Mike_Bostock

Hi. 4Matrix links with Bromcom and Arbor using their API and offers Wonde as an option. It is fairly seamless in practice and aided by a 6000 item subject database which ensures all the calculations are accurate.

Hello. I note that our product, 4Matrix, has been mentioned and thought I would offer a contribution to this thread. Our company is pleased to work in partnership with the major MIS suppliers, including SIMS, Bromcom and Arbor. We have provided data analysis tools and services for over 20 years so that schools have a choice in how they make use of their tracking and exam data, including our 'Share and Compare' service on Results Day. We aim to provide the best professional tools for data leaders along with CPD opportunities from our own school-based experts. From 2025 we will be completely web-based with a team developing further features useful to a keen, self-evaluating school.

Hello All. Mike from 4Matrix here. As there has been a mention of 4Matrix, a data analysis system which imports data from an MIS, I thought it would be useful to say that 4Matrix works in conjunction with the major MIS used by English secondary schools. This means that if your school is moving from, say, SIMS to Arbor or Bromcom or Cloud School, you will find that 4Matrix will continue to work really well with these MIS. As technical partners to these companies we have developed Easy Importers which make it really easy to import rich data from each of these MIS. If you are staying with SIMS then you can be reassured that our Easy Importer will continue to work effectively with this MIS.

If there are problems with UAC or similar when running 4Matrix, the following document should help provide the answer. http://www.4matrix.com/help/update_help.pdf Do feel free to contact us directly for a speedy answer if you have any technical issues with 4Matrix.

Hello It will always be better to use our support options to find solutions to any technical problems which may arise when using 4Matrix. We will usually sort out problems like this in minutes. regards Mike Bostock

Hello Jrma91 CAM's reply to your question about importing data into 4Matrix is exactly right. However, you might also like to see our new series of video tutorials which are currently available at Video Tutorials | 4Matrix Online. These are designed to help data managers with importing data from various MIS' and from spreadsheets. (These may be moved into the private user's area shortly, but for now they are there for all to see.) You can also use our Live Chat facility at Welcome | 4Matrix Online if you need live help with any issue. regards Mike Bostock

Thanks Tombry. It is worth taking a look at what additional tools are available and deciding on which provide the school with the tools and approaches that it needs in order to make a difference. The value of data lies in what it gives rise to, and it would be surprising if one system gave you all you need. SISRA is another data system that is worth looking into. A problem is that schools may think they are doing good things with data, but unless they see the work of other schools that really are at the leading edge in this respect they may not see the need to improve what they do. Aston Academy would be an example of a school that gained an outstanding judgement for leadership based on its use of performance data, and which was showcased by the SSAT. There are many more examples.

Providing useful information about individual teacher performance is an interesting and, of course, a sensitive subject. The methods used need to be robust if judgments are to be made about individual teacher performance. The approach described, i.e. to examine differences from estimated grades, is of interest but it is important to make sure there is only when variable when making comparisons; i.e. the effect of the teaching. In this case there may be variability in the estimated grades, unless they are strictly determined on the basis of prior attainment. Watch out too for the effects of setting. The Fischer Family Trust provides useful data that can be used to remove the effects of comparing different ability sets, or different subjects. The issue here is Within School Variation - the variability of provision between different teaching groups. Tackling this subject has proved to be difficult for school leaders, yet it is estimated that removing such differences can improve standards by up to 10%.

Hello Jay. Most support calls we get are to do with not putting correct proxy server settings into the 4Matrix Network Manager application, followed by not allowing the application to run exe files within its folder or the temp folder, then problems to do with blocking our update site. i.e. the majority of reported problems are network settings issue - but yes, people do find bugs too - for which we are grateful for the feedback. However it is the case that we lose a fair percentage of conversions from free trials to taking out a licence - even with a free helpline and remote support - due to it being an installed SQL networked application like SIMS or CMIS, and with school leaders being put off by these technical issues, even though most are easily resolved. This is one very good reason for us thinking of moving to a web-based version, despite the many advantages that I can see to having the whole application working in the school in a controlled environment. I would love to know what network managers think about this. From our angle, it is hard to know what to do to make it easier to install and get working, but I am aware that several suppliers are moving away from a school-maintained approach to a web environment for this and other reasons. When we set up a trial we ask for the details of the network manager in order to make initial contact and offer to help with installation and setup, but we don't always get this information.

Version 3 of 4Matrix has a good few changes from the last version, mostly the appearance and menu system but also several low-level improvements. Version 3.0.0.1 corrects a few issues found, but problems updating were not amongst them. The thing to check is permissions on the application folder so that the small update exe file can run. If need be, define a custom temp folder in the 4Matrix Network Manager application and give it full permissions. Check too that if you use a shortcut it goes to Launcher.exe rather than to 4Matrix.exe. Also see the FAQs and if it is still an issue please come on Live Support at 4Matrix | Professional tools for school leaders and we will sort it out for you.

Thanks Charlotte. This is not a problem. To say 4Matrix is not for you is to acknowledge your assessment of it, and also the fact that it probably wasn't designed for what you have in mind. With good wishes for finding an approach that works for you.

Thanks for asking the question David. Like most suppliers, we don't put prices on our website for similar reasons. We charge a low annual cost for any size school and any number of users. We offer discounts on three year licences. It is worth saying that 4Matrix is a sophisticated, easily-installable, networkable SQL-driven Microsoft application. It will automatically pull a wealth of data from SIMS using a built-in application written for us by TASC Software - a SIMS Premier Partner. It will also easily import data from CMIS etc. and you can copy and paste into it from Excel. Please contact me via the website if you would like to know more.

I think etiquette here allows me to respond if our product is mentioned. I don't mind people hating 4Matrix but I wouldn't like this to be the last word about it on these forums. Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion, but actually 4Matrix will probably do everything and more that the original post asked for. Please look at the flip brochure at http://www.4matrix.org/exams to see what it will do on exam results day for the 250-ish schools that are already using 4Matrix. I hope that this link won't be censored because I think I am entitled to defend my product and this is the most efficient way to do so. The other implicit criterion mentioned in the first few posts was cost. 4Matrix is intended as a high-value, low-cost product. It was developed as a school improvement tool rather than a data analysis package and intended for use by school leaders primarily, supported by a data manager. It supports an approach to reducing in-school variation that has lead to at least one school getting an Outstanding Ofsted report recently and attributing that to their use of 4Matrix. This particular school (Aston Academy) is the subject of an SSAT school event on 6th July where the head will be demonstrating how teachers use 4Matrix to raise standards and develop the QA role of leaders. Please go along if you can and judge for yourself the impact. Then judge the value of 4Matrix against its cost. Rationally, you can't really dislike that.

I thought I would add another contribution to this thread having attended the National College Conference exhibition this week. Whilst there I tried to remember to ask the Cloud question of headteachers who visited our stand. Looking back, it was probably only about 10 heads and another exhibitor who I asked about Cloud MIS, but reactions from this small sample were interesting, nevertheless. I can report that only one headteacher I spoke with had a specific view on this question, and that head made the point that their VLE was Cloud-based and it would be more convenient for connectivity if their MIS was as well. For others their prime consideration was that their MIS worked reliably and they weren't particularly bothered about where the application lived. My interest in this question lies in the fact that the system that we market draws data from different school MIS solutions. At the present time, over 90% (probably closer to 95%) of MIS in schools are installable, networked, SQL-database driven Microsoft applications. For our system to have a rich connection to the data fields in an MIS there is no question that it is far more efficient because our application is also an installable, networked, SQL-database driven Microsoft application. The main point made in my discussion with a supplier who markets a related Cloud-based product was access from home by teachers. Thinking this over, I am still of a view that if it was me, I would prefer a VPN solution that also gave me access to all my other files and applications on my work computer. So, for me anyway, I think I will wait a while longer until the percentage of MIS in schools that are Cloud-based grows a bit, before putting resources into developing a Cloud version of our application.

Thanks for all the responses so far to this question about whether Cloud Computing will become the required format for school Information Management Systems. There seems to be an equal number of pros and cons to having a school's data managed offsite and delivered to a school through a browser. It certainly feels like there isn't yet a definitive answer to the question, so I look forward to seeing the discussion continue. Probably one of the reasons for the lack of a yes/no answer is that I didn't start by defining my criteria and then asking for advice on a best-fit solution. Perhaps I should have said I wanted a solution to managing my information that was effective, low-maintenance, economical, accessible to all users, extensible, interoperable, adaptable to changes in legislation, etc. But even then I suspect that the answer would depend on individual school circumstances. For example, if a school has a technical team with good skills then there is perhaps more choice than if it doesn't. One of the things that is haunting me about Cloud solutions is that it sounds very much like the days of mainframe computers and dumb terminals. Of course, most of us are too young to know much about these things, but I am told that there was a lack of user empowerment and an absolute dependence on the quality of traffic on the wire that delivered it to you. Of course, things don't need to be like that with modern systems but I would suggest that questions about these two aspects of the Cloud will keep needing to be asked. Historically, when processing power became cheap, PCs took over from mainframes. The case for Cloud has its example in things like search engines. By using Google we are using their network of thousands of computers to do a processing task that we couldn't do with our PC on its own. I suggest that we need to find similar arguments when we specify Cloud as the solution to other types of problem. One problem that I think we have here with our specification is that we assume that the current function of MIS will always remain the same. The very name 'Management' Information Systems does suggest the passive organisation of data for managers to look at. I would feel that, at a time when money is particularly tight, the question of Value for Money will come to the fore. i.e. Does the system do enough for what we are paying out? In the case of MIS that needs to include both the cost of the system itself and the cost of the people who maintain and manage it. I personally don't think that 'managing information' is going to be demanding enough for schools in the future. The whole point of collecting data must lie in what a school does with it and the impact that is having on the effectiveness of the school. For example, we might wish to judge a registration system on whether it reduces truancy and helps allocate additional learning to those who missed out through illness. In the area that interests me - performance data - collecting pupils' scores and colouring them red or green may be where many schools are, but it isn't going to impress a visiting inspector unless a school can show what the school did with this information and whether their processes are improving standards. A while ago we put together a checklist of sorts to try to suggest to schools how far they needed to go in moving from a 'functional' use of data, to a 'systemic' use - with a high impact on the work of a school. This checklist can be seen at this link. What is useful about something like this (and I don't claim it is the complete picture) is that it can help us be more specific about our requirements in order to answer the question about whether Cloud is a good approach in any particular case. If I take an example, if a school wants all teachers to engage in the school's performance data and undertake research using it, then a distributed approach will become an important criteria. A school might then puzzle why it has a 'Data Manager' to manage the school's data when it doesn't delegate one person to do the breathing for everyone else. This may suggest a Cloud approach if teachers wish to make a lot of use of the MIS away from the school - or maybe a good networked solution coupled with VPN would have more advantages. Will Cloud computing put limits on what you can do? Does browser technology have limitations over a standard PC application which become amplified when you are processing a lot of data? Which data technically needs to be processed locally and which remotely? What data will we need to cache? If we are working with data across several applications does Cloud become a barrier or not? I could go on, but this reply would get even longer than it is. So, for me the answer to Cloud lies in whether it meets the criteria I suggested earlier, avoids the twin problems of disempowerment or dependency on delivery speed, is not restricted in what it can do through using browser technology, and that the MIS solution chosen has an impact on the work of the school that can be weighed up against its cost.