Academies agenda gathering momentum again?

[gsk]

Why not ask your bursar - s/he will be best placed to know if this is true.

 

Several people have said that its true, I just like to see things as they are announced without the interpretation that people have put on top of it.

[localzuk]

Several people have said that its true, I just like to see things as they are announced without the interpretation that people have put on top of it.

 

Sadly that isn't how a lot of education policy is done. Instead head teachers hear it from their contacts in the DfE, contacts in the LEA or via the Regional Schools Commissioner for their area. This is down to it being subtle changes in how things are done by the DfE instead of any grandiose changes in legislation or the like.

[LeMarchand]

Sadly that isn't how a lot of education policy is done. Instead head teachers hear it from their contacts in the DfE, contacts in the LEA or via the Regional Schools Commissioner for their area.

 

I have a cunning plan. We should all club together to get someone in the DfE to "mention" that technicians are going to be the school's most valuable resource in the coming years and that their wages should be much higher to prevent them going elsewhere...

[sparkeh]

It's good advice though. If your school is at risk of a forced conversion then go find a school to support you now rather than wait to say where you have to go.

I rather meant MATs approaching good schools and using these rumours to scare them into jumping onboard.

[zag]

I see the same old socialist arguments are coming out here that were present when the Academy system was introduced.

 

"Privitization by the back door!"

"Evil Tory Ideology strikes again!"

 

Really ask yourself this, is privatization so bad?

 

Shouldn't it be about the level of teaching at the end of the day, rather than the structure?

[Achandler]

I think its more the principle of you must be an academy by 2020 that the government is pursuing. So as oppose to being given the choice as inevitably Good and Outstanding schools that aren't academies right now are clearly providing the level of teaching required, but they might not want to become an academy.

[Love_Sausage]

There certainly appears to be a rush on now for ourselves and the few other remaining maintained schools to set up MATs before we're pushed. Options include taking on a couple of feeder primaries or taking a lower performing secondary under our wing - though how accountable we would then be for the underperforming secondary seems to be the sticking point for Governors with that option.

[localzuk]

Really ask yourself this, is privatization so bad?

 

Yes. It really is. Especially in an area as important as education. It interferes with what the kids are being taught. It removes vital money from the system and pays it into the hands of the private entities running schools (they aren't doing it for free).

 

Private entities should be no-where near education IMO.

[CyberNerd]

Yes. It really is. Especially in an area as important as education. It interferes with what the kids are being taught. It removes vital money from the system and pays it into the hands of the private entities running schools (they aren't doing it for free).

 

Private entities should be no-where near education IMO.

 

Like the Capita,Microsoft cartels have been doing for years. If all that administration money could get ploughed back into teaching and learning....

[localzuk]

Like the Capita,Microsoft cartels have been doing for years. If all that administration money could get ploughed back into teaching and learning....

 

Not sure of your point. Capita and Microsoft sell products. Schools don't have to use them. A private entity running a school, after that school being forced into it doesn't give the school any choice about it. Their budget is managed by that private entity, and they can pay themselves whatever fees they wish.

[sippo]

Being a MAT isn't all bad. We were of the first MAT's in the country. Yes some changes have happened, but it's for the good of the academy.

 

Some primaries were failing badly, but are now turning the corner.

[dblight]

Being a MAT isn't all bad. We were of the first MAT's in the country. Yes some changes have happened, but it's for the good of the academy.

 

Some primaries were failing badly, but are now turning the corner.

 

Same for us. One of the academies we took under our wing is thriving now and getting better and better. That surely has to be the end result.

[CyberNerd]

Not sure of your point. Capita and Microsoft sell products. Schools don't have to use them. A private entity running a school, after that school being forced into it doesn't give the school any choice about it. Their budget is managed by that private entity, and they can pay themselves whatever fees they wish.

 

I was just expanding the 'private entities should be nowhere near education' comment. Wondering if the govt put the same amount of money into a venture as schools already pay into Capita whether we'd have a better system.

[LeMarchand]

I see the same old socialist arguments are coming out here that were present when the Academy system was introduced.

 

"Privitization by the back door!"

"Evil Tory Ideology strikes again!"

 

Really ask yourself this, is privatization so bad?

 

Shouldn't it be about the level of teaching at the end of the day, rather than the structure?

 

Yes. It really is. Especially in an area as important as education. It interferes with what the kids are being taught. It removes vital money from the system and pays it into the hands of the private entities running schools (they aren't doing it for free).

 

Private entities should be no-where near education IMO.

@localzuk has already summed it up succinctly, but I'd also suggest that privatisation of any public service/amenity has the same problem.

[Quackers]

Being a MAT isn't all bad. We were of the first MAT's in the country. Yes some changes have happened, but it's for the good of the academy.

 

Some primaries were failing badly, but are now turning the corner.

 

Yep, one of our primaries was failing under the LEA went into special measures, it then became part of our MAT and now it has outstanding. The news seems to only highlight the bad academys and forgets the amount of excellent ones.

[localzuk]

I was just expanding the 'private entities should be nowhere near education' comment. Wondering if the govt put the same amount of money into a venture as schools already pay into Capita whether we'd have a better system.

 

Now that's a good question. With the history that government IT projects have? Its questionable. Then again, those projects have nearly all been outsourced to, well, we all know who...

 

Bear this in mind about my dislike of privatisation - I don't disagree with the concept of MATs. Local clusters of schools working together seems like the best way to organise education in fact, and I'm looking forward to our own MAT coming online, and the schools in our group working together to give our area's children the best education possible.

 

I disagree with the way the people at the top can take the money, pay themselves large salaries and hand out "consultancy" contracts to companies they own.

[sippo]

Yep, one of our primaries was failing under the LEA went into special measures, it then became part of our MAT and now it has outstanding. The news seems to only highlight the bad academys and forgets the amount of excellent ones.

 

And to bring all services under one umbrella makes economical and business sense. Academies are business, so cost cutting exercises will always happen. We had schools paying £10k a year for IT support. That is just ridiculous.

[sted]

And to bring all services under one umbrella makes economical and business sense. Academies are business, so cost cutting exercises will always happen. We had schools paying £10k a year for IT support. That is just ridiculous.

surely though if you want to bring costs down buying power up you want all schools in an area under one roof ie an lea?

[LeMarchand]

And to bring all services under one umbrella makes economical and business sense.

 

A bit like an LEA?

 

Academies are business, so cost cutting exercises will always happen. We had schools paying £10k a year for IT support. That is just ridiculous.

 

Whilst what they probably were getting for that was phone support (if they were lucky) that's not bad if they were getting a decent techie for a two or three days a week. I'd argue that particular problem could have easily been fixed without the need to go academy.

[CyberNerd]

surely though if you want to bring costs down buying power up you want all schools in an area under one roof ie an lea?

 

This isn't really the Governments goal. The goal is to get rid of LA's and introduce private money; it's an ideological goal. The 'spin' is that academy MATs perform better and save money but the data is dubious. Even if there was stacks of data to the contrary they would still pursue it.

[sted]

This isn't really the Governments goal. The goal is to get rid of LA's and introduce private money; it's an ideological goal. The 'spin' is that academy MATs perform better and save money but the data is dubious. Even if there was stacks of data to the contrary they would still pursue it.

well no the government dont want to run anything they want everything to be a run for profit organisation they can get on the board for or make huge consultancy fees

[zag]

This isn't really the Governments goal. The goal is to get rid of LA's and introduce private money; it's an ideological goal. The 'spin' is that academy MATs perform better and save money but the data is dubious. Even if there was stacks of data to the contrary they would still pursue it.

 

I think the goal is actually to make schools perform better. I don't think it has anything to do with private, public money or Ideology.

 

The academy system, I believe is based on the Scandanavian model, the reason is they have one of the best education systems in the world.

[localzuk]

I think the goal is actually to make schools perform better. I don't think it has anything to do with private, public money or Ideology.

 

The academy system, I believe is based on the Scandanavian model, the reason is they have one of the best education systems in the world.

 

If that were the case, then they have failed. The evidence that's around so far indicates there's no difference in performance between academies and LEA schools.

 

Interesting that you point at the Scandinavian model. Sweden didn't use this system until relatively recently, and evidence so far is that it doesn't make things better, and in fact has made them worse. What the Scandinavian model (pre-free schools) did have was less interference by inspections, statistics and bureaucrats. Teachers are in charge in their schools, and kids are allowed to be kids.

 

With all this evidence showing it doesn't work, why is the government not pausing this process to re-evaluate? Simply because it is an ideological thing, and not about raising standards.

[GrumbleDook]

The other thing about Trusts and MATs is that it reduces the amount of work the DfE has to do to manage them rather than dealing with lots of individual schools (an unnamed source in DfE). It also means that there is a layer of accountability that can be attacked / shifted if it needs to be ... whether by getting rid of the trust (changing the trust, etc.), shifting the MAT management or by attacking the school and leaving the next level up alone ... it gives more political options (unnamed politician).

 

We must do something.

This is something.

We must do this!

[sippo]

A bit like an LEA?

 

 

 

Whilst what they probably were getting for that was phone support (if they were lucky) that's not bad if they were getting a decent techie for a two or three days a week. I'd argue that particular problem could have easily been fixed without the need to go academy.

 

We provide services at no profit, or gain. We aim to give the best advice possible. A business would be looking 'make money' from the school.