Suitability of music used in school productions

[LeMarchand]

Leaving aside the copyright concerns, does anyone else in Primary/Junior ever worry about some of the choices that are used/adapted? I know the kids probably hear the songs (and worse) on the radio, but at the moment I'm getting "Jai Ho" on a loop. Nothing offensive about the actual song, but the film that it's from certainly isn't suitable for little ones. Similarly, we used to get "Don't Stop Believin'" a lot: popularised by a show with BJ jokes and drug blackmail (just in the first episode) and seemingly about two strangers hooking up for desperation sex. Not to mention anything from "Grease", a film whose message appears to be "slut yourself up to pull a man" (and smoking is cool)...

 

Maybe I'm reading too much into things.

[jmak]

Our street dance lessons for year 1 (so 5 and 6 years old) were using cake by the ocean. The teacher (external provider) had a nice clean edit, but as you say, the kids then go home and listen to whichever version is easily available on YouTube. I'm not comfortable either.

[LeMarchand]

Our street dance lessons

 

Nothing has stood out to me during the ones I've heard, but then AFAICT (old fogey alert!) virtually any music used is those lessons is going to be performed by men with very misogynistic outlooks or women who don't wear very many clothes who claim shaking their bits is "empowering" and it all blurs into a morass of "ooh baby"/"yeah"/"uh-hu, uh-hu" to me.

 

I did look up the song you mentioned - yeah, not suitable.

[Bompalompalomp]

You can't really avoid cultural osmosis. These songs aren't made for kids, but they're unavoidable to them. They're on TV, on the radio but most importantly they're on the internet where the kids can and will view them no matter what.

 

It's the same argument about performers who happen to have young fans being s*xual. Ariana Grande, Miley & Little Mix are perfectly free to do their own thing however they please, but some people will always throw a fit because they see them as children's pop stars rather than pop stars who happen to have young fans. It's not their fault that children are a fan of their music, but I've had quite a few arguments with men online trying to shame them into "stop dressing like wh***s". They're grown adults who can do what they like.

 

At this point, a lot of songs are more known by kids from covers or other random things they're in (Looking at you, Glee...) than anything someone older might remember it from. And at this point, Grease *is* a family movie that's always on TV, like it or not. Slumdog Millionaire and Jai Ho were everywhere because they were popular and kids are bound to hear it and like it.

 

I see this coming up a lot recently but it's not a new phenomenon, so I'm never quite sure why. It's not like Mambo No.5 or Hit me Baby One More Time were ever the most suitable for my school discos, but they were always played. Kids don't care.

 

Also, Don't Stop Believing was one of my favourite songs as a kid and I have no clue what show you're referencing?

[CAM]

Unless it makes explicit references to something unsavoury (example: Feel Good Hit of the Summer or a track laden with swearing) then it's fine in my book. Childrens films these days are littered with stuff the parents get but soar clear over the kids' heads.

[LeMarchand]

@Bompalompalomp

 

I understand what you're saying, but I just think that as educational establishments maybe a bit more thought should be put into what is being used - bearing in mind the lyrical content and the source of the song's popularity.

 

Re pop stars, I think that they should know their own market and try to be suitable role models. If they don't like being popular with tweenies, then they should try recording some proper songs.

 

Grease is a top bugbear of mine. How the heck is it family viewing? "Tell me more... did she put up a fight?" So date rape is joke?

 

BTW, the show that made DSB popular you've already mentioned: Glee.

[hardtailstar]

@BompalompalompGrease is a top bugbear of mine. How the heck is it family viewing? "Tell me more... did she put up a fight?" So date rape is joke?

 

I dont think that lyric is about rape....

[LeMarchand]

I dont think that lyric is about rape....

 

Intrigued as to your interpretation...

[mavhc]

8 Romantic Songs You Didn't Know Were About Rape

[DJ-1701]

Intrigued as to your interpretation...

 

I would assume more metaphorical, so resisting his wooing technique, his boyish and ruggish charm rather than anything physical.

[hardtailstar]

I would assume more metaphorical, so resisting his wooing technique, his boyish and ruggish charm rather than anything physical.

 

That's how I interpret it. Nothing to do with rape or anything horrid like that.

[LeMarchand]

8 Romantic Songs You Didn't Know Were About Rape

 

Just shows people should pay better attention to the lyrics! Including me - I'd never realised that about "Possession" (maybe the title should've clued me in). I blame "Due South" for lulling me into a false sense of security.

 

 

Must keep this knowledge from Mme LeMarchand - she loves this song. That Sarah McLachlan is a bit of a sneaky lady. I used to play one off her albums when I managed a shop until one of my staff pointed out she drops an F bomb in one of the tracks. I thought those Canadians were polite!

 

Not "romantic" but I'm always amazed that Mme LeMarchand likes Foreigner's "Hot Blooded":

 

Are you old enough? Will you be ready when I call you bluff?

Is my timing right? Did you save your love for me tonight?

[LeMarchand]

I would assume more metaphorical, so resisting his wooing technique, his boyish and ruggish charm rather than anything physical.

 

That's how I interpret it. Nothing to do with rape or anything horrid like that.

 

Sorry, but the key word is "fight". Especially as the boys are interested in the physicality of the encounter: "Did you get very far?"

[Bompalompalomp]

Personally, Grease is a pet peeve of mine mostly for all the reasons you listed, especially that lyric (which I did not say I condoned) and the ending.

 

My point is that it's so well engrained in culture (it's always on TV during holidays, there's stage musical versions of it that even kids do, the live version on the BBC, etc...) that is *is* undoubtedly a movie that families watch with their children and is considered a family movie and musical.

[hardtailstar]

Sorry, but the key word is "fight". Especially as the boys are interested in the physicality of the encounter: "Did you get very far?"

 

Fight has lots of meanings. You can fight without being physical. They talk about a summer romance of course 'lads' talk about getting far its a natural thing.

[LeMarchand]

Personally, Grease is a pet peeve of mine mostly for all the reasons you listed, especially that lyric (which I did not say I condoned) and the ending.

 

My point is that it's so well engrained in culture (it's always on TV during holidays, there's stage musical versions of it that even kids do, the live version on the BBC, etc...) that is *is* undoubtedly a movie that families watch with their children and is considered a family movie and musical.

 

I don't disagree that "Grease" is seen as a family movie by many people. I do feel that as establishments of education schools should be pointing out that it isn't suitable.

 

P.S. The BJ joke was in the second ep of "Glee", not the pilot - my bad.

 

Emma: [hears Rachel throwing up] Rachel, did you just throw up?

Rachel: No.

Emma: You missed the toilet.

Rachel: The girl who was throwing up before me left that. I tried, but I guess I just don't have a gag reflex.

Emma: One day when you're older, that'll turn out to be a gift.

[LeMarchand]

Fight has lots of meanings. You can fight without being physical. They talk about a summer romance of course 'lads' talk about getting far its a natural thing.

 

The girls talk about romance; the boys talk about sex. I suppose that when he claims they "got friendly down in the sand" he's just trying to imply they were discussing the works of Sartre?

[jthompson]

I've never seen Grease, but I remember my OH laughing about a lyric in it along the lines of someone having a rocket in their pocket.

 

Or was that West Side Story?

[DJ-1701]

The girls talk about romance; the boys talk about sex. I suppose that when he claims they "got friendly down in the sand" he's just trying to imply they were discussing the works of Sartre?

 

I'm starting to think this should be in the politics forum...

[LeMarchand]

I've never seen Grease, but I remember my OH laughing about a lyric in it along the lines of someone having a rocket in their pocket.

 

Or was that West Side Story?

 

West Side Story.

 

...and there was me thinking I'd come up with the best pick up line ever .

 

I'm starting to think this should be in the politics forum...

 

I'm beginning to think I was the only one paying attention in all those "analyze this poem" exercises in English Lit.

 

You lot will be trying to tell me that "Oi drove moi tractor through yore haystack last night" refers to an unfortunate collision between a farm vehicle and a pile of straw next.

[DJ-1701]

I'm beginning to think I was the only one paying attention in all those "analyze this poem" exercises in English Lit.

 

Turned American have we? Certainly not the only one that had, but things can be viewed in multiple ways, call me naive if you wish, but I don't think it's as horrid as you believe. Though this does bring up a good point that others can see things in a completely different light and therefore people should be extra cautious.

 

You lot will be trying to tell me that "Oi drove moi tractor through yore haystack last night" refers to an unfortunate collision between a farm vehicle and a pile of straw next.

 

It isn't?!

[jthompson]

After reading this thread, I feel a strong urge to go home and watch This is Spinal Tap (definitely not suitable for a primary school production).

 

Back on topic, my view is that young people may not be giving any real thought to what lyrics mean (well, I never did), even though they may know them off by heart. Reading song lyrics without the music can sometimes make them seem laughably inappropriate, but when listened to as part of the song, they may just be being taken in as sounds, rather than words with a meaning. That being said, it's perhaps wise to consider what a parent might make of it. It may also be that the staff member selecting the song hasn't really thought about the lyrics either.

[LeMarchand]

Turned American have we?

 

I tried the UK spelling, but it just didn't look right.

 

When you regenerate to the War Doctor your views on the film may change!

[mavhc]

They're mostly censorship avoiding words I guess, people would complain if you used the actual language, although I guess now that's changed somewhat, they just actually mute the words.

 

In terms of anything old, and possibly modern, there's the cultural/biological stereotype that boys want sex and girls don't, and have to be tricked somehow, which was destroyed biologically with birth control, culture is still catching up. And that's the main problem, the continuation of that stereotype.

[LeMarchand]

So, I did a little digging and found that I wasn't the only one with concerns about "Grease". Here's a list of some more problematic scenes. The title of the article is slightly NSFW and the still accompanying the second point may well have people thinking you're into some weird pr0n.

 

To highlight some of them (and add a couple):

 

 

• Danny tries to grope Sandy against her will and then tries to force himself on her (there's also a, erm, "tumescence caught in door" bit in there). This behaviour is from the "romantic" male lead in the film (he ultimately wins the girl's affection which doesn't send a great message). Following this he bleats about being "stranded at the drive in" - a fate he surely deserved.
  
• Unsafe contraception practices. (Even if they were being sensible, possibly not a topic for a "family" film?)
  
• "Meditate in my direction/Feel your way" - uh-huh. (Admittedly this one might pass the little 'uns by).
  
• The lyrics to "Greased Lightning" refer to the car as a "pu**y wagon", plus they sing "You know that ain't no sh**/We'll be getting lots of t*t/In Greased Lightning" and apparently the car will make the "chicks cream".
  
• There's a whole song mocking Sandy for being a virgin and not smoking (the routine to the song includes "leg spreading" motions).
  

 

I say!