a Mac Pro with off-the shelf components from NewEgg? How is that a fair comparison?

 

when your livelihood depends on it, do you go for the certified option over the cheap option?

If your livelihood depends on it, would you take the risk? If you (or your employer) are spending £2,500+ on a 2D/3D graphics or CAD workstation, why would you not spend an extra £200-£300 on top of that for a card which is guaranteed to work with the application(s) you will be using? There is no reason to skimp when potential productivity losses are involved.

 

You can't possibly say the fair way to compare is to limit yourself to the components the OEMs offers

As Localzuk explained, you are buying a complete system. You typically don't buy parts from various suppliers and fit them yourself because they won't be covered under the OEMs warranty. If the system has a next business day on-site warranty, you would obviously want an engineer on-site within 24 hours to replace any parts which are deemed faulty so you can carry on working. You won't be able to do that if you buy a HDD from supplier X and a graphics card from supplier Y. Do you honestly want to be diagnosing issues when you are working on a project and need to meet deadlines?

 

Why does a certified professional get paid more than one who isn't?

Being a certified professional doesn't really have anything to do with hardware certification. You don't have to be an AutoCAD Certified Associate to use an AutoCAD certified graphics card.