[sims] Sims Learning Gateway.... a failure?

[plexer]

TO be fair, there are not that many mainstream MIS suppliers so is not a massive task for them to like with them all... but I agree that SIF is the way forward.

 

It may technically not be a big task however they understabably tend to mainly develop for the mis used by the majority.

 

Ben

[GREED]

It may technically not be a big task however they understabably tend to mainly develop for the mis used by the majority.

 

Ben

 

That is very true. SIF really needs to come on board in the next year. Translate your concerns to a US market with 15 major players, not 2/3 in the UK! Our partners have it easy!

 

I guess there is a good amount of lock in when Suppliers do that, better revenue dare I say... Not that anyone would want to do that anymore...

 

Rather customers are more wary of this now.

Edited January 22, 2012 by GREED

[glennda]

I have to say SLG is a pita for us. We are part of an Lea hosted setup and the front end is awful. But we are now dropping the LEA (wan connection) which means no SLG. But due to the cost in purchasing it for ourselves it's way to much. We are therefore looking @penfold_99's offering ad although the webanywhere system was nice the cost was huge.

 

Therefore we will probably be going with that option when I'm back from sunning myself in Bali.

[GREED]

I'm happy to say there is mixed reaction to the school I used to work and and 2 I worked closely with after that.

 

On the one hand SLG does the job, the school has put a lot of development in to make it decent but it does what it says in the tin.

 

One other ditched it in favour of moodle front end connected to SIMS and are well happy with what they have as an overall solution.

 

The third are very happy with SLG, no complaints and their parental engagement is good.

 

I personally don't think SLG is the problem, but rather SharePoint is. SP is flexible but because of that very basic and vanilla. You have to put the work in to get it anywhere near decent, and even then it is limited in what it can do. I spent months and months researching SLG and SP for my previous, and eventually advised against it due to long term limitations.

[Lippy]

We also tried it (hosted version as we don't use Sharepoint anywhere else) in our high school and also found take up pretty poor and so have virtually given up on it.

 

We are now using a product called Go4schools as we really needed a way to improve our student data collection, analysis and dissemination (to teachers primarily). Previously assessment data was collected through various methods and generally presented in Excel ... now it is all in one place online and available, in real time, to all. OSTED highlighted some of our teachers poor knowledge of student assessment data and so we use Go4schools to address this.

 

The key for me is for each school to decide on a strategic 'map'. Some schools use Sharepoint as the main platform, and build their website, VLE, parental engagement tool etc all round this. Others have seperate platforms/tools for each ... or somewhere in between.

 

Nowdays all suppliers try to make their product the answer to everything ... VLE's can include partental engagement tools and attendance reporting, websites can also be a VLE etc etc ... but the problem is that each element tends to be weaker as this is is an 'add on' to the core product ... developed for sales development only.

 

All schools need some form of VLE, a website, a tool for engaging with parents, a way of recording/assessing attendance etc etc ... and each needs to decide the best way to deliver each of these.

[ellisteph10]

We used SLG and as going into Academy we had to buy from the LA we ditched it. Now trialling TASC Insight and our parents love it. A great product.

 

Only gap is no area for staff to do reports etc but this will have to be done with remote access which is more secure etc anyway.

[vikpaw]

We used SLG and as going into Academy we had to buy from the LA we ditched it. Now trialling TASC Insight and our parents love it. A great product.

 

Only gap is no area for staff to do reports etc but this will have to be done with remote access which is more secure etc anyway.

@ellisteph10 I thought they had a different module for reports - PARS or is that only grades...?

[ellisteph10]

@ellisteph10 I thought they had a different module for reports - PARS or is that only grades...?

 

You need PARS Connect, we did have PARS but were told to move to SIMS Lesson Monitor a few years back so that SLG would work!! PARS was also a great product and we may return.

[CAM]

I publish reports 3 times a year per child on SLG and it has a mixed reception, some staff and parents aren't fans of it and others look at the live data and go "Wow that is great!" The system itself has improved but there were issues with the marksheet web part and a terrible means of viewing reports before the PDF downloads were implemented put many users off.

 

Currently my big big big gripe is the lack of support for Firefox.

[jdoyle]

we have it in place and have been making use of it but there's a general lack of vision at senior level about how to make the most effective use of it (along with other tools).

 

Big gripe is that the initial passwords created by the Active Directory Provisioning tool are too complex for parents.

[zag]

Yeh agree on the complexity of passwords created. Typical case of over securing something at the expense of usability.

 

I think my general point about all this is SLG has been a failure in our school because of the technology used (sharepoint) rather than any lack of content, training or processes we have used. We have all the attendance and reports online for anyone to view and a custom theme but to have less than 10 regular users is a joke really. I've still not heard anyone say they have had a success with SLG yet...

 

Parents want a simple interface to access their child's data be that a web interface or mobile device app. They don't want to have to learn how to use sharepoint or put up with its restrictions and complications.

 

Bloating the system with teacher features is also a huge mistake in my opionion. We dont want a full version of sims on sharepoint, that's not what we are looking for.

 

And don't even get me onto the hassle of upgrading it every release. What a nightmare.

 

We have now decided to move away from SLG for these reasons.

Edited January 23, 2012 by zag

[jdoyle]

not sure that I'd agree that Sharepoint is the issue.

 

Schools generally don't give enough consideration to working with parents. With three kids at three different educational establishments it infuriates me how poor they all are at keeping my wife and I in the loop with regards to their progress, homework, opportunities for extra curricular activities, good/bad behaviour, successes, etc...

[Sylv3r]

We've used SLG for 2 or 3 years now and find it perfect for our needs.

 

Staff access to SIMS profiles etc via the web, parent access to student data and student taking ownership of their own behaviour, tracking information too.

 

Through the use of Sharepoint we've also been able to use this as our 'intranet' internally provided both staff and students quick links to resources and shared documents.

 

It's been a lot of sweat and tears getting it to where it is, but we like it. Just moved to Sharepoint 2010 during the holidays so will investigate webapps etc into the future once I get the chance.

 

Other products such as TASC do an equally good job for the fraction of the price, although for what we paid for SLG I can't grumble for it internally hosted by us too. The LA offered their hosted solution of SLG and I am glad we didn't touch it!

[matt40k]

Thing to remember is hidden costs, such as time configuring and adding content. SharePoint is REALLLY powerful, like Moodle, but if you don't spend the time, it's worthless.

 

Content is golden. If teachers spend time adding lesson plans to the VLE, then adding marks into the MIS, your SLG or whatever will actual get parents wanting to login regularly. Even if you get the most stylish, cheapest option, if they're no content, it's a waste of money. Schools need to get comments onto the MIS system, regardless of if it's "good work" and not just "missing homework". If parents can get onto a system, find out if they're child's arrived and was on time, completed they're homework last week and what mark they got and get a vague idea of what they learnt(*) they'll logon regardless of how pants the system is.

 

* Personally, create a school powerpoint template, get them to create simple 1 slide lesson objectives\summaries. Bosh it onto the VLE so students\parents\staff can get it. Sorted.

[vikpaw]

I've still not heard anyone say they have had a success with SLG yet...

 

Try Twynham School, British Intl School of Netherlands, The Kraal, has links to others The Kraal SharePoint Schools Gallery

 

It is possible, but i agree with you, of all the technologies, Sharepoint has to be the hardest to implement, even if it's hosted, you need to put effort in to get something decent out. Whereas, with other products / systems, you either have a pre-packaged setup, or a simple CMS to customise. Content will always be the key though.

 

I know a lot of people who just have the perception that Sharepoint, or whatever other system, will be the panacea to solve all their problems, it will give them a VLE, really all they get is the E, they have to put the VL bit into that.

[zag]

Well that's exactly my point, we have used sharepoint extensively in school for 6 years now and its very mature as our VLE. We've produced all the content for parents on SLG and have a custom design. We have all parents with logins and we had 300+ users try it out. Less than 5% of parents have logged in more than 3 times.

 

The feedback from parents is simply that they don't like it. Too many unneeded buttons. Poor user interface, slow to load pages. Complicated initial password setup. It may also have something to do with 30% of our parents using safari these days but I have no evidence to back up that it works any less well.

 

I have a feeling if we rolled out one of the other competitors the parents would love the simplicity and have a far higher penetration rate.

 

Anyway I'm ranting again, I guess time will tell

[matt40k]

... to do with 30% of our parents using safari these days

 

My money would be it looks pants on iphone.

[vikpaw]

well, if you do give it up, i'd happily take any content/lessons/plans/ off your hands, to try out on our system.

[theeggmaster]

We used SLG and as going into Academy we had to buy from the LA we ditched it. Now trialling TASC Insight and our parents love it. A great product.

 

Only gap is no area for staff to do reports etc but this will have to be done with remote access which is more secure etc anyway.

 

It will pull reports from SIMS through Linked Documents or through Profiles. You can filter on document title if you only want to show things with (for example) the word FINAL in it.

[Sivadam]

Hopefully, I will shortly get the go ahead to purchase the Optional Homework Webpart for the SLG.

 

Right Clicking Pupils in the Class Register of SIMS (or SLG if you prefer!) to set Homework - to be displayed to Pupils, Parents and Staff via the Homework Diary on SLG! With dynamic links to the actual Homework resource on the MLE!

 

Fantastic!

Edited February 7, 2012 by Sivadam

[zag]

Hopefully, I will shortly get the go ahead to purchase the Optional Homework Webpart for the SLG.

 

Right Clicking Pupils in the Class Register of SIMS (or SLG if you prefer!) to set Homework - to be displayed to Pupils, Parents and Staff via the Homework Diary on SLG! With dynamic links to the actual Homework resource on the MLE!

 

Fantastic!

 

Take a look at frog if you want a homework module done well

 

Its outstanding from the demo's I've seen.

 

I really can't see students wanting to use the SLG. Its far too slow and awkward to use.

[Sivadam]

Hmmmmmmmm............

And that includes the Right Click and add Homework, from a Class register in SIMS, does it?

In the same way you can right click and add Achievment etc?

[Sivadam]

One wonders if the lack of a response to my post above is significant ....................

[glennda]

One wonders if the lack of a response to my post above is significant ....................

 

I looked at the homework thing - didn't think it was worth it especially as the rest of SLG is awful - we created our own system instead homework. theweald.org.uk (spaces so it doesn't appear in google - made that mistake once before!)

[Sivadam]

And that also allows you to set the Homework directly from a Register in SIMS?

 

With SLG that is, literally, all a Class Teacher has to do! What could be simpler?