HMV goes bang

[elsiegee40]

And next up it's Blockbuster.....! - Blockbuster in administration - ITV News

I'm surprised they've lasted this long. People just don't rent DVDs these days.

[Arthur]

They should have closed up shop when Blockbuster USA went bankrupt in 2010.

 

http://s8.postimage.org/piihgejyt/356217080_c992878748_b_640x480.jpg

 

People just don't rent DVDs these days.

I imagine quite a few people rent Blu-rays through LoveFilm (or just download them illegally).

 

It seems that most people are quite happy renting/streaming inferior quality videos online through Netflix, iTunes and Google Play these days.

Edited January 16, 2013 by Arthur

[localzuk]

I used to rent from Choices, and then Blockbuster in Minehead when they were still open. They worked out cheaper than services like BT Vision or the like. 3 movies for a tenner for 7 days was a good deal.

 

They also did a good deal with second hand dvds.

 

They are yet another company that failed to sort themselves out with the digital world though.

[Gatt]

Biggest problem with Blockbuster, wasn't the price or whatever it was:

 

Having to rewind the VHS tape when you rented it, (you all remember VHS?!)

Then with DVD being forced to sit through half an hour of "you wouldn't steal a car" FBI / CIA / KGB propaganda about illegal copying, ans THEN another half hour of trailers..

 

At least with VHS you just had to rewind it to the start of the film (or FFwd past the trailers!)

[Pyroman]

Biggest problem with Blockbuster, wasn't the price or whatever it was:

 

Having to rewind the VHS tape when you rented it, (you all remember VHS?!)

Then with DVD being forced to sit through half an hour of "you wouldn't steal a car" FBI / CIA / KGB propaganda about illegal copying, ans THEN another half hour of trailers..

 

At least with VHS you just had to rewind it to the start of the film (or FFwd past the trailers!)

this ..

[Arthur]

Voucher holders are unsecured creditors, they come last in the debt list.

Some people don't seem to understand this, which is why the article below makes me really angry. Although the vouchers are worthless now, it doesn't mean it is okay to steal things from the store!

 

An angry grandfather walked out of a HMV store yesterday with three games after staff refused to accept his gift voucher.

 

Despite slipping into administration this week HMV stores continue to trade, but gift vouchers have been deemed worthless - angering many who received them at Christmas.

 

Eric Nolan, from Dublin, bought his grandson Cian a €40 HMV gift voucher for Christmas, but was told by staff in the Henry Street store it was worthless. Nolan had brought to the counter Euro Truck Simulator 2 (€22.40), The Sims 3 Town Life (€11.99) and Rail Simulator (€28).

 

At the till a 25 per cent discount was applied, reducing the total from €62.39 to €46.80. He then presented the voucher but was told it wasn't valid. So Eric simply took the games and walked out.

 

Security staff followed him down the street, according to the Irish Independent, but failed to prevent him making off with the goods. "Somebody has made a conscious decision not to pay out on vouchers and it's despicable," Mr. Nolan told the paper.

 

He intends to post the voucher and €6.80 to the store. "We are a nation of sheep - but I was determined to win this," he said. "HMV have taken hundreds of thousands of euro from the Irish people this Christmas and we shouldn't put up with it."

 

HMV is facing growing anger over its decision to refuse gift vouchers, and many customers believe the company should have stopped selling them in early December after warning investors of the coming crisis. Yesterday police were called to a HMV store in Oxford to sort out a dispute sparked when staff refused to accept vouchers from two customers. (Source)

[Earthling]

Where is the greater theft?

 

The board and probably all the major shareholders knew they were going into administration, but they still sold the Vouchers. Isn't that a form of stealing? It is, in my world.

 

I applaud that old man, and I'd do the same if, in good faith, I'd bought my grandson a voucher which HMV/the vendor knew was going to be worthless.

 

Companies and corporations get away with too much of this kind of thing, and it's always the paying customers and shop-floor staff who end up footing the bill.

[X-13]

it doesn't mean it is okay to steal things from the store!

 

You've given them money. They either give it back or you take good equal to the value of them.

 

I don't care about this "unsecured creditor" carp.

 

They knew this was going to happen but they continued to sell vouchers, thinking it'll be a bit of free money. [i've just realised I have a £10 gift card I got at christmas.]

[Gatt]

You've given them money. They either give it back or you take good equal to the value of them.

 

I don't care about this "unsecured creditor" carp.

 

They knew this was going to happen but they continued to sell vouchers, thinking it'll be a bit of free money. [i've just realised I have a £10 gift card I got at christmas.]

 

That's what I've been wondering lately, in that the purchaser of a Gift Card/Voucher has already coughed up the money for the card, so they should be entitled to goods up to the value on the card.

So I'm completely with the guy above - and have often thought about it myself when a few other places have gone bump...

[januttall]

Feel for the people working there same as Jessops, they pay for management mistakes really in operating.

 

Don't we all?

[mattx]

Well done Eric. What should happen now is that through the power of social media [ although I am not a fan ] - people with vouchers should all go into a store and stage a sit in until they get what they want from their vouchers.

[Gatt]

Well done Eric. What should happen now is that through the power of social media [ although I am not a fan ] - people with vouchers should all go into a store and stage a sit in until they get what they want from their vouchers.

 

Would put a new spin on the "Flash Mob" phenomenon!

[januttall]

Well done Eric. What should happen now is that through the power of social media [ although I am not a fan ] - people with vouchers should all go into a store and stage a sit in until they get what they want from their vouchers.

 

you'd close them down even faster that way it would be like a run on the banks in a way.(making it less likely every one will get there vouchers worth)

 

tho I do agree its not fair for the customer to lose out via a voucher they should be the first to be baled out.[Get at least there moneys worth]

Edited January 17, 2013 by januttall

[TechMonkey]

The issue with the Grandad 'stealing' story is that is HMV Ireland. I was informed that they are a separate entity and have not called in administration. In fact Ireland has no administration process, they have a different system all together.

[Arthur]

the purchaser of a Gift Card/Voucher has already coughed up the money for the card, so they should be entitled to goods up to the value on the card.

Vouchers and gift cards usually have a cash value of 0.00001p (it says so it in the small print on the back). The reason they are popular with retailers is because most of them never end up getting used (so it's essentially free money for them). That fact that you can buy a £25 iTunes gift card for £20 should tell you something.

 

I'd bought my grandson a voucher which HMV/the vendor knew was going to be worthless.

What's wrong with good old fashioned cash which can be spent in every single shop in the UK and doesn't expire after a year or two?

Edited January 17, 2013 by Arthur

[Devontechie]

The issue with the Grandad 'stealing' story is that is HMV Ireland. I was informed that they are a separate entity and have not called in administration. In fact Ireland has no administration process, they have a different system all together.

@TechMonkey HMV in Ireland have been put into receivership and from reading this page on the BBC news site (BBC News - Irish HMV staff stage sit-in protest as 16 stores close), the directors of HMV have requested that the Irish operation is closed down the 16 stores that employ about 300 people.

[Earthling]

Vouchers and gift cards usually have a cash value of 0.00001p (it says so it in the small print on the back). The reason they are popular with retailers is because most of them never end up getting used (so it's essentially free money for them). That fact that you can buy a £25 iTunes gift card for £20 should tell you something.

 

 

What's wrong with good old fashioned cash which can be spent in every single shop in the UK and doesn't expire after a year or two?

 

Nothing's wrong with good old cash.........HMV accepted it for one of their Vouchers, so what's wrong with honouring the Voucher?

 

Why should voucher holders/puchasers be last in the queue when it comes to reimbursement?

 

Like X-13, I don't give a toss about the 'Unsecured Creditors' crap, HMV took money for vouchers, when they knew full well they were going into receivership, they should honour the vouchers, full stop. Anything else is just corporate sharp practice at best, and stealing at worst.

 

But, oh gosh, these people are Company Directors and they live in big houses and drive big cars, surely they're too respectable to be guilty of sharp practice or stealing, aren't they?

 

If you're trying to say, 'Why didn't that old man give his grandson cash?', then you'd have to ask him, not me or us.

[Rawns]

Online shopper here, but you simply cant beat looking through the shelves to find something you didn't know existed.

 

Yeah you can. That's the beauty of things like Spotify and Grooveshark - they give recommendations based on what you're playing. I've found quite a few bands that way. Online streams are another great way (ie. gaming streams where they're playing music so you find new stuff there, or online radio stations).

 

With the way HMV changed their stores, you couldn't go in and browse anyway - they had hardly anything to browse.

 

Plus you can actually listen to the music you did not know existed removing the risk of buying some total garbage that you can't return in case you "copied it".

 

Was listening to Blink-182 on Spotify and found a Bluegrass cover CD and it was a seriously awesome find. The Hillbilly/Yokabilly version of 'All the Small Thinks' was classic!

Edited January 17, 2013 by Rawns

[Arthur]

Why should voucher holders/purchasers be last in the queue when it comes to reimbursement?

Because it's the law! People seem to have a strange perception that gift cards make better presents than cash, but they don't in reality.

 

They are vastly popular as presents and yet they come with a sting in the tail. Now Martin Lewis, founder of the consumer website MoneySavingExpert.com, is advising people to avoid gift cards and vouchers this Christmas because of the risk of losing all of your money.

 

"They're just a promise from a company, but if that company goes bust or changes hands you've no rights," he said. "Remember too that one of the ways that companies make money from vouchers is that many remain unredeemed."

 

The problems with gift cards and vouchers were highlighted again last week when JJB Sports announced that it would appoint administrators. The shops are likely to remain open, but, with the company changing hands after the administration, those left holding gift cards will find that they cannot spend them.

 

Gift card holders have no rights if a company goes bust

As JJB cardholders will find, if you have a gift voucher and the issuing company goes into administration, you are effectively left holding a useless piece of plastic.

 

Voucher-holders' money is not ring-fenced or protected if a company goes bust. Instead, you will be classed as creditors and by law must take your place alongside everyone else owed money by the failed company. Since voucher-holders are unsecured creditors, they usually find themselves at the back of the queue.

 

Millions of pounds' worth of gift vouchers go unspent each year

You might get a warm glow out of the fact that you have given your aunt £30 to spend on a new scarf, but if it is on a gift card she may well never do so. According to the GCVA, 6% of all vouchers go unspent. Given that £4bn of gift cards and vouchers are bought each year, that's £240m annually sitting on people's mantelpieces or in their bottom drawers.

 

Mr Johnson said the main reason for this was "consumer apathy". Another problem is that if your aunt ends up buying a scarf worth just £27, she may not bother to go back and spend the other £3 later. (Source)

[mattx]

Because it's the law! People seem to have a strange perception that gift cards make better presents than cash, but they don't in reality.

 

So what ? Laws are meant to be broken. Especially this one. If anything it was HMV who are stealing. They knew they were going under but continued to sell Vouchers.

Look on the bright side, if you get caught you get a free ride in a police car.

[Arthur]

Laws are meant to be broken.

I'll tell that to the police when I get nicked! If they have any questions, I'll send them your way.

 

They knew they were going under but continued to sell vouchers.

They almost certainly did, but I bet HMV thought it wouldn't matter because there is a chance Deloitte may be able to find a buyer for the business.

 

Deloitte is now actively searching for a buyer for the HMV chain in order to save the retailer, which accounts for a quarter of UK physical music and video sales.

 

The administrator said today that it has already had "very positive" expressions of interest in HMV, with several parties getting in touch following the firm's collapse. Hilco, the owner of HMV Canada, is said to be among those interested in HMV stores. (Source)

[Earthling]

HMV thought it wouldn't matter because they'd already taken the money for the vouchers.

 

Like I said, Sharp Practice at best, stealing at worst, and no amount of law-quoting is going to make it right.

 

Lawful? Yes. Right? No.

[Gatt]

So what ? Laws are meant to be broken.

I'll tell that to the police when I get nicked! If they have any questions, I'll send them your way.

@mattx kinda has a point - if laws were not meant to be broken, why would we have police to catch those who broke said laws?

[localzuk]

@mattx kinda has a point - if laws were not meant to be broken, why would we have police to catch those who broke said laws?

 

That's a somewhat Pratchett-like argument. Like saying "we're supposed to set houses on fire, else why would we have insurance and why would we need firemen?"

[witch]

@mattx is just being himself. Of course laws aren't meant to be broken. And we have police because we know that people will always break laws - not the same thing at all!

But I do wonder if there is an argument to be had about them selling gift vouchers if they knew that there was a problem with the company