Timesheets?

[elsiegee40]

It seems likely that the non-teaching staff here are all going to have to keep timesheets to account for their activities...

 

I had to do this in 15 minute slots when working "in industry" as my time was cross-charged and didn't have a problem with it.

 

I just can't see it working here... In my case I'm part-time (at home now - so no time wasting issues!) and my contract covers more than one job... not just the IT. Then there's the stuff that I'm trying to get added in to my contract (actually this might help).

 

Do other schools have timesheets? Does it work for you as well as the Bursar?

[tscnmuk]

This was talked about at one of the schools I work with and a pilot was actually carried out. They stopped it as soon as they reaslised jobs were taking considerably longer due to the time necesity on filling out the time sheets themselves. I wouldn't have a "problem" with it as such but can imagine it would become quite boring.

[acrobson]

Under BSF we have time sheets, our BSFer is the LEA who won the contract, however we also operate on a flexi time basis, which makes everything fit nicely.

[Halfmad]

We aren't required to do them, frankly it'd waste a lot of time filling them in!

[elsiegee40]

I can see me remembering to claim all the excess hours I work if I have to keep detailed timesheets... SMT may then decide it's cheaper not to bother!

[witch]

You Should claim all the extra hours you do - otherwise the powers-that-be think that the job can be done in the time you are officially there.

This happens far too much both in industry AND education.

We all do a bit of extra here and there, but if it is regular and excessive you should be paid for it.

None of us are paid very much anyway, and if you work part-time then the extra you do is even longer as a percentage of your paid time if you see what I mean (I work 2 hours a day in one school, and was regularly doing an extra half an hour a day until my husband pointed out that I was doing 25% extra for free - the same as if he did nearly 2 hours a day extra - I hadnt looked at it like that before)

Timesheets are a waste of effort - especially in a job like ours where you can be flitting about between several jobs and be caught over the other side of the school to 'just fix' something which you have forgotten you did by the time you get back to your timesheet!

[elsiegee40]

Timesheets are a waste of effort - especially in a job like ours where you can be flitting about between several jobs and be caught over the other side of the school to 'just fix' something which you have forgotten you did by the time you get back to your timesheet!

 

I totally agree

 

@witch: I do claim most of my extra hours. However Timesheets will just ensure I remember ALL of them

[Geoff]

Time sheets are useful from a management perspective. You can see where your tech support is being used up (and potentially do something to solve underlying problem if throwing more man hours at the problem isn't working). I think I've suggested this approach in the past when building on the success of a help desk based technical support system (for example FITs).

 

Conversely, they are useful to employees when you get into a dispute with your line management or SMT over what your actually doing and how long it's taking. Sadly we've also discussed this on several occasions.

 

Obviously using time sheets to claim overtime is just a more mild form of this.

[Grommit]

We rejected it for the ICT department.. as we are not busy all the time and job logging for research on the internet is not an option..

 

So i sent this back to the SLT..

 

10min per day doing the sheet..

 

50min per week

 

or 2400 min for a 48 week year = 40 hours divide by 8 hours = 5 working days

 

So that one full week to fill out the form x 4 Techs= 1 entire month of manpower just filling out the form..

 

and I didn't even take off lunch...

[enjay]

I sometimes keep one so I can get a general overview of where the support time is going, i.e. specific hardware/software evaluation, general "reading around the subject" for new products/technologies, installing software, fixing hardware, fixing software, supporting teaching staff, supporting students.

 

This is only ever for internal use, and I wouldn't want to publish it to anyone else; it is a useful management task though, just like reading through the helpdesk logs and seeing what calls are repeating themselves.

[bossman]

webman and myself had to use timesheets for a year (took a lot of filling in) and all SLT could determine is that we were under staffed but did nothing about it. We now do more for less pay with the same staff.

 

Time and motion (Rich peoples stick to beat the poorer into taking less pay for the work that they do but all legal like).

[NetworkGeezer]

Time sheets are useful from a management perspective. You can see where your tech support is being used up (and potentially do something to solve underlying problem if throwing more man hours at the problem isn't working). I think I've suggested this approach in the past when building on the success of a help desk based technical support system (for example FITs).

 

And how would your NM feel about all the entries saying "posted on Edugeek"

[tosca925]

I don't have enough time in the day as it is let alone spend time filling in time sheets for jobs i do, especially the little jobs.

 

It would take more time to fill the sheet in than do the job for some of them.

[enjay]

@tosca925 - if the job is that quick, it's not really worth recording. imho.

[sidewinder]

We rejected it for the ICT department.. as we are not busy all the time and job logging for research on the internet is not an option..

 

This is where I see the problem

For example today I havent really 'done' anything yet simply because thankfully nothing has gone wrong and there are no outstanding jobs.

So I have been basically just researching on the net and configuring virtual machines...which wouldnt look too good written down

[enjay]

Why would doing research not look good? Part of our job is to review, evaluate and recommend new products. How can we be expected to do that without having done any research??

[pallen]

" - if the job is that quick, it's not really worth recording. imho"

 

But what about all the jobs you get when you walk into a class such as "while your here..." A simple job often turns into 3-4 simple jobs which when added together takes time. Not filling in a time sheet would end up showing hours of no work over weeks. Filling in time sheets you double the time spent on simple jobs and cut down your time on the more imporatant ones.

 

To be honest I dont have a problem either way of filling in time sheets. But I dont think they give a true refection of the work you do. Poeple dont fully understand what we do anyway. If your busy your not going to do it straight away, it will be done from memory and the hours added up to make your full day.

[elsiegee40]

@tosca925 - if the job is that quick, it's not really worth recording. imho.

 

My "jobs that quick" take up most of my time! It would be an absolute s*d to record. It took me longer to get to the building where a "sound card was missing" this morning than it did to fix the problem (turn the speakers on)!

[witch]

The only thing I do is keep a basic note of what I do every day (if I can find the time) - this is so I can see what is going on and where all my time has gone. Also, as I work pretty much alone and unsupervised I think it is important that I can justify my time if I have to!!

[_Bat_]

The only thing I do is keep a basic note of what I do every day (if I can find the time) - this is so I can see what is going on and where all my time has gone. Also, as I work pretty much alone and unsupervised I think it is important that I can justify my time if I have to!!

 

I have been recommended to do this before, simply for the latter reason you gave. I don't really do it, but I should, in case someone ever wants to see it. Like you, I work pretty much alone and therefore have no evidence of exactly how much work I am doing in the time I am given.

 

I know some people say there isn't a lot of work to do in primary schools... how wrong they are (as soon as the staff realise there is IT support available to them for half a week each week anyway). I still have quite a backlog of jobs i'm "getting around" to and working overtime is often necessary (I always forget to put my hours in though )

[enjay]

A simple job often turns into 3-4 simple jobs which when added together takes time.

In which case, I would record half an hour spent either on "hardware problems" or "user training" depending on what the 3-4 simple tasks had been. If you look back at the categories I listed, they are all very broad - keeping a timesheet that records time spent "supporting Word" and also "supporting Geography Dept" would be a nightmare!

[_Bat_]

So like, what happens if you do several jobs at the same time? I.e. The majority of my average day goes something like:

 

- Arrive at work

- Start work on website

- Get a call from reception to look at printer

- Arrive back at office after 15 mins and restart work on website

- 5 mins later, get a knock on the door to ask for support in ICT suite

- As I'm fixing PC in ICT Suite, get another teacher come to me and ask for help in her classroom with her laptop, which I attend to after finishing in ICT Suite

- Arrive back at my office and spent 10 mins on website before having to make and receive a couple phone calls about a completely unrelated matter

- Again continue work on website for a few minutes before being call out for something else

 

... and thats pretty much how it goes all day. How do you record something like that? It's easy enough to record all the odd jobs, but what about the website work in-between? How do you record the times it was done in?

[Geoff]

You record it exactly as you've written in. Just fill in little 5/10/15min blocks as 'website development'. Hopefully management will pick up on this silliness and do something about it (Obvious solution is to give you a fixed chunk of time a week to do website work undisturbed, say half a day).

[enjay]

_Bat_ - that would only be a problem if your timesheet was actually timed, i.e. 9am-10am and so on. At the end of the day, you have totalled 30 minutes web site work, so record that.

[sdc]

Don't know if this topic's still of any interest to anyone, but I have written a spreadsheet in Excel which simplifies this process, so far as keeping track of time in and out of work - which aids my case when needing an hour off here or there. Also, helps when explaining about workload! This spreadsheet is fairly automated and does account for things like holidays (both public and school), days off sick, etc. If anyone would like a copy, please let me know - I'd appreciate feedback and thoughts for ways of further developing it.

 

Stephen