An Open Letter to David Cameron’s Parents

[MK-2]

I think you fully understand the point he's trying to make, stop being facetious.

Please don't assume to know it all. I am arguing against the point he is trying to make, am I not allowed to do that? Or if I understand the point he is trying to make I must agree with it?

 

I'm glad you have arrived at treating each crime on its own, because many seem to be lumping all rioters in with 5 different charges. Have a look what they are charged with by the police:

 

UK riots: the list of magistrate cases and convictions so far | News | guardian.co.uk

 

* 'Burglary other than dwelling'

* 'Entering Maplins Electronics, in Temple Street, as a trespasser'

* 'Handling stolen goods'

* 'threatening words and behaviour and assaulting a police constable'

* 'Possession of a knife'

* 'Behaviour likely to cause a breach of the peace'

* 'Obstructing a PC'

* 'Handling stolen goods'

 

Apart from extreme cases, are the above charges worse than the charges of MPs 20k or 150k in expenses? or the police taking thousands from Murdochs papers for information?

 

Yes I would say a lot of those charges ARE worse.

Assault, theft, criminal damage, carrying a lethal weapon, burglary.

 

They all need to be taken into context too.

The old man that died in Ealing, help was hindered because police were being assaulted with missiles while trying to reach him. That man may have died because police couldn't reach him in time due to rioters obstructing them. On the face of it, fraudulently claiming £50k in expenses may seem a bigger deal than obstructing a PC. But in the context of that situation, a mans life was lost because of that obstruction.

[Hightower]

I've got to say that if anyone came up to me in the street and mugged me for £50 then that's worse than the same person stealing £50 from my online banking. Yes, both are bad, but in my eyes the mugging is much much worse as it involves an act of violence.

[tommej]

The moral decay of our society is as bad at the top as the bottom – Telegraph Blogs

 

A Good read.

[SteveBentley]

The point is that neither rioting/looting/arson/criminal damage nor fiddling expenses is acceptable. But those guilty of the latter are in no position to lecture people about the morality of the former.

[Disease]

The point is that neither rioting/looting/arson/criminal damage nor fiddling expenses is acceptable. But those guilty of the latter are in no position to lecture people about the morality of the former.

 

Rubbish, as said before fiddling/claiming expenses is a world of difference, for a start it does notreallt impact on peoples lives in the grand scheme of things where as rioting/looting/arson etc has a massve impact on everyones daily lives.

[SteveBentley]

Nobody is saying they are the same thing. They are saying that they are both unacceptable (but to different degrees). But those who have fraudulently claimed expenses to which they were not entitled have no place commenting upon the morality of others.

[MK-2]

Nobody is saying they are the same thing. They are saying that they are both unacceptable (but to different degrees). But those who have fraudulently claimed expenses to which they were not entitled have no place commenting upon the morality of others.

 

you could go as far as saying "let he is without sin cast the first stone".

if you have ever done 31mph in a 30 zone, you have broken the law, so should have no place commenting on the morality of others. nobody is perfect, so unless you are waiting for some sort of divine intervention to guide you, we have to listen to someone. there might be police officers who have done things wrong in their lives but it doesn't mean you stand there and say "i WILL loot this shop, you aren't innocent"

[pcstru]

Rubbish, as said before fiddling/claiming expenses is a world of difference, for a start it does notreallt impact on peoples lives in the grand scheme of things where as rioting/looting/arson etc has a massve impact on everyones daily lives.

 

Of course it impacts on people. It is real money and if they are pocketing it, there is less of it for legitimate causes - your mothers cancer operation or technology for your school. Funny, when I was at school they taught me that stealing 1/2p (yes, we had them in those days) was as bad as stealing £100. Guess they don't teach that at Eaton and Winchester. But all that is actually beside the point. These people are in a position of very special responsibility - a position of trust. If a schoolteacher has a relationship with a pupil over the age of consent, they will find that their world collapses when they are found out. They are in a position of trust and have a professional responsibility not to abuse that trust. They will be immediately suspended and then be out of a job, followed rapidly by being out of teaching forever. MP's are in a similar position when it comes to looking after revenue from OUR taxes - money that belongs to US. Apparently though they want to be paid more (because people in 'similar' positions (not sure how they work that one out)) are paid more. Yet when they are caught with their hands in the till, they slink away and ... well, some of them are now working as ministers and some just cry out from the backbenches about how those involved in riots should be harshley treated by the law - just like they weren't.

 

None of this is saying that those that involved themselves in rioting, criminal damage, assault or theft are any better than they are - they are scum. But they are ordinary people, many of whom probably got a bit carried away and just didn't think things through - none of which makes it any better. BUT, to see people who cynically abused their positions of trust call for these people to be more harshly treated by the law (than say an everyday burglar) and to be made an example of - well, I suppose it's just adding hypocrisy to their list of many vomit inducing characteristics.

 

One of those involved got 6 months custodial for stealing a bottle of water. For those that say that fiddling expenses is a 'world of difference' - how do they think that compares to stealing £20,000 of taxpayers money? Some of those guilty of the latter are now standing up revelling in the media coverage they are getting, preening themselves in front of the cameras while they demand the former are removed from society. They need to learn to lead by example first.