10GB networks backbones needed?

[Rozzer]

I am assessing my current network and trying to future proof the network by looking at 10GB backbone. Only reason I am looking into it because we are looking at one to one devices to every child so potentially we would have over 1500 devices on the network. Majority of it will be on the wireless. Should I consider 10GB to 1GIG poe? Then upgrade my servers to 10GB connection to the core or am I over thinking it to much?

 

Any suggestions?

 

At present I have two virtual host servers with an MD3200i with two iSCSI switches with MPIO round robin. All running on Hyper V.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Ross

[chazzy2501]

looking at my virtual 12 servers for 500 workstations (most with gigabit) even at peak my virtual switches barley top 10Mbits. I'd not worry about it.

[Soulfish]

If your upgrading your current kit 10gb is a good way to go. Future proofs you for any future services - at the very least for that many PCs I'd be looking at multiple bonded 1gb links, but preferably bonded 10gb links. I'd also be looking at 10gb bonded links from the servers to the core (for virtual hosts at least) for iSCSI/general data etc.

[Cools]

i went with netgear for my switches years back with Full GIG and PoE they are not stackable so i had to do link aggregation

 

How To Set Up Switch Link Aggregation - SmallNetBuilder

[localzuk]

It all depends on what the devices are going to be doing. If they're going to be using 'cloud' data most of the time (ie. externally hosted websites) then I'd say 10G backbones would probably be overkill - but you'll need to look at your internet connection.

 

If you'll still have local file storage for them to access on their devices, then 10G might be advantageous.

[Rozzer]

We would be looking to run an internal cloud based solution ourself. We currently host an internal exchange. I have link aggregation setup already with some switches and using teaming on my virtual host servers.

 

My worry at present is with the iSCSI traffic.

[jamesfed]

My worry at present is with the iSCSI traffic.

 

If possible I would usaly go with a dedicated switch for iSCSI - that way the traffic dosn't touch your 'core' network.

[Rozzer]

I have two separate switches which are setup with MPIO which either are not connected to my core switch what so ever.

[glennda]

If possible I would usaly go with a dedicated switch for iSCSI - that way the traffic dosn't touch your 'core' network.

 

What he said for ISCSI

 

If you are replacing fibre put in 50/125 to support 10GB in the future and if possible go for switching which can be upgraded to 10GB at a later date.

 

I've just added a couple of 50/125 links and have a chassis switch that when the need arises can be upgraded to 10gb

[nicholab]

Don't forget switch SAS as an option.

[Michael]

Should I consider 10GB to 1GIG poe?

 

As time goes on, newer wireless standards that top wireless 'N' will come into play and gigabit speeds will be more important. It will then literally be a case of swapping 'G' access points for 'N' using the existing PoE standard. The only thing to bear in mind however is PoE+ delivers more power than standard PoE as the more powerful network devices become, the more power they'll most likely require. It would be a good idea to buy a switch that is PoE+ capable.

 

A good example is to think about it like this -

 

If you have an access point capable of 'G' and/or 'N' delivering 65Mbps to the majority of devices, connecting at gigabit would offer around 15 devices the full 65Mbps. If the access point is only connected at 100Mbps, all devices would still connect at 65Mbps, but speeds would be considerably lower. It would be more like 10Mbps per device in practice with 15 devices connected.

 

Of course to deliver the full 1000Mbps to access points, a 10Gig backbone would be recommended. Not necessarily today, but certainly in the near future.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Michael

[localzuk]

Don't forget switch SAS as an option.

 

I didn't know about this as a possibility! Awesome idea, and a *lot* cheaper than 10Gb

[SYNACK]

I didn't know about this as a possibility! Awesome idea, and a *lot* cheaper than 10Gb

 

Thats what we use - in a direct connected form - for our SAN, we only have three physical boxes tied to it so onboard connections are enough but they are really fast, leaves aggregated 1GBx2 ethernet in the dust by a large margin.

[nicholab]

LSI SAS6160 Switch looks an interesting product if you which to connect multiple SAS devices.

[Rozzer]

Can you use MS clustering and failover with switch SAS?

 

I currently have N capable access points with Aruba but currently have 100mg to the access points. I am upgrading that as a priority to make full use of N.

 

I just want to ensure that I am fully prepared for a lot of devices and a lot of money being spent. No school likes bad publicity when it comes to spending lots of money on a project and it flops due to not being prepared!

[localzuk]

According to LSI, their switches can be used in failover - just connect a channel to each switch from each device and set up on the web interface on the switches.

 

Not sure about clustering though.

 

Completely understand your trepidation and preparation - Bristol is particularly 'cut throat' with school catchments and kids choosing schools.

[nicholab]

Might want to have a look at

http://www.lsi.com/downloads/Public/SAS%20Switch/SAS%20Switch%20Common%20Files/LSI%20SAS6160_Switch_Config_Guide_092810.pdf

[Mehmet]

I am assessing my current network and trying to future proof the network by looking at 10GB backbone. Only reason I am looking into it because we are looking at one to one devices to every child so potentially we would have over 1500 devices on the network. Majority of it will be on the wireless. Should I consider 10GB to 1GIG poe? Then upgrade my servers to 10GB connection to the core or am I over thinking it to much?

 

Any suggestions?

 

At present I have two virtual host servers with an MD3200i with two iSCSI switches with MPIO round robin. All running on Hyper V.

 

Thanks in advance

 

Ross

 

It's difficult to say whether you would benefit from upgrading to 10Gb without seeing your network topology and typical bandwidth usage. I'd also be interested to see how you plan on connecting 1500 devices wirelessly; how many devices will you be connecting per wireless router? What wireless router are you planning on using?

[CyberNerd]

pretty much in the same boat with the 1:1 ratio planned.

I'm putting in the 10gigabit core tomorrow - 4x A5800's (24 10GbE ports) and 2 x BNT 20 port 10GbE switches.

 

I would also say that 10GbE is necessary if are using virtualisation heavily - a physical server with a couple of gigabit NIC's isn't going to hold up very long if you have a few network heavy servers running on it.

[east]

Considering you are planning to future proof your set up and are expecting a lot more wireless devices to come into the network and also have 'N' standard wireless, 10GbE is a no brainer IMO. Having a solid backbone plays a key role to the full network infrastructure. As time goes on, there will be increased demands that smaller device will place on bandwidth requirements also and this needs to be factored in also.

[Rozzer]

We currently have 80 Aruba 105 N access points the system was specced to support 30 devices per classroom. Its not really been tested because that would be a lot of kit needed!

 

I could spend a lot of time working on this. Could any suggest south west companies who could provide the kit and recommend a solution?

 

Thanks for everyones comments its good to have validation

 

Ross

[IanT]

Do you really need 10Gb speeds in schools - in my opinon, no, overkill

[CyberNerd]

Do you really need 10Gb speeds in schools - in my opinon, no, overkill

 

when would you need it? 2,000 devices? 5,000?

[IanT]

Couple of sites I ran a few years ago with 3,000 devices+ (desktops, servers, waps, printers etc) ran pefectly fine without a 10Gb Infrastructure, I know and speak to alot of (high up!) network engineers and they all say 10Gb Infrastructure for a school (for example) is just wild! and will take a very very very long time get used to there full potential. Edited April 4, 2012 by IanT

[CyberNerd]

Couple of sites I ran a few years ago with 3,000 devices+ (desktops, servers, waps, printers etc) ran pefectly fine without a 10Gb Infrastructure, I know and speak to alot of (high up!) network engineers and they all say 10Gb Infrastructure for a school (for example) is just wild! and will take a very very very long time get used to there full potential.

 

You had 3000+ devices, booting up at the same time, connecting to the same file servers and you didn't notice and bandwidth delays or iscsi bottlenecks on gigabit switching. I'm impressed.

How did you do it?