DMX controller software

[rpain]

Hi,

 

We're due for an upgrade to our lighting set up and we'd had a zero 88 jester 24/48 board recommended. I've done some research and feel that getting an ethernet -> dmx adaptor with either a computer controller or even iPad (saw the luminar 3 app for about £80) will future proof us better. It's also considerably cheaper as the desk is about £1400 and the adaptor is just under £200.

 

With this in mind I spoke to the company who then suggested that eos etc nomad was a great piece of software to use. I've taken a look and it looks hugely complicated. An iPad does have an element of risk with the wireless connectivity, though.

 

I'm thinking that an MS surface may be the best way to go - it runs windows but can obviously also run wirelessly if we would find it useful in rehearsals. How do other people achieve this? I also took a look at 'showmagic' which looks slightly simpler

 

Advice welcome.

 

Thanks,

Richard

[robk]

What do you need your lighting desk to do? If you went with a Ethernet -> DMX (artnet) unit you could use either Luminar or something like Lightingpad (which is £14.99) from an ipad, or Chamsys MagicQ from a PC. I use a linx 10 tablet and CHamsys mini wing for the "big" shows and Lightingpad for smaller events. Are you looking at moving heads etc or just normal conventional lighting?

[rpain]

Just very simple stuff (for the moment). Basically scene crossfades and an ability to group lights when dealing with changes. I guess the most important thing is for it to be reasonably straightforward to operate. If we could get it to also trigger music/sound effects that would be great.

[mikeatactive]

Hi Richard

As a lighting specialist, my advice would be to have a good play with the software before committing to ANY brand. We come across so many "over clever" software based systems where the school staff are just too scared to use it due to the over-complicated functionality. It also depends who is going to be trained to use it and whether they are going to be available every time it's required. It's all very well having one competent user, but what happens when he/she isn't around, or is on holiday, or leaves?!

My other recommendation would be to try FreeStyler, which as the name implies is free to download and use. There is also a decent user forum.

Hope that helps?

Mike

[Oaktech]

The ETC option is grossly over complicated for what you say you need. My friend who works for the Royal Shakespeare Company uses the ETC software!

 

Take a look at all the other options that have been mentioned.

 

My personal favourite is the Chamsys software as I find using a keyboard and mapping keys to actions handy.

[ste78564]

We use Freesyler its basic but can be programmed to do scene or sequences. Supports alot of DMX controllers

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

Hi @rpain, looks like you have a few options on your plate, the first thing is to know what lighting fixtures etc you are using and also who is using the system.

I have worked in schools and an IT/AV tech and as a performing arts tech as well as doing freelance lighting work.

 

I have used a variety of lightings desks and lighting programs. Lighting desks like the Jester are fantastic if you have a generic (dimmers) based lighting rig as you have easy direct access to all the channels.

PC based programs and ipad apps are more designed for LED lights, basic intelligent lights and as a show backup solution. One of my favourite programs and desk manufacturers is Avolites, I love them, so much I owned a Tiger Touch 2 until a few weeks ago. The Avolites software (titan) can be used on a pc with a dongle for around £100. Would I put this into a school, most likely not. School lighting systems as generally dimmers based and the Avo software does not allow the easiest control of generic (dimmer) fixtures.

 

If you intend to have a mixture of lights, generic and intelligent/led lights Zero88 do the FLX, Solution and Jester ML consoles.

 

If you are serious about the software route I would highly suggest looking at getting an All In One touch screen especially if you are programming a show it will make it easier.

 

Another question I have, are you a primary or secondary school?

 

Hope that helps

 

Anthony

[NB9457]

+1 for the Jester. Although expensive, it is well built and they will last a long time. I'd get the Jester ML though, provides easy to use interface and scrollers to use moving lights. After a few half an hour sit ins with me, the kids got the grasp of it pretty quick and actually respected the equipment and made a decent light show!

 

The ability to plug a screen in is really useful too and I feel a full desk offers a lot more control of the fixtures.

[rpain]

Hi,

 

Thank you for all your ideas and recommendations. I'm now thinking of this:

 

http://www.freestylerdmx.be

ENTTEC: ODE LED Lighting & Lighting Controls : DMX, DALI, DSI, RDM, USB, Ethernet

 

...and a laptop/surface.

 

I'm not sure I can see any downsides to this. Am I missing something?

[mikeatactive]

Sounds sensible to me. Bear in mind you may also need to download the fixture-maker program for FreeStyler, unless your lights are in their standard database.

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

Hi @rpain

 

I sent you a pm earlier.

 

Anthony

[Chris_]

For controlling mainly dimmers and a few simple LED fixtures in a school I'd recommend something like the Zero88 Jester or ETC SmartFade. As much as I like using more advanced lighting control systems (Chamsys/Avo), in a school environment where it's to be used by staff/students, having a simple desk with physical faders would be the more user friendly. Like others have said, if you leave, will other people be able to pick up the surface/ipad and make lights happen!

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

For controlling mainly dimmers and a few simple LED fixtures in a school I'd recommend something like the Zero88 Jester or ETC SmartFade. As much as I like using more advanced lighting control systems (Chamsys/Avo), in a school environment where it's to be used by staff/students, having a simple desk with physical faders would be the more user friendly. Like others have said, if you leave, will other people be able to pick up the surface/ipad and make lights happen!

 

When I had my Avo TT2 I did take it in to the school I was working at a few times and the students loved it, and I mean loved it.... would I replace the Leap Frog with one umm no, to complex, the drama teachers would have a full on melt down trying to get that working, they had issues at times with a basic desk.

[NB9457]

When I had my Avo TT2 I did take it in to the school I was working at a few times and the students loved it, and I mean loved it.... would I replace the Leap Frog with one umm no, to complex, the drama teachers would have a full on melt down trying to get that working, they had issues at times with a basic desk.

 

If I remember correctly, the frog series used to have the frogger game built in? Hours of fun during a presentation

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

The Frog consoles although abit ugly looking in the green were a great console for the money. The Solution is the Leapfrog 24 and leapfrog 48 re branded with a new colour scheme.

I have busk'd a few lighting jobs on the Fat frog, not the easiest desk to busk a show on.

[Andrew_C]

I'm not sure I can see any downsides to this. Am I missing something?

Yup, a few things.

 

Learning curve - A desk with physical faders will be much easier for the inexperienced and teachers.

Ergonomics - In a real show, having access to dedicated controls provides a much better work flow.

Kit - How long is an iPad going to last in a relatively lightly supervised, dark, theatre? Hint; snowball in hell.

Wireless - Don't even go there! OK for rigging and rehearsal, but for a show? not on my watch.

 

Choice of kit? I loath Zero 88, but I'd buy that in your position over a dongle in a flash! Look at ETCs offerings; I'm out of touch on their current line up.

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

The Freestyler software is designed for the DJ with a few intelligent lights and a few scenes and chases.

 

The difference a proper lighting desk gives is massive. As @Andrew_C has said physical faders are much easier.

If you do go the wireless route I would put in a separate network with its own router. When I am on shows which are using networked systems I will purposely keep them all separate.

Ideally I would go for a static machine that cannot be moved and just get a usb dmx dongle.

 

The ETC desks are worth looking at, the range you would be looking at is the Smartfade as this both price and features match the Zero88 Jester range. The downside on the ETC is that it uses an SD card to save your files to where as the Zero88 has a usb port.

Strand do a range of consoles but would suggest staying away, I have found them to be plasticity and cheap feeling compared with the ETC and the Zero88.

[davethetekkie]

In the name of all that's good and holy do NOT rely on anything less than a purpose built lighting desk for a show. At school we run a Fat Frog and a cheap nasty little ACME/Chauvet thing to run our 4x moving heads... It's never let us down. At church we originally had a Frog and I arrived one day to find it replaced with a piece of software called Showmagic and the worst 15" touchscreen display I have ever had the misfortune to use. With one solution if I need a little extra light on demand it's a simple fader... On the software? You have to be on the right page... What should be a simple action turns into a few seconds of pratting around and by the time you've sorted it you've lost where you were in the script. Noooo spankyou. Gimme the right tool for the job any day of the week.

[howartp]

I'd agree with Dave here.

 

At church I have a DMX dongle that I intend using with software for small requirements such as Christmas Eve services or for testing/rigging as our lighting desk is locked away when not in use. (Currently Frog, but shortly FLX)

 

But for school events, I couldn't rely on software.

 

We used to use a SmartFade ML in our old hall which we've still got. Our new build theatre three years ago, we bought ETC Element (part of the Ion series). It's great for the three folk that use it regularly.

 

With the launch of the Zero88 FLX earlier this year, I was seriously looking at changing the school desk - until I accidentally came across some new features on the Element that actually answer my issues with it - and prove that if I took time to learn it, it could work very well for the occasional users as well as the regulars.

 

(If you're wondering, I kept getting stuck with channels up from previous user that I couldn't find the source for, which meant I couldn't give users a step by step solution to walk up and operate. I've now made a macro that clears all channels regarding of source, which allows occasional users a three button process.)

[dhicks]

We're due for an upgrade to our lighting set up and we'd had a zero 88 jester 24/48 board recommended. I've done some research and feel that getting an ethernet -> dmx adaptor with either a computer controller or even iPad (saw the luminar 3 app for about £80) will future proof us better.

 

If it's any help, the Enttec USB DMX Pro MK2 USB-to-DMX interface has an embeded Python-based web server (based on CherryPy), and is capable of acting as an interface for simple Ajax calls from a simple, static web page using JQuery. You can simply add your own HTML / JS / image files to CherryPy's static files store and create your own web-based lighting interface application.

[rpain]

Hi - thanks all for the advice. In the end I went with a smart fade 2496. What people are saying about physical faders is true - I just felt I needed to put my geekiness to one side as it won't just be me using it.

[VeryPC_Anthony_L]

Please that the advice and comments were helpful. It can be very easy to geek something up, I do it alot when actually its just needs to be simple.

[rpain]

I think the best thing is that I now understand different options so have avoided being over charged. In this case we saved nearly £700 by using a different supplier and make :-)

[Chris_]

Good choice! We've got a Smartfade 1248. Quite a neat little desk with some useful features such as MIDI show control. I'm going to be looking at using Qlab to run all the sound cues, and send MIDI commands to the desk to advance lighting cues for our next school production

[rpain]

Sounds great. Which version of qlab would suit my needs (just to basically trigger sounds on cue changes)? While money is being planned for this project I'd like to get as much bought to future proof rather than going back to them in a few months asking for more.