And for all the idiots out there, a guide on how to......

[witch]

That's interesting and I wonder if it has changed? I asked both my local MP and the people at the polling station and they said that the spoilt ballot papers were counted, of course (as I expected) but nothing was officially recorded about the comments on them. That's not to say that an opposing party might not take them for their own use - to beat the sitting MP over the head with.

[solitaire89]

I also believe those people who stand or sit outside asking to see your slip are intimidating for some.

 

I agree - but what gets to me is that they don't have any right to ask for it!

[creese]

I agree - but what gets to me is that they don't have any right to ask for it!

 

Excuse my ignorance, I put it down to old age and medical condition that gives me the memory of a .... whatsit. Who are they and why do they ask and should I say no tonight?

[solitaire89]

Hehe - should I rephrase?!

[witch]

They are party workers who are just looking to see who has voted so that they can check against their supporter lists. This way, if someone hasnt voted, they can pop round and see if there is a problem or if someone needs a reminder or a lift.

Ours are very polite and make it VERY clear why they are asking and that you don't have to answer if you choose not to

[tech_guy]

That's interesting and I wonder if it has changed? I asked both my local MP and the people at the polling station and they said that the spoilt ballot papers were counted, of course (as I expected) but nothing was officially recorded about the comments on them. That's not to say that an opposing party might not take them for their own use - to beat the sitting MP over the head with.

 

Yes, as I mentioned earlier, as I was Ward Secretary for one of the parties, we used to attend the count. If there were comments on the paper pertinent to the candidate or the party we would make a note of them. We weren't allowed to touch the papers but we could look over the shoulders of the counters.

[creese]

They are party workers who are just looking to see who has voted so that they can check against their supporter lists. This way, if someone hasnt voted, they can pop round and see if there is a problem or if someone needs a reminder or a lift.

Ours are very polite and make it VERY clear why they are asking and that you don't have to answer if you choose not to

 

You can see how it might be misinterpreted. Maybe I'll politely show them.

[solitaire89]

Ours are very polite and make it VERY clear why they are asking and that you don't have to answer if you choose not to

 

Ours don't - they just stand there in the way of the door, looking official, and then demand to see your slip... it's like you can't go in until you've given it!

[creese]

Ours don't - they just stand there in the way of the door, looking official, and then demand to see your slip... it's like you can't go in until you've given it!

 

Okay maybe I'll reply like for like. See what mood I'm in after paying my dental bill in the way.

[tech_guy]

Party Workers have no right to see your slip. They must not interfere with the voters. They can ask, but mustn't insist.

[solitaire89]

They can ask, but mustn't insist.

 

That's why it gets to me!

[torledo]

I don't think so - but my point was that the teenagers had no idea that the vote is even SUPPOSED to be secret. AFAIC that is what lessons like PCSFE or whatever your school calls it these days - or general studies for the A level lot. The children need to be taught the basics of life - tax, pay, savings, the electoral system etc etc.

But they are not as far as I can see

 

a basic course on, tax, pay, savings etc. will never teach them the real fundamentals of why these things exist and how they come about. That is a major problem in my view. Because that's the starting point, we can't be misleading the youth from the beginning. All you'd be able to teach them is how to do the math.

[srochford]

I can't answer the first bit, I'm not of that opinion but I do know a significant number of people believe it.

 

Point 2. I've not checked recently but aren't there things that could identify you? Are we absolutely sure we can't be traced?

 

I was going to say I don't know how any one could believe a government (or anyone else) can distinguish between not voting as a protest and not voting because I can't be bothered to make the effort but then some people believe the earth is flat ...

 

You can be absolutely sure that you can be traced - surely anyone who's ever voted knows that??? When you go to vote you have to identify yourself - this attempts to make sure you don't vote twice. The polling clerk then crosses off your name and gives you a numbered ballot paper. They write your electoral number down on a sheet next to the number of your paper. Those records are then kept safe so that if there is suspicion of fraud etc it's possible to find out what actually happened in the election. (I think a court order is needed to link the ballot paper to the voter; not sure how often it happens)

 

Before anyone starts complaining about "big brother" and how this last government has eroded our rights, that process has been in place for the 30 odd years I've been voting (and I'm pretty sure I was taught about it at school which is a very long time ago!)

[creese]

I was going to say I don't know how any one could believe a government (or anyone else) can distinguish between not voting as a protest and not voting because I can't be bothered to make the effort but then some people believe the earth is flat ...

 

You can be absolutely sure that you can be traced - surely anyone who's ever voted knows that??? When you go to vote you have to identify yourself - this attempts to make sure you don't vote twice. The polling clerk then crosses off your name and gives you a numbered ballot paper. They write your electoral number down on a sheet next to the number of your paper. Those records are then kept safe so that if there is suspicion of fraud etc it's possible to find out what actually happened in the election. (I think a court order is needed to link the ballot paper to the voter; not sure how often it happens)

 

Before anyone starts complaining about "big brother" and how this last government has eroded our rights, that process has been in place for the 30 odd years I've been voting (and I'm pretty sure I was taught about it at school which is a very long time ago!)

 

Well that's what I thought but wasn't abolutely sure. All it would take was a government who called themselves, let's say... national socialists.... getting the court order would not be difficult. But that would never happen.

[broc]

Well that's what I thought but wasn't abolutely sure. All it would take was a government who called themselves, let's say... national socialists.... getting the court order would not be difficult. But that would never happen.

 

So people who don't vote, or spoil their vote & allow 'extreme' minority parties with enough activists motivated to turn out and win an election & then we will get our worst nightmares....

[creese]

So people who don't vote, or spoil their vote & allow 'extreme' minority parties with enough activists motivated to turn out and win an election & then we will get our worst nightmares....

 

That's pretty much what happened in the 30s. Following disallusion and high inflation.

[torledo]

for those who are talking about voter apathy. Politics and being involved in politics isn't some once in a 5-year event. It happens in our daily lives, if you go about your business

not interested in finding out about our political systems we have in place or are content to keep believing many of the myths repeated in the msm [including independent reporters of news

and current affairs] are you not apathetic ? Or if you do not engage political issues or are somehow indifferent to it all [and have more important things to do] are you not apathetic.

 

i hold my hand up to being largely apathetic on many local issues, not going out and voting may make me more apathetic. but if i'm genuinley unsure of or are largely indifferent to the outcome of an election....who's to say i'm wrong to stay at home....

Edited May 6, 2010 by torledo

[creese]

who's to say i'm wrong to stay at home....

 

You are not, the day you are 'expected' to turn up and vote is the day we cease to be a democracy. Aren't of solidiers out fighting that sort of thing?

[broc]

You could however argue that failing to exercise your right to vote means you no longer have legitimate grounds to complain about the voting habits of others....... & the consequent political & economic direction the country heads in.....

 

I suppose if you are too apathetic to have any interest in politics & why it is important to cast your vote you may not care anyway.....

[pete]

Voting every handful of years does not a democracy make. Top tip for our local minority extremist candidates? If your party leader keeps banging on about how you're not a bunch of nazis, you might want to make sure your candidates don't look like combat 18 members.

 

Oh, and the guy who thought it would be a great plan to drive around with a loudhailer at 8am on Sunday? Yeah - nil points.

[torledo]

You could however argue that failing to exercise your right to vote means you no longer have legitimate grounds to complain about the voting habits of others....... & the consequent political & economic direction the country heads in.....

 

I suppose if you are too apathetic to have any interest in politics & why it is important to cast your vote you may not care anyway.....

 

there are noticably few differences between the parties, as far as the political and economic direction. The credibility of some of the smaller parties can be questioned as can the lack

of detail from all parties....that's even before we scrutinize what detail there is. And so you can't assume that the voting habits of others will lead to a change of direction.

 

i think it's more important to appreciate this, than to put all store in the act of voting once every five years.

[creese]

Oh, and the guy who thought it would be a great plan to drive around with a loudhailer at 8am on Sunday? Yeah - nil points.

 

Likewise the clever clogs who put a handwritten envelope on the communial stairway with a letter, in blue script, addressed 'Dear Friend'. I'm not your friend and lucky for you I didn't read enough to see which party you are from.

 

Of course the bloke with the loudhailer could have been from an opposing party.

[SteveBentley]

As well as the party workers, there could well be somebody doing an exit poll.

 

There should have been an organised campaign to get everybody to lie to them, just for a laugh

[broc]

there are noticably few differences between the parties, as far as the political and economic direction. The credibility of some of the smaller parties can be questioned as can the lack

of detail from all parties....that's even before we scrutinize what detail there is. And so you can't assume that the voting habits of others will lead to a change of direction.

 

i think it's more important to appreciate this, than to put all store in the act of voting once every five years.

 

While I can see where you are coming from and have sympathy with your view, what is the solution? Are you saying nobody should vote.... and everyone should complain about every political party & every politician & about every decision made that doesn't fit in with their views or benefit them individually? Or let apathy rule....?

[SteveBentley]

Let's get this straight - apathy is not voting because you can't be arsed.

 

Not voting or spoiling your paper because you have made a considered decision that none of the offered candidates is acceptable to you is far from apathy.