andrewdeegan Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Good morning, I am not sure if i have posted this in the correct location. If i haven't let me know please. I am currently looking at purchasing either SISRA or 4Matrix to help with our analysis. I have read a thread on here comparing both tools but that was in 2013. I am just wondering if anyone has any new thoughts on either pieces of software. It seems to me that SISRA seems to be a more web based analytical tool and 4matrix is better for reporting/printing reports. Any advice or thoughts would be greatly appreciated. Many thanks Andrew
GeorgeVince Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Good Morning, We use SISRA here and it's a really powerful analysis tool, I can't speak about 4MATRIX because I've not personally used it. SISRA allows subject coordinators to almost effortlessly analyse individual students or headline figures (whether they use it is another matter...). The only downside is ensuring data is up to date in SISRA as it can sometimes be a headache maintaining SIMS and SISRA in unison, a change in grade in SIMS means you must also manually change the grade in SISRA. I don't know if 4MATRIX syncs with SIMS somehow or the importing of data is also done manually. You're right - SISRA is web based, however, personally I use it to export data and generate my own reports and graphs using Excel. SISRA also provide great web support, I took my role on at the beginning of the year having never worked at a school before and they were always more than happy to help with any queries I had with the software.
truebluesteve Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 We use 4Matrix here and whilst I can't comment on the quality of the data it produces, it does seem to be well liked here by those staff that use it. It is also very easy to install and set up.
andrewdeegan Posted February 9, 2016 Author Posted February 9, 2016 Hi, Yes SISRA seems to be the more popular choice. I think you need to export the data from SIMS for SISRA and 4Matrix. It is just the idea of exporting everything to excel each time that is putting me off SISRA 4Matrix seems to have built in reports that i could just print direct after the data is uploaded for teaching staff instead of exporting large volumes of data back in to excel.
winng Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 We have both for our Federation of schools. The Statisticians (Data Managers to you and me) prefer 4Matrix for KS3 and KS4 with SISRA for KS5 analysis. 4Matrix is bulk updated/refreshed when you first log in to it, and on subsequent occasions, if required.
synaesthesia Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 SISRA is used and apparently quite liked here.
andrewdeegan Posted February 9, 2016 Author Posted February 9, 2016 The issue i have is that we currently provide class data and transition matrices to all staff using reports we have built in Excel that use data extracted from SIMS. We upload these reports as PDFs on to the network so staff can see their own classes. I do not think either piece of software can replace this process unless staff are willing to log on and interact with the data themselves.
bigdannyb79 Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 The issue i have is that we currently provide class data and transition matrices to all staff using reports we have built in Excel that use data extracted from SIMS. We upload these reports as PDFs on to the network so staff can see their own classes. I do not think either piece of software can replace this process unless staff are willing to log on and interact with the data themselves. Maybe you need to think about the benefits of getting staff to logon and interact with the data themselves ! I would say they need to be, a static transition matrix on a sheet of a4 achieves nothing - being able to instantly drill to the 3 student lagging behind is what you want staff to be doing. I dont want to spend my time chuggin out pieces of paper when the information is available in a more powerful and interactive form already. Its a culture change but one that most teachers and schools are realising is beneficial. I don't think your original question is a valid one as they are different products with a different purposes for me - but if its whole staff visibility of group info and exploring progress etc I'd say SISRA every day. If you exploring at a higher level and exploring groups of student etc at cohort level its got to be 4 matrix. I'd say used properly any secondary school would get value from having both. 4Matrix is sold as a leadership tool and I agree its more for the higher level analysis where sisra is great for enabling class teachers and subject leads to interact with their data. It is worth exploring the impact you want the info to have and I would suggest it can be better achieved by best practice use of SISRA rather than churning our transition matrices and group lists from excel - this also frees up your time to achieve something more effective than simply moving data from screen to paper. So in summary SISRA for staff, 4 Matrix for the big boys but absolutely get your teachers to get their hands dirty they will understand and engage with the information better and ultimately be more effective in class with a better knowledge of their learner's performance and potential. 1
bigdannyb79 Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 I would also say 4 Matrix makes it a lot easier to explore Progress 8 performance at student level - its the new headline measure and so being able to break that down and examine how students are contributing to headlines is key. Most schools are only just getting into this but 4 Matrix has got a jump on this area and it gives you all you need to start to look at intervention groupings etc in the new world of Progress 8. Sisra gives you the summaries etc but not easy to isolate cohorts for intervention / monitoring.
andrewdeegan Posted February 9, 2016 Author Posted February 9, 2016 Thanks for your thoughts. Our current reports that we provide staff are very comprehensive. I have told my college who created them to get out there and get them sold. They are brilliant. It is just becoming too much doing everything for staff hopefully one of these products can lighten the load and make staff interact with their own data
zag Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Just a warning about 4matrix, it seems to need administrator rights to upgrade every couple of months. I haven't found a way yet to let it auto upgrade on our teacher machines.
psydii Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Just a warning about 4matrix, it seems to need administrator rights to upgrade every couple of months. I haven't found a way yet to let it auto upgrade on our teacher machines. Really? While we side stepped the issue and use it as a RemoteApp, the documentation does have instructions for allowing installs without Admin access. Also I'd have thought that one could push out the MSI using System Centre. Back to the topic though: SISRA is web-based and thus (in theory) end-user device platform independent. 4Matrix is a .net client/server application and therefore tied to Windows. That said, this tweet/response suggest that despite SISRA being web-based it only works well on Windows based browsers: https://twitter.com/sisraonline/status/506765306292101120. I can find no statement on their website as to client side device requirements for full functionality. Edited February 9, 2016 by psydii
bigdannyb79 Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 sisra's old version was pretty much IE only but latest one is fine in anything - analytics is the new version of online and that is now defunct - I use it in chrome all the time. And 4 matrix updates just copy over files so I think so you can do updates by providing write access to 4 matrix folder without admin rights. So neither is an issue really. I'd visit a local school that have either and it will allow you to see whats possible but also ask how they address some of the needs you are wanting the solution to fulfill. Demo's are fine but you'll learn so much more from sitting with an existing user.
bobsmith Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 I've used both and like them both, but they are very different products in how they present data to you. 4matrix do a trial period, take them up on this! SISRA do a live web demo with their person talking you through it on the speakerphone. It's very much personal preference as to which you and your school prefer. If I had the budget I might even run both, I'm pretty sure some people do! 1
andrewdeegan Posted February 9, 2016 Author Posted February 9, 2016 Just had the demo for SISRA seems to tick all the boxes for staff wishing to interrogate the data. I think it lacks some standard reports that can be quickly printed but then i suppose that is what SIMS is for.
Meldrew Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Just a warning about 4matrix, it seems to need administrator rights to upgrade every couple of months. I haven't found a way yet to let it auto upgrade on our teacher machines. We've recently moved from SISRA to 4matrix. 4 matrix is much cheaper and supports the new numbered levels and flightpaths (I just install it I don't understand what it does exactly, but this was a problem with SISRA). Regarding the upgrading, we just changed the settings file to tell clients not to upgrade (use the config program that comes with it) and we have a single, manually installed PC which is set to do the upgrade. I use this to upgrade 4matrix using its self update system. I then export a new MSI and roll this out via GPO. Meldrew. 1
Sylv3r Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 We've had Sisra for a number of years, but have also now bought 4Matrix in the last couple of months. Yes, theres duplication in both products but they also work well as standalone products for various tasks.
Steve21 Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Just a warning about 4matrix, it seems to need administrator rights to upgrade every couple of months. I haven't found a way yet to let it auto upgrade on our teacher machines. Either give staff access on the 4mateix folder or using the network manager config tool you can make it update via another user account that has permission Steve
RootsSchImp Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 If your school has a sixth form then I might lean to CISRA - 4Matrix's KS5 package is pretty weak, no VA info for example, and they're working on a KS3 AwL upgrade at the moment. I asked them last month (jan 16) if there were plans to improve KS5 and they said 'in a few months' which I took to mean some time in ac year 2016-17.
CAM Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 4Matrix does a fantastic job at KS4. But I do wish they'd sort their network install out as it seems to fail at the slightest breeze on update day.
zag Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Thanks, just found the option in 4matrix connection manager(on the server) to install as a privileged user! Just run the wizard to change it.
Danp Posted March 10, 2017 Posted March 10, 2017 Sorry, to bump a 13 month old topic, but wanted to see if there were any further thoughts on any of the packages mentioned? 4Matrix, SISRA or Questa
bossman Posted March 10, 2017 Posted March 10, 2017 We use 4Matrix here and its been so stable and usable for all the Teaching staff, updates automatically and never had to touch it for 2 years once I installed the Server and deployed the application to all the 90 Teacher workstations, our Data manager just loves it. Have heard mixed reports that SISRA is quite complex for KS3 and KS4 but for KS5 seems ok as for Questa ive no idea.
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