UniServity - Between a rock and a hard place

[ICTCoordinator]

We have used UniServity for the last 3 years after our authority went for this vle. They went for a loss leader and we have used it for free during this period. Now we have received our first expensive bill for renewal we are put in a real dilemma.

 

On the one hand the vle is not great. It looks old fashioned and is not easy for most staff to use. On the other hand it is stable and some staff have put a lot of work into the vle for their departments. I know it is going to involve a lot of work and re-training to change to a new vle. I do not know much about Moodle but know that those who use it think it is great. We have had student teachers who use it for the colleges they come from and it looks good. Any advice from experience here would be welcomed.

[Steven_Cleaver]

Hi

 

We were in the same position about eight months back, we had the LEA's VLE for about 3 years for free and were just about to get the bill for it, same as you really we had a couple of departments using it well with a lot of resources but don't let this put you off going for Moodle we found although it took a bit of work you were able to move your resources to Moodle which we did over the summer and when staff came back we did some training with them and to be honest the ones that were using the previous VLE well took to Moodle really easily. We found Moodle much more user friendly than the previous VLE and to be honest alot more people are using Moodle than ever used the old VLE.

 

Their is also bags of information on the web as regards Moodle and a lot of schools using it, we are also hosting this internally so we handle all the support for this and we can resolve any issues quickly and don't have to log support calls and wait for someone to get back to you.

 

Good luck

[ICTCoordinator]

Thanks for your reply Steven. What you are saying sounds very interesting and confirms some of my thoughts. What costs are involved in using Moodle?

[secretlife]

Hi there. Uniservity to Moodle sounds a good move to me. Re (quote) What costs are involved in using Moodle? it can genuinely be anything from nothing to thousands (although fewer thousands than with a commercial VLE it must be said) If you host it on your own server it costs nothing but your admin needs to know what they are doing, which either means paying for training or giving them time to train themselves (perfectly feasible) Then also your teachers need training which again can be bought or can be done in-house by those who have played and taught themselves. (that's what we did) Alternatively if you don't want the hassle of hosting it yourself you can pay a webhost to do it -t this can vary from a couple of hundred pounds with a reputable web host or else a few thousand with an official Moodle Partner (companies officially accredited by moodle.)

[Steven_Cleaver]

Hi

 

Moodle is open source as you probably know so software is free as long as you have someone with reasonable technical knowledge, it can be set up by them it could probably do with its own Server so again this would be a cost and I have set this up over SSL (Encryted data) for security reasons and it is a requirement of our LEA of any web services we provide to the outside world.

 

You can get an outside company to do this but it could prove costly as we had a look at this route ( anywhere between £7,000 and £20,000 for the whole thing) but decided to do it ourselves in the end.

 

Very rough estimates

 

Server depending on Specification: £2000 - £4000 including Server Licence.

Domain name and SSL Certificate etc 3 years £200 approx or though you may be able to get this cheaper we used godaddy.

Obviously the time in setting this up.

 

We were lucky as I had already gone down the Server Virtualisation route so to be honest I didn't have to purchase a new Server just created a virtual Server to do this.

 

The other benefit of hosting it internally is if for any reason you have internet issues students and staff can still access the VLE.

 

If you want to have a look please find link below although it is in its early stages.

 

https://moodle.lodeheath.org.uk

 

The other good thing with Moodle is if you have Active Directory you can set it so users can use the same login for the network and Moodle.Before we set it up I found a couple of colleges in the area that were already using Moodle and visited these to see what it could do and for ideas. You can also download Moodle onto a USB stick and have a play with this if you type moodle on a stick into Google.

Edited January 15, 2011 by Steven_Cleaver

[Kat101]

Whilst uniservity is less than perfect, it is worth pointing out that they have just launched their next gen platform Life at BETT this week. Ignore the poncy "imagine a world..." type ads and ask to see it in action. That way you will be making an informed decision about swapping. You may also be able to negotiate pricing if they think you're interested. Our LA, whilst no longer paying for the VLE have negotiated a price based on the % of schools that continue with uniservity and a 12mth contract is cheaper than setting up moodle (although much of moodle's cost are in set up rather than continuous.

 

Kat

[rama1712]

Hi Steven like the moodle site we are just going down this road again due to uniservit costs. Can you let us know how you did the drop down menus and the bar that stays at bottom of the page even when you scroll

Stuart

[danIT]

@rama1712 The bar that stays in place even when you scroll is available here: Moodle Bar v1.0 now available | Lewis Carr

 

The drop down menu's are from the Aardvark theme which is available here: Moodle.org: Themes

[edutech4schools]

I am looking at Google apps for Education for our VLE and have setup a website with access for the children. You also get all the other apps for free that link in with the website so if you create a document you can post that doc to the website without being in the website.

 

If you have a google email account have a play with sites, then if you like it sign-up for Google Apps for Education which gives the school control over all Google products so you can restrict who has the calendar or can post videos .....

 

Sites is soooo easy to use I can show someone how to use it in 15 mins but is probably better for primary schools.

 

I have also seen that some authorities are moving to Google Apps.

[ning]

Running a Moodle VLE can cost anywhere between £50 & £1000.

In all honesty, it's not the cost of the moodle that is the issue, it's the training & development of staff where cost issues arise.

 

As far as the platform itself goes, there isn't that much between uniservity & moodle, and even moodle 2 doesn't look amazing and new (unless you pay someone to develop skins for you).

The question you should ask is what are you looking to achieve? Why do you want to replace one vle with another? Are you looking for eportfolios for pupils? Do you want areas for staff to share resources? When you know what you want, then you can look at the technology to support it.

 

I run 120 moodle sites for my local authority. I'm moodle through and through, whilst I am very technically able, I can not run the background operations of a moodle, VLE, so you need someone to support you technically, (thankfully I have someone!) which involves cost. I've seen administrators moodle courses at £1000 a day that won't even touch the sides of what you need to know to keep your moodle running.

 

I wouldn't bother hosting internally, the idea of buying servers is ridiculous when you can have a server sat in iceland/sweeden/san francisco that someone else manages. Besides, your school internet feed will not cope with a huge demand if your moodle grows.

 

You are welcome to private message me if you need more info.

[Wirral_Wonderer]

We are in the same situation. Microsoft are launching Office 365 (rebadged live@edu) for education with basic sharepoint for free, but then charging for full sharepoint on a per teacher per month basis.

 

I am looking at a short term fix using skydrive, yacapaca, and other open forums. I know this is not ideal, but at lease we are in control of what we use and can use new features when and where we want. I have also come across EDU 2.0 for school: the free, easy way to teach and learn online, but not had time to really look at it yet (cost $900 per year for 999-2000 students!)

[Georgelloyd]

This is a strange post! No school has used the vle for free over the last three years. VLEs all over the country have been purchased by LAs using granTs from government. Some LAs gave the money directly to school and others chose the power of aggregated purchase and went used a tender process. Therefore the vle was bought on your behalf with your money.

 

Strange you called it a loss leader. Uniservity was not cheap, but from what I know was cheaper than companies such as Fronter and RM. LAs were only allowed to put the tender to companies that provide many, many safeguards, resources, backing and data protection. They had to be Becta approved vles, moodle was not approved and doesn't have the safeguards that many schools should insist on.

 

The new uniservity platform called Life looks good and simple to use. It looks more widget based and staff should get used to it far quicker than the present version.

[edutech4schools]

Therefore the vle was bought on your behalf with your money.

 

I know of schools that might have picked Uniservity had they been given the money and time to choose but don't like being told what they have to use. Some LAs are run as a business and the local schools are very weary of any info / requirements coming from the LA as it normally end up with them making a few quid.

 

Another problem with this approach is they tend to choose tenders based on the secondary schools requirements but then expect the primary's to somehow shoehorn these features into their systems, which never works.

 

Many Primary schools would have paid more if it reflected the requirements for a primary school but its not aimed at them.

Edited February 11, 2011 by edutech4schools

[mylearningltd]

As far as a comparison to Moodle, I'd certainly recommend reading what the user "ning" above is saying. They give a good personal (and fair) portrayal of Moodle. It fits in with some of the experiences my collegues are having regarding the same product and environment.

 

From my own experience of dealing with schools (existing and potential) the most important thing is becoming value for money (2011).

Glitter and dazzle is giving way it seems for fundamental questions like "How is that going to help make things better?"

With that in mind, FREE vs PAID is going to seem less important if the most important thing is going to be (and should be). "Will this help for the next 1-2-3 years?".

 

To follow up on "dabroa"'s recommendations, I'd like to add My Learning UK Ltd to that list.

Simple because they/we offer a Primary VLE that really is for Primary but at the same time can act as a Secondary.

This solves the issue above mentioned by "edutech4schools" whereby a Primary school usually ends up with no budget or a VLE that the Secondary school selected.

The needs for Primary vs Secondary are extremely different and to assume a Primary child could comfortably use a Secondary system in class (or at home) would be very optimistic indeed.

 

Anyway, good luck with whatever decision you do make in the end!

It would be good to know what your final decision will be

Edited February 15, 2011 by mylearningltd
Mis-worded

[apearce]

We are in the same situation. Microsoft are launching Office 365 (rebadged live@edu) for education with basic sharepoint for free, but then charging for full sharepoint on a per teacher per month basis.

 

office365 email is still free - you dont have to take the sharepoint option if you dont want to.

[cgerard]

We have used UniServity for the last 3 years after our authority went for this vle. They went for a loss leader and we have used it for free during this period. Now we have received our first expensive bill for renewal we are put in a real dilemma.

 

On the one hand the vle is not great. It looks old fashioned and is not easy for most staff to use. On the other hand it is stable and some staff have put a lot of work into the vle for their departments. I know it is going to involve a lot of work and re-training to change to a new vle. I do not know much about Moodle but know that those who use it think it is great. We have had student teachers who use it for the colleges they come from and it looks good. Any advice from experience here would be welcomed.

 

Hi,

 

Have you heard of Chamilo? It is an open source VLE that was released last year. It comes with a lot of automatic features, but can also be customised. People usually find it easier to use than Moodle.

[cgerard]

links here:

 

You can see a demo here

and try it on the demo portal here Page d'accueil - Chamilo virtual campus trial

 

let me know if you need anything!

[JaneLWaite]

Yes and here lots more schools in Brighton & Hove with the same problem.

I was not involved in the orginal tender process that Uniservity 'won' - so do not know the criteria that they 'passed.

 

We have had a company called webanywhere recommending their services for a learning platform.

I do not know if these guys were in the original tender bids.

Does anyone have any experience of this alternative - very cheap - way less than uniservity for a 3 year licence with a thrown in front Website built by webanywhere to replace the uniservity front end.

I on a personal level have spent man months (or so it has felt at times) loading up links, photos, videos, touting the product with parents and pupils. We have had training for all staff to use uniservity VLE. Seems daunting to start again. We have not seen Cloud yet - is it easier to use than the rather old fashioned long winded old uniservity version.

Sorry for the rant but it is great to find a forum where other teachers are doing the same as us - re-doing the tender process - in their spare time.

Many thanks for any help

Jane

[ICTCoordinator]

Hi Jane

 

I have just led a twilight session after college tonight where we have been showing work done on UniServity vle, and at the same time talking about the difficulties of using the program. We have attended a meeting for the new Life Learning Cloud and while it does look very good we have not had chance to get our hands on it and try it for ourselves. We have paid for a 12 month subscription to try it out. The problem is that the subscription starts in May and the full version is not released until September. UniServity promise a full integration of resources from the old system into the new one. This is going to be a terrible time to start any training as the new academic year is starting. I am not sure how fully we will be able to utilise the rest of the year's subscription.

Edited March 29, 2011 by ICTCoordinator

[Andie]

Hi Jane

 

We have paid for a 12 month subscription to try it out. The problem is that the subscription starts in May and the full version is not released until September.

 

We are going through the procurement process for a platform too at the moment. Can I just check what you are saying here about the Uniservity Life offering - will it not be fully available until September? Or is that just a migration issue if you already use their old system? Only they seem to be selling at as a ready to go product, and if that's not true we need to know!

 

As an existing customer of Uniservity, would you not get access to Life as part of your existing contract? What is happening to the product you are using now? If it is defunct, then surely Life is an upgrade and I would have thought that you would be entitled to upgrades within the period of your contract?

Edited March 29, 2011 by Andie
Extra questions added.

[ICTCoordinator]

Yes just to clarify. We have in effect renewed our subscription to the existing UniServity VLE. We were told that the new fully functional Life Learning Cloud would not be available until September, when UniServity would merge our existing resources into it. If anyone knows anything different I would like to hear from them.

[russdev]

@Georgelloyd

 

Better clarify something. At time LA had to use approved company and not an approved VLE off the becta list. The list was of approved companies who could provide a vle. So you could go to RM for moodle (as an example) if you wish'd. Moodle was certainly allowed to be used by LA and be brought under the rules (as number of LAs did) as long as used approved becta supplier.

 

As for being loss leader most if not all the main companies at time were doing loss leading at the start of contract an example would be providing first year free which number of companies did..

 

Russ

[fathead]

. We were told that the new fully functional Life Learning Cloud would not be available until September, when UniServity would merge our existing resources into it. .

 

If you are an existing Uniservity customer your contact/account manager at Uniservity should have provided you with or at least offered a "sandpit" login to the new Life VLE. The new VLE is extremely "FROGIFIED" but of what I have seen and used in the demo site I have been very impressed.

 

From what I have been told, Life's full release and availability is from September whether you are an old or new customer. Where I work, we are delaying our migration until a date that is most suitable for us i.e not September!!! Depending on how far advanced your schools usage of a VLE, I think the timing of the migration is very important.

 

As an NM, I will be working over the Christmas holidays so I think this might be the best time to migrate. Plenty of time to play with it and then when all the teachers come back, roll out the new training and inevitable barrage of questions.

 

Hopefully I will have been given plenty of bottles of whiskey at Christmas to ease the headaches after!

[Andie]

If you are an existing Uniservity customer your contact/account manager at Uniservity should have provided you with or at least offered a "sandpit" login to the new Life VLE. The new VLE is extremely "FROGIFIED" but of what I have seen and used in the demo site I have been very impressed.

 

 

So are you an existing Uniservity customer, or are you migrating from another platform? If the former, did you get offered the demo login for Life by Uniservity or did you have to ask for it? Was it the company that told you the full version of Life is not available until September? Sorry to make this sound like an interrogation! Just that, as i said, the product seems to have been launched as ready to go. Also can't find any mention of the September bit on their website.

[edutech4schools]

I am using old uniservity VLE and was told. 1 this is not an upgrade but a new product (it costs more) we can use our old system if we want but at some point it will be abolished. 2. only parts of the site can be migrated and the actual content can't be (lots of work for the school)