UNISON vote for strike

[cookie_monster]

You could make the county performance review system pay related like in industry, hit your targets get a pay rise then it might be less of a waste of time.

 

I still think that there is an overstaffing issue i used to live in a town with a county council headquarters and over the last 10 years almost every building in town has been taken over by it, they had a massive building to start with and now have almost double the office space. I don't see double the service.

They also need to reign in sickness levels i know a couple of people who work for county HR and they say the levels of staff off at any time are obscene (near NHS levels), this is a massive WASTE of taxpayers money as most counties don't have a policy to properly address the issue some are now implementing back to work interviews but not all.

Edited June 24, 2008 by cookie_monster

[Sirbendy]

Heh..sorry for anything you disagree with...I'm just feeling a tad ranty and fed up with the whole general cockup that is UK of late.

 

We're taxed off our tits, yet they spend money like it's going out of fashion. How much goes on improving things? Not much that's visible. How much goes on payrises for london "out of touch" government idiots, into the pockets of councils who in my view are not run by people with common sense, into "traffic management", urban regeneration, arty-farty TWB projects and other damnfool moneysinks...too much.

 

Look at BSF, and if I annoy anyone here, I'm very sorry, but this is my view..

 

I approve of the new buildings bit..we need those. Ditto new equipment, and new facilities. Everything cycles, and education has changed out of recognition in 40-50 years. We need to keep on the edge of that, or we're useless. So I approve of that aspect.

 

I do NOT approve of the idiot outsourcing to 1 company and removing schools local support staff..it is NOT the Gov'ts place to "micro manage" everything..they do it with Hospitals, schools, everything..they need to back off, and wind their necks and spending in.

 

We've got far too lazy in the last 20+ years..far too used to the cushy life, decent pay, cheap everything, and waste generation due to convenience and "self improvement". We've wound down this country and outsourced everything, we've encouraged the welfare state and benefit claimants, we've encouraged people to look for the "easy option" instead of taking responsibility.

 

We've made our bed. Now we have to lie in it. Our grandparents managed it..they had less, it wasn't easy, but they coped..now it's cycled round again..can we cope?

 

EDIT: Yes, I agree with overstaffing in some places..and I agree with the performance review bit. Too many overpaid people, too many people not paid enough. Even it out. Proper perfomance management and all that. We have a PRP system here...sort of. Works well.

Edited June 24, 2008 by Sirbendy

[skunk]

Take the offer and run, 2.45% in April is better than 4% in January that is not backdated to April.

 

I wonder how many people would be complaining that the government are incompetent if they had said: "Have a 10% pay rise, because it will stabilise the economy." You would know it was a lie but I bet there wouldn't have been a strike called.

 

Yet when they say "Have a 2.45% pay rise, because it will stabilise the economy" they are roundly criticised as not having a clue, being out of touch, their own salaries called into question and everyone wants to strike. Yet we all know that it probably will help the economy stabilise, even at our own expense. That sounds suspiciously like greed to me.

 

Where is the money going to come from as someone mentioned the gov is flat broke. Tax increases on petrol maybe? No, politically too volatile. Increased tax on low earners? tried that and it failed. Increases tax on high earners? They will go somewhere else and take their companies with them so we end up with less money. That leaves us with.........redundancies, that means those support staff who appear to be doing nothing in school, hey they sit at a desk all day fiddling with computers. We don't need them. P45 anyone?

 

The economy is going nuts and it will bite us all before it gets better, striking is not going to help anyone, just sticking our heads above the parapet waiting for the turkey shoot. Those firemen have got such a good deal from all that striking.........

[zag]

I agree that we should be paid more. However, I don't agree with striking in schools. It is damaging to the kids education.

 

Yep + 1

[bossman]

@Sirbendy:

I totally agree with you on this matter.

I blame Margaret Thatcher and the tories for turning everyone into greedy, i am better than you cos i have a four wheel drive and a 5 bedroom house that i purchased through my mortgage by borrowing ridiculous amounts of money from the bank or building society leaving me with negative equity and now the greedy banks want to up the interest rate and i can't afford the repayments oh what am i to do?

 

the answer is to get real as Sirbendy has said (really feel for ya M8) stop whinging and moaning as it does no good.

 

Of course the system is unfair as all of you would agree but we voted for this government and look what they are doing to us so we only have ourselves to blame.

 

really got me mad now hehe :eek:

[cookie_monster]

@Sirbendy: Yeh the IT side of BSF will meerly hand over lots of taxpayers money to large IT companies (this gov just loves that) to bring mediocrity to schools. Any that are ahead of the curve will be bought into line, sure some need bringing up as they're failing but the inovative schools should be left alone. Of course the people bidding for the contracts want it to be LA wide.

 

 

@skunk: yes some people are really going to feel the pinch this year but i don't think a round of bumper payrises this year will solve anything.

 

@bossman:

I blame Margaret Thatcher and the tories for turning everyone into greedy, i am better than you cos i have a four wheel drive and a 5 bedroom house that i purchased through my mortgage by borrowing ridiculous amounts of money from the bank or building society leaving me with negative equity and now the greedy banks want to up the interest rate and i can't afford the repayments oh what am i to do?

 

Nah that's just human nature always has been always will be. I think people have to deal with the fact that we're probably going to enjoy a drop in living standards for some time.

Edited June 24, 2008 by cookie_monster

[Friez]

We don't need them. P45 anyone?

 

Can't do that, redundancy costs too much. Let's outsource them and let the private companies do it instead.

[sparkeh]

I agree with the strike.

 

Most of the support staff work bloody hard, and at the end of the year they are told that there efforts are worth less than last year...and the year before that. It stinks.

 

Its great to sit on here and pontificate about how people should just suck it up for the common good but I work in a particularly poor area where people are struggling and wondering how they are going to put food on the table and pay the bills. This is after being hit by the 10p tax fiasco. How about we go and tell them they have to suck it up huh?

[Hightower]

Hey ho, what can I say..... 2 years and I'll be living in Corfu, once and for all leaving this absolute disgrace of a country behind.

 

That's all I have to say on the matter.

[sparkeh]

Hey ho, what can I say..... 2 years and I'll be living in Corfu, once and for all leaving this absolute disgrace of a country behind.

 

That's all I have to say on the matter.

 

I am rapidly coming round to your way of thinking.

[witch]

 

Alt, my way would be to fight for stepped pay awards with the lowest earners awarded bigger pay rises than higher earners, any higher earners that moan I’d point out that it's that or higher taxes which do you prefer. Tough love

 

 

Oh yeah- and how is that fair? My partner works very hard and has got where he is by sheer determination. How is it fair to give lower earners more of a pay rise than him thus eroding the pay differentials? Obviously some people are very badly paid and something needs to be done about that, but giving higher earners less of a pay rise is not really the answer. We already pay much more in higher rate taxes anyway, so we are contributing more as it is.

 

My partner has just been told that he gets absolutely no pay rise of any sort this year, not even an inflationary one, (he works for a very large telecomms company) and this is following 2 years of less than inflationary pay rises.

 

Hightower - are you going to become a Greek Citizen when you move to Corfu? If this country is so bad? FYI inflation is higher in Greece than in the UK

Edited June 24, 2008 by witch

[mattx]

I blame Margaret Thatcher and the tories for turning everyone into greedy, i am better than you cos i have a four wheel drive and a 5 bedroom house that i purchased through my mortgage by borrowing ridiculous amounts of money from the bank or building society leaving me with negative equity and now the greedy banks want to up the interest rate and i can't afford the repayments oh what am i to do?

 

Amen to that !!

[Friez]

Its great to sit on here and pontificate about how people should just suck it up for the common good but I work in a particularly poor area where people are struggling and wondering how they are going to put food on the table and pay the bills.

 

Well this is it: Why are the poorest paid people having to take the cut so that the richer bunch can continue getting richer?

 

Why don't the rich people take cut after cut each year? Why are we suffering for their decent pay packet?

 

No, we need to be paid more fairly we shouldn't have to take the fall time and time again. Why do we put up and shut up? Teachers are screaming every five minutes about their pay, yet we're not? Doesn't make sense to me.

[cookie_monster]

@ witch: i didn't say it was fair we just need a new option rather than the same old. I work very hard as well but i'm not and i'm sure you partner as well aren't in danger of losing everything because they simply can't earn enough to pay their gas bill.

 

My partner has just been told that he gets absolutely no pay rise of any sort this year, not even an inflationary one, (he works for a very large telecomms company) and this is following 2 years of less than inflationary pay rises.

 

I've worked in private industry and been told the same and it hurts but that's what happens it's better that the other 'we aren't paying you this month alternative'

Edited June 24, 2008 by cookie_monster

[Hightower]

We already pay much more in higher rate taxes anyway, so we are contributing more as it is.

 

I'd much rather be in a higher tax bracket than the lower one!

 

Hightower - are you going to become a Greek Citizen when you move to Corfu? If this country is so bad? FYI inflation is higher in Greece than in the UK

 

You think this country has got things right?! You partner may work very hard, but what about the hundreds of thousands of other workers who honestly work equally as hard but go unrecognised. In this country, the rich get richer, the poor get are forced into debt and the lazy b*astards who have never lifted a finger their entire life get a house and a nice fortnightly cheque!

[Hightower]

I know what could help this country if we weren't too soft, and I know there's a lot of you guys on here and I don't mean any offense to you (as you are all the hard working guys).

 

Cut the Scottish off. Out of 5 million residents in Scotland, 680,000 are working! that means more than 4 million are out of work. So how, being part of the UK have they managed to get free dental care, free uni fee's etc and we are left to foot the bill?

 

It costs the UK 64% more to keep the Scottish than what they can contribute? So why are we so soft.

 

Put the wall back up is what I say, let them fend for themselves!

[Ryan]

Where the are you getting your figures from? Edited June 24, 2008 by Irazmus

[sparkeh]

Did you mean:

 

Where the are you getting your figures from?

 

[Hightower]

Newspaper a little while ago (and no, it wasn't the Daily Star!).

 

Those were the facts Ryan. I don't mean any offense to anyone, but you have to look at the stats and see Scotland is costing the UK (inc England, Wales & N.I.) a lot of money!

[Jona]

I know what could help this country if we weren't too soft, and I know there's a lot of you guys on here and I don't mean any offense to you (as you are all the hard working guys).

 

Cut the Scottish off. Out of 5 million residents in Scotland, 680,000 are working! that means more than 4 million are out of work. So how, being part of the UK have they managed to get free dental care, free uni fee's etc and we are left to foot the bill?

 

It costs the UK 64% more to keep the Scottish than what they can contribute? So why are we so soft.

 

Put the wall back up is what I say, let them fend for themselves!

Whilst I do agree that ""English"" money shouldn't pay for Scottish executive projects this is a very simplistic view of looking at things. I think your figures are complete rubbish tbh see http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2003/04/17042/21542

 

One very good reason not to "Cut the Scottish off" is the fact that the majority of north sea oil comes ashore in Scotland. Another major issue is that removing Scottish seats would completely change the balance of power in parliament so this would have to be addressed which I'm pretty sure would cost money. IMO the UK is much stronger united than in it's constituent parts.

[Sirbendy]

Hightower...google "Wonko's World"...my friend there has a similar opinion..

 

I gave up getting angry..we'll be screwed every which way..all we can do is try to ride it out. I've given up any hope of the housing ladder unless it really REALLY tanks...and I just keep reminding myself if it all goes FUBAR, we can move back in with my mother..not ideal, but not the end of the world.

 

I'm choosing to see it as a challenge..."find the cheapest way of fulfilling the objective". Also looking at purchases and thinking "Do I NEED you?", and "What should I get NOW, that'll be useful and not become defunct in short order".

 

Also distraction works...I've got back into my electronics hobby...parts cost pennies, and it's very absorbing.

[cookie_monster]

Where the hell did cutting the Scottish of come from, can we not let this turn into a nationalistic debate and stay on topic if you want to discuss that then start a new thread.

 

 

 

 

IMO the UK is much stronger united than in it's constituent parts.

 

I fully agree but that's all i'll say on the issue in this thread.

Edited June 24, 2008 by cookie_monster

[Hightower]

My figures might be off - I do apologise if they are as it was from memory. I'll have a look for the paper when I get in tonight.

 

That said though, my point still stands! Scotland can do what the hell they like with UK money which is very unfair! **** the oil, it's worth a lot less than they get from the UK and cut them off! The Scot's fought for freedom! I say give it to them!

 

In fact, don't cut them off! I'm not gonna move to Corfu, I'm going to Scotland

Edited June 24, 2008 by witch

[Jona]

ok reeling it back from the nationalist rantings.....

 

what's the point of a pay rise if it just pushes up inflation as then we'll just be in the same position as before?

[Sirbendy]

Brussels annoys me - we're paying the EU for membership, and they're killing us slowly. Get shot of those idiots, I say.

 

Sorry, I couldn't resist, I'll stay on topic..