Snapdragon X Elite: The End for Intel & AMD?

[flyinghaggis]

 

Prior ARM chips running Windows have all had abysmal performance and compatability compared to x86 but it genuinely looks like this time could be different. Not only is the power usage much lower but the CPU/GPU performance is actually superior in many situations.

 

Going to be interesting to see how the compatibility pans out for non-native x86 only apps when laptops release later this year.

Edited April 3, 2024 by flyinghaggis

[robintech]

If its cheap enough I'd like a long battery life laptop , do worry about some processor flaw like the Apple GoFetch or something that makes the early ones vulnerable and unfixable.

[Ironside]

even if Qualcomm manages to put something together that can even get close to Apple Silicon, they still have to rely on Windows and Microsoft to A: Make windows on arm good, and B: make windows on ARM a ecosystem that works.

 

Windows RT, and Windows Phone, and Windows UWP Apps, Windows Subsystem for Androids upcoming closure and Windows Store all indicate quite thoroughly that Microsoft are fundamentally incompetent at making third party app developers confident in their ecosystems.

 

I expect Apple to maintain a hold over ARM pcs and in turn the PC/mobile device industry for a long time.

[dmj]

even if Qualcomm manages to put something together that can even get close to Apple Silicon, they still have to rely on Windows and Microsoft to A: Make windows on arm good, and B: make windows on ARM a ecosystem that works.

 

Windows RT, and Windows Phone, and Windows UWP Apps, Windows Subsystem for Androids upcoming closure and Windows Store all indicate quite thoroughly that Microsoft are fundamentally incompetent at making third party app developers confident in their ecosystems.

 

I expect Apple to maintain a hold over ARM pcs and in turn the PC/mobile device industry for a long time.

 

Agree. Microsoft is the limiting factor, linux and apple don't seem to be affected by the same issues on ARM.

[Dos_Box]

I'm quite looking forward to this hitting the markets. I just wonder if we'd have to buy an entire motherboard including CPU\GPU's, or would they be available as individual CPU\SoC drop-ins?

[flyinghaggis]

I'm quite looking forward to this hitting the markets. I just wonder if we'd have to buy an entire motherboard including CPU\GPU's, or would they be available as individual CPU\SoC drop-ins?

 

I'm guessing that, like Apple Silicon and mobiles, it'll just be an SoC likely with integrated RAM and storage built onto the chip? However, Qualcomm did mention in a press release that some of the ARM/Snapdragon laptops may come with discrete Nvidia/AMD Graphics as an option so there might be potential for other upgradeable parts?

 

Every design I've seen with the chip has been in a laptop though it would likely be a good fit for a mini/micro PC form factor? Initial reports are the pricing could be steep but if popular presumably we'll see cheaper options down the line. Could be a good fit for Chromebooks in future as well?

Edited April 4, 2024 by flyinghaggis

[Dos_Box]

I'm guessing that, like Apple Silicon and mobiles, it'll just be an SoC likely with integrated RAM and storage built onto the chip? However, Qualcomm did mention in a press release that some of the ARM/Snapdragon laptops may come with discrete Nvidia/AMD Graphics as an option so there might be potential for other upgradeable parts?

 

Every design I've seen with the chip has been in a laptop though it would likely be a good fit for a mini/micro PC form factor? Initial reports are the pricing could be steep but if popular presumably we'll see cheaper options down the line. Could be a good fit for Chromebooks in future as well?

 

And that does raise the question about the future of discrete GPU's too!

[PotNoodleTech]

20 years ago people were saying is this the end of intel and amd too.

 

still waiting!

[3s-gtech]

Indeed. Just look at the products that were going to do just that, and didn’t gain traction. ARM architecture in Apple machines was a big change, but in recent times two of the games consoles have switched to AMD’s PC architecture. Anyone remember Larrabee that was going to break the ATI and Nvidia wars?

[flyinghaggis]

Noticed the official announcment of these new ARM chips/devices is at the Microsoft event later today! Keen to see what performance/compatibility/pricing and features they can bring to ARM Windows devices. Let's hppe it's not Windows RT all over again......

 

https://www.windowscentral.com/software-apps/windows-11/what-to-expect-from-microsofts-special-surface-and-windows-11-ai-event-on-may-20

[flyinghaggis]

I guess the key question about these devices is the compatibility which we won’t find out until reviewers get their hands on them. most Initial impressions seem positive though in terms of performance, pricing and battery life.

 

Edited May 20, 2024 by flyinghaggis

[XiJ]

Apple Silicon based in Arm killed intel / Amd for PC processors. The rest will follow. Just needs Windows to run reliably on arm architecture and that will be it.

[PotNoodleTech]

Apple Silicon based in Arm killed intel / Amd for PC processors.

 

That's a matter of opinion!

[supportman]

Can't wait for these. It's about time Microsoft caught up with Apple M chips.

 

I'll be interested in how the graphics perform.

 

Intel really did mess up by slowing down their research and development some years back now. Releasing 5% improvements and re-branded chips for years and years. They deserve everything they get in terms of competition.

 

I have little care for the AI nonsense, but better battery life would be huge for my workload.

Edited May 21, 2024 by supportman

[jthompson]

The new Surface models aren't fanless, I gather, so I already want them less than my entry level MBA.

 

I'm sure a lot of the performance gains will be wisely spent on serving ads, weather and AI panels. Yay.

[RobFuller]

Take want you will from benchmarks but made some interesting reading looking at the performance results from the X Elite compared to previous Microsoft SQ3 chips, Intel and even Apple M3 ..

https://signal65.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/NewSurfaceLaptop2024_Signal65LabInsights_r1.01.pdf

[supportman]

Take want you will from benchmarks but made some interesting reading looking at the performance results from the X Elite compared to previous Microsoft SQ3 chips, Intel and even Apple M3 ..

https://signal65.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/NewSurfaceLaptop2024_Signal65LabInsights_r1.01.pdf

 

Crazy to think it has 40% my battery life than intel in video playback tests!

[localzuk]

For business laptops, I'm guessing these will be the way forward.

 

The question will be, what happens to the much smaller hobby and gaming markets?

 

My guess is Microsoft will push their Xbox stuff more, and try and get everyone to either use cloudy gaming, or push new consoles as the solution for that.

[supportman]

For business laptops, I'm guessing these will be the way forward.

 

The question will be, what happens to the much smaller hobby and gaming markets?

 

My guess is Microsoft will push their Xbox stuff more, and try and get everyone to either use cloudy gaming, or push new consoles as the solution for that.

 

Yeh I don't think these are designed for gaming at all.

[Norphy]

Your average laptop isn't designed for gaming either. The graphics core in them is comparatively weak compared to what you get on a desktop.

 

That said, ARM CPUs may make their way into normal desktops and it's entirely possible that GPU vendors will make drivers and firmwares that are compatible with them. PCIe isn't something that's exclusive to Intel CPUs, after all.

[Norphy]

Looking at this some more today.

 

All of the tier 1s have or are releasing models in their business lines; Dell are releasing Latitudes, Lenovo is releasing a ThinkPad and HP is releasing an Elitebook, not to mention the likes of the Surface, Asus and Acer. The question I have right now is - it's going to be inevitable that someone is going to see one of these things and say "Ooo, 18 hour battery" and demand one. How are these things going to play with management software? I have no doubt that they'll go straight into Intune, but what about the likes of MECM and KACE?

[dmj]

I'm sure a lot of the performance gains will be wisely spent on serving ads, weather and AI panels. Yay.

Don't forget the AI monitoring everything you do so that it can report back "to give you helpful suggestions"

[dmj]

The question I have right now is - it's going to be inevitable that someone is going to see one of these things and say "Ooo, 18 hour battery" and demand one.

 

Haven't they already done that with macbooks and chromebooks ?

[Norphy]

Haven't they already done that with macbooks and chromebooks ?

 

Maybe, but the question is still valid. How are these things going to be managed in a corporate setting?

[dmj]

Maybe, but the question is still valid. How are these things going to be managed in a corporate setting?

 

We seem to be able to manage Chromebooks, MacBooks and Linux in a corporate setting ok...