Tesla Model 3

[PotNoodleTech]

A wild guess, but a starting price somewhere in the region of £25,000?

 

($35,000 = £24,481.17 + £4,896.23 VAT @ 20% - £4,500 government grant = £24,877.40)

 

Your forgetting the real life dollar to pound conversion rate. $35,000 = £34,999

[Arthur]

Your forgetting the real life dollar to pound conversion rate. $35,000 = £34,999

I hope not, but you might be right.

 

In the US you can pre-order a Model 3 for $1,000, but in the UK it's £1,000.

[Geoff]

276K Pre-orders and counting

 

Tesla Motors receives $10bn in Model 3 pre-orders in just two days | Technology | The Guardian

[PotNoodleTech]

I've been keeping an eye on electric cars, the Leaf is just too boring externally and internally, The BMW I3 looks good and goes well but not keen on the skinny wheels. The tesla if it will be under £30k would be a front runner, it looks great, it goes great, and has twice the range - though I sincerely doubt it will be under £30k.

[Geoff]

I don't know. I think @Arthur had his maths right. Don't also discount the annual saving in fuel and road tax you'll get over the life of ownership too. My only misgiving is charging infrastructure, there isn't a whole lot up north outside of motorway services and inner city multi story car parks up north. With the range on the Tesla I could manage my work commute (44 mile round trip daily) with just home charging though. Edited April 5, 2016 by Geoff

[denzal2k4]

I don't know. I think @Arthur had his maths right. Don't also discount the annual saving in fuel and road tax you'll get over the life of ownership too.

 

Yep zero road tax and the cost of maybe £2 a day to charge it up, my leaf saves me about £4 a day in fuel alone. We always get shafted on US prices, think the PS4 and Xbox was the same in £s as it was in $s when it came out. I wouldn't be suprised if this was closer to £40k, but for that it is essentially a 5 seater sports car with all the toys.

[Geoff]

Yeah, but you could ship a Tesla yourself for £1,000 from Stateside (disclaimer: You must disassemble the car and send it as 'auto parts') Edited April 5, 2016 by Geoff

[howartp]

Bought a 2013 Leaf a fortnight ago, alongside my diesel (Peugeot Partner-Tepee).

 

Plan is to keep it 3 years then trade both in for something bigger, by which time bigger batteries will hopefully have become the norm - hence why I'm watching folk like Tesla get 215 mile range.

 

Current fuel equivalent looking like £10 per month electric vs £50 diesel, but with the caveat that my commute is 12 minutes of mountainous hills so I don't get the economy that others would get.

[denzal2k4]

Surely you would then get whacked with 20% tax as soon as it hit UK shores?

[Geoff]

If you ship it as a car, then yes you are looking at about a 35% mark up. If you disassemble it stateside then put it back together again no, as the tax only applies to finished goods. Not 'components'. You can do the same thing with anything like this, so you could take iMacs apart and ship them as electronic components and then put them back together again and sell them. Invalidates the warranty of course.

[unixman_again]

What you could do, is go to the US with a friend and each buy a Tesla 3 in LA. Drive to New York via Florida and then each sell the car to the other party. The car is now second hand and has done more than 6,000km and is VAT exempt.

[Norphy]

Steering wheel would be on the wrong side though. That'd bother me more than paying the extra money.

[PotNoodleTech]

If you ship it as a car, then yes you are looking at about a 35% mark up. If you disassemble it stateside then put it back together again no, as the tax only applies to finished goods. Not 'components'. You can do the same thing with anything like this, so you could take iMacs apart and ship them as electronic components and then put them back together again and sell them. Invalidates the warranty of course.

 

Not true. You'll get wacked for TAX and customs duty/charges on even components. Anything from the USA will be automatically banged by the tax man. If you want to test it out try buying a PSU (that's an electronic component) from the USA and see if it get's in tax free. It won't.

 

Also - throwing you're warranty away on a car as electronically complex as a Tesla would be an absurd idea. If something went wrong with the batteries for example, the replacement cost of just the batteries, would be a write off and can't be DIY'd as getting just wire wrong on a 400v lithium battery would be like setting off a small nuclear payload in you're garage. Say bye bye to you're house!

[unixman_again]

Anything from the USA will be automatically banged by the tax man. If you want to test it out try buying a PSU (that's an electronic component) from the USA and see if it get's in tax free.

 

I think it depends on the whim of the tax man. I've imported Dura-stilts from the US and they arrived tax free but a set of three books about Russ Meyer weren't.

[Geoff]

Not true. You'll get wacked for TAX and customs duty/charges on even components. Anything from the USA will be automatically banged by the tax man. If you want to test it out try buying a PSU (that's an electronic component) from the USA and see if it get's in tax free. It won't.

 

Only if the boat comes directly to the UK. As long as you ship via a tax haven it's ok. I ship through Barbados for these sorts of things.

 

Also - throwing you're warranty away on a car as electronically complex as a Tesla would be an absurd idea. If something went wrong with the batteries for example, the replacement cost of just the batteries, would be a write off and can't be DIY'd as getting just wire wrong on a 400v lithium battery would be like setting off a small nuclear payload in you're garage. Say bye bye to you're house!

 

Entirely accurate.

Edited April 5, 2016 by Geoff

[Arthur]

The RHD Model 3 will finally be available to order in the UK next week.

 

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1121478988386324481

 

 

It's interesting how other car manufacturers have suddenly added pre-order pages for their forthcoming electric cars too.

 

VW's ID will be available to pre-order the week after the Model 3 on 8th May.

 

www.volkswagen.co.uk/e-mobility/en/id-family/id.html

 

Peugeot's e-208 GT is available to pre-order now too...

 

https://new208booking.peugeot.co.uk/en

[houlta]

I can't see the point myself.

I have an alfa mito diesel, it has zero road tax, does 65mpg regularly and cost me £6000 in 2015 on a 12 plate. I've done 75,000 miles so far and had to replace tyres, brake pads and the usual routine servicing but never spent more than about £400 per year on it.

It does me at least 530 miles before I have to pop another 40 litres in (I drive it quite hard on my commute down the A65 regularly overtaking) and it's not as if electricity is free or green for that matter. Manufacturing a new car costs somewhere in the region of 12 to 15 tons of CO2 I believe.

IMHO people who go out and buy cheap bangers for £1000 or less and run them for a year are probably the ones saving the planet.

 

I think electric motorcycles are a good idea as they are affordable and have a good range, when electric cars can go for 500+ miles on a 5 minute charge and cost less than 10 grand , I'll buy one.

[bald_pig]

I can't see the point myself.

I have an alfa mito diesel, it has zero road tax, does 65mpg regularly and cost me £6000 in 2015 on a 12 plate. I've done 75,000 miles so far and had to replace tyres, brake pads and the usual routine servicing but never spent more than about £400 per year on it.

It does me at least 530 miles before I have to pop another 40 litres in (I drive it quite hard on my commute down the A65 regularly overtaking) and it's not as if electricity is free or green for that matter. Manufacturing a new car costs somewhere in the region of 12 to 15 tons of CO2 I believe.

IMHO people who go out and buy cheap bangers for £1000 or less and run them for a year are probably the ones saving the planet.

 

I think electric motorcycles are a good idea as they are affordable and have a good range, when electric cars can go for 500+ miles on a 5 minute charge and cost less than 10 grand , I'll buy one.

 

What is this electric motorcycle that is affordable with a good range, I'm yet to see one.

[houlta]

It depends what you call 'good' I guess considering the charge time and how far you expect to go on a bike.

The zero SR is around 160 miles on 95% charge which is meant to be between 1 and 1.5 hours iirc?

Not exactly stellar but faster charging than many of the cars and I'm guessing it's possible to carry a spare battery? Not cheap though by any means still.

There's vast improvements to be had with bikes if they focused on range instead of power, I'd love to see some alternatives for 125's for example.

[TechMonkey]

I can't see the point myself.

I have an alfa mito diesel, it has zero road tax, does 65mpg regularly and cost me £6000 in 2015 on a 12 plate.

I think electric motorcycles are a good idea as they are affordable and have a good range, when electric cars can go for 500+ miles on a 5 minute charge and cost less than 10 grand , I'll buy one.

 

I don't see this lasting, I think tax will change, if not just for diesels then for all vehicles. If a large portion of the population move to electric then tax will take a massive hit. It may be the impetus to move to a toll road approach or a miles approach with car trackers. Diesels got 0 tax due to their low CO emissions but no consideration was taken for all the other nasties they pump out. This has now been found to be a big deal so it won't stay the same for long, the government just have to work out how and when they do it to not upset everyone. Good luck with that.

 

Just as an interesting point, 500 miles would cost around £25 for the highest average p/KwH for the highest KwH per 100 miles car.

 

The bikes are interesting, I'm keeping an eye on them as an easy commute vehicle. Some of the smaller moped like bikes would be great if I lived in a city, and only cost a few grand. Full bikes are coming on though. Energica's released one last year that can charge (with the new level 3 chargers) to full power in 30 mins or 80% in 20 minutes.

[jmak]

I'm becoming less and less of a fan of Elon Musk, but he undeniably disrupted the EV industry. His models alone are taking massive chunks out of the market sector and I'm pretty sure that the big manufacturers wouldn't be trying nearly as hard to give up the oil habit if he hadn't given them a kick.

 

I won't be replacing my 12 year old car until it dies (I only drive about 5k/year now) and I agree that the huge carbon cost of manufacturing a car cannot be ignored. However, if you drive high mileage, a zero carbon vehicle (which if you choose the right electricity supplier it can be), the savings will outweigh the manufacturing cost within a few years. VW is claiming that their new factory will be run on green/ zero carbon energy, further reducing the environmental impact of manufacture. It's only a step on the way - manufacturing something new will always have a resource cost.

 

TL:DR My next car won't be powered by fossil fuels. The fact that it doesn't make sense for you to change your car now doesn't mean that it's not the better product for someone who is buying a new car to choose.

[IrritableTech]

I can't see the point myself.

I have an alfa mito diesel, it has zero road tax, does 65mpg regularly and cost me £6000 in 2015 on a 12 plate. I've done 75,000 miles so far and had to replace tyres, brake pads and the usual routine servicing but never spent more than about £400 per year on it.

It does me at least 530 miles before I have to pop another 40 litres in (I drive it quite hard on my commute down the A65 regularly overtaking) and it's not as if electricity is free or green for that matter. Manufacturing a new car costs somewhere in the region of 12 to 15 tons of CO2 I believe.

IMHO people who go out and buy cheap bangers for £1000 or less and run them for a year are probably the ones saving the planet.

 

I think electric motorcycles are a good idea as they are affordable and have a good range, when electric cars can go for 500+ miles on a 5 minute charge and cost less than 10 grand , I'll buy one.

 

I think in the next five years we'll be looking at some manufacturers who are selling the electric version of a model for less money than the combustion equivalent. Chinese car makers are producing huge numbers of electric only vehicles now because of the licence plate scheme in many of their cities. Almost every manufacturer now has a electric offering and even Shell are rolling out charge points to many of their petrol stations - the industry is having to change.

 

I completely take on board your argument that the energy used to manufacture a car is huge, and running an old car until it completely dies is a reasonable argument. However you are only accounting for CO2 - diesel in particular produces a lot more harmful gases than just CO2 out of the back.

 

On Saturday I traded in my old diesel and upgraded to a plug in hybrid. If we had the cash I'd happily trade the other petrol car for a full electric too.

[hallb15]

Lets all go to work on one of these:

[Arthur]

:eek:

 

 

The ASA should probably have a word with Tesla about the "Estimated Savings". It's very misleading, especially if your current car is already a hybrid or electric car.

 

Electric vehicles are less expensive to fuel than petrol powered vehicles. The average person drives approximately 12,500 miles and spends around £2,200 on petrol per year. In comparison, the cost of electricity to power Model 3 over the same distance is 7 times lower. Over the five year average length of car ownership, that's approximately £9,500 in petrol savings.

 

We've assumed a fuel economy of 7.4 miles per litre for a comparable petrol powered car. We've also assumed the national average of £0.16 per kilowatt hour for electricity and £1.31 per litre for premium petrol over the next five years.

 

[PotNoodleTech]

:eek:

 

The ASA should probably have a word with Tesla about the "Estimated Savings". It's very misleading, especially if your current car is already a hybrid or electric car.

 

 

Dunno, seems pretty easy to read to me, you are paying £852 per month in order to save £158 per month in petrol.

 

If you think that makes sense then go for it!