Looking at new MIS' - Bromcom, SIMS, RM, Pupil Asset

[timbo343]

We are looking at a new MIS soon and our LEA have provided us with who are in the running.

 

I was wondering if anyone has used the following either in the past or using now and let me know how they compare.

 

Bromcom,

SIMS (we are using at the moment),

RM,

Pupil Asset.

 

Thanks

[JATSO]

We are looking at a new MIS soon and our LEA have provided us with who are in the running.

 

I was wondering if anyone has used the following either in the past or using now and let me know how they compare.

 

Bromcom,

SIMS (we are using at the moment),

RM,

Pupil Asset.

 

Thanks

I look after some Primary Schools, and we have used Sims (Onsite) Bromcom and we have just had 2 of my schools move to Scholarpack from Bromcom and they are really impressed with it. SIMS is supposed to available for online now and I would like to get my 2 remaining schools to move to the cloud either with Sims or another MIS but they are stuck in their ways and with Sims so it could be a battle.

Edited January 30, 2017 by JATSO

[vikpaw]

From that selection, I'd stick with SIMS.

[timbo343]

From that selection, I'd stick with SIMS.

 

thats what i said to the bursar, sometimes its better the devil you know plus all the heart ache of changing, but its up to them i guess.

[yac2016]

From that selection I would stick with Sims also.

[2ilent8cho]

Have they not looked at iSAMS ?

[timbo343]

Have they not looked at iSAMS ?

 

Its not on the list from the LEA.

[elsiegee40]

Its not on the list from the LEA.

 

Do you have to buy through the LA?

[timbo343]

Do you have to buy through the LA?

 

I dont know, i presume so as that's where the discounts are. I'm taking at back seat on this as my input wont really matter, there are others that i feel with overrule what i say. At the end of the day, im going to have to try and support it what ever we choose.

[matt40k]

@timbo343 - you using this list? - MIS & FAS Framework. Assume this is for your high school? Assuming so, its because "current contract ends on the 31/03/2017". Good to hear they are activity looking into it and not just ticking the renewal box, regardless what they pick.

[timbo343]

@timbo343 - you using this list? - MIS & FAS Framework. Assume this is for your high school? Assuming so, its because "current contract ends on the 31/03/2017". Good to hear they are activity looking into it and not just ticking the renewal box, regardless what they pick.

Thats the one matey. We only got told a couple of weeks ago.

[clickrgs]

We're sticking with SIMS @timbo343

I wouldn't want to use anything else and our Data Manager doesn't want to either ha!

[Banjo]

With the next version of Sims around the corner might be worth holding fire on a change of MIS until its released. I pity the LA involved having to deal with one of the suppliers on the list

[matt40k]

I wouldn't hold fire otherwise you'll be holding fire forever. Put it is way, SOLUS3 was stable and usable in Sept 2011. That's nearly 6 years ago. It's free, recommended by the supplier and has next to zero red tape, how did it take most folks to roll out SOLUS3 fully? Now try doing something as complex as a MIS!! See you in 20 years lol

 

I'm sure I don't know which supplier you mean hehe

[vikpaw]

I dont know, i presume so as that's where the discounts are. I'm taking at back seat on this as my input wont really matter, there are others that i feel with overrule what i say. At the end of the day, im going to have to try and support it what ever we choose.

On the contrary, you should take part along with your DM and support the process. Draw up a basic list of requirements , or pros and cons, to further evaluate the options they've given you. You'd hope they have whittled down the original list to this based on some criteria, but rather than let management / LA make a decision based on price / bells & whistles / grass is greener - i'd try and give some useful feedback. It looks like you're free to choose at least from those options, so you don't have to go with the crowd. I might have misunderstood the process your LA is taking or how that framework works.

 

From a scale / stability point of view plus taking into account what the total cost of change could be bearing in mind training, transfer etc. I'd say stay with you are.

 

I don't think the move to the 'new' SIMS will be straightforward ( @Banjo ) - I suspect that if it's a game changing evolution ( ) they won't be able to give it away as a 'no extra cost' upgrade and there will likely need to be a tender process to treat it like a full MIS change.

Edited January 31, 2017 by vikpaw

[robjduk]

Don't mean to annoy anyone but the "lets just stick with SIMS" attitude is what is causing all the problems. Some really good looking solutions out there so at least look at them and how they fill your requirements before committing to SIMS.

[Michael]

I suspect the likelihood is that said schools are not yet part of a MAT. Try running SIMS over a WAN connection and you'll see there's a problem. In Capita's defence, it was never designed to be used this way, hence why they also are developing a web version of SIMS/FMS.

 

Factor in that it will probably be a staged rollout and like anything new, it will have its issues. There are already other web based MIS's on the market that have been around for years, so I certainly wouldn't judge a book by its cover!

[RootsSchImp]

I've worked with lots of SIMS schools and I also freelance for Bromcom. The big advantage of a cloud based system like Bromcom is that you can access it from anywhere, it's also easier to automate behaviour and reporting tasks and (unless Capita have made big improvements recently) the customer support is better than for SIMS. But you have to set that against the costs of money and hassle in switching. If your staff like SIMS and don't want to change then making them do so would almost certainly be more trouble than it's worth.

[Michael]

I've worked with lots of SIMS schools and I also freelance for Bromcom. The big advantage of a cloud based system like Bromcom is that you can access it from anywhere, it's also easier to automate behaviour and reporting tasks and (unless Capita have made big improvements recently) the customer support is better than for SIMS. But you have to set that against the costs of money and hassle in switching. If your staff like SIMS and don't want to change then making them do so would almost certainly be more trouble than it's worth.

 

I agree, but schools moving to SIMS now wouldn't necessarily be a good move. Will Capita still support legacy SIMS in 10 years? Most unlikely, so schools will be forced to change at some point and it's important to think ahead as migration costs are not cheap.

[mikkydoos]

End of the day the biggest hassle is the re-training of staff and change of operation processes.

 

It most likely isn't worth the change.

[Michael]

End of the day the biggest hassle is the re-training of staff and change of operation processes.

 

It most likely isn't worth the change.

 

But the question is, if a high percentage of schools are using legacy SIMS, they will need to change at some point. Be it a requirements change, or a directive of a MAT. Will SIMS Online look identical to legacy SIMS? I doubt it, simply because the interface will be designed to operate on touch screens. I suspect it'll look totally different.

[pcstru]

We switched to Bromcom from CMIS/ePortal and are now in our second year. I described the changeover here. Our Admin team seems to like the system as generally do teaching staff. There is a bit of "ah well if we had SIMS we could just copy what other schools are doing" from a few senior leaders - which I think is probably a little naive. I've personally some history with SIMS going back to 1993 but we have never used it here. IMO we made the right choice for the right reasons and I'd expect if we went through the process again, it would be the same result.

[elsiegee40]

But the question is, if a high percentage of schools are using legacy SIMS, they will need to change at some point. Be it a requirements change, or a directive of a MAT. Will SIMS Online look identical to legacy SIMS? I doubt it, simply because the interface will be designed to operate on touch screens. I suspect it'll look totally different.

 

You could argue the same about any software /OS

 

"You're going to have to move from Windows 7 eventually because it will go out of support; the next Windows OS's won't look identical because they will be designed to operate on touch screens. Why not consider Mac or Linux?"

 

It is a massive step to change a MIS. Training does need to be considered, along with the ease of moving the existing database over and access requirements.

 

I totally agree that it's not something any school IT department should allow their school to make without being involved from the start.

 

I'm not saying stick with SIMS; I'm recommending that @timbo343 makes sure he's taking an active part in the decision making.

[Michael]

You could argue the same about any software /OS

 

Exactly - I very much doubt any of us are using Office 2003. Many MIS systems in use are older than 10 years old.

 

I don't think changing MIS is any more massive than changing other integral systems. You're right it's all about training and support, but also the needs of schools (more crucially) have changed or are changing.

 

I just find the mindset fascinating, as a large percentage of schools quite happily have changed e-mail systems across the years, be it from LA hosted systems or other, to the likes of GAFE or O365. E-mail is extremely important to how any school functions.

 

I think it's one of those things whereby it sounds daunting, but then the advantages are immediately apparent and make everyone more productive. Gone are the days of the MIS system being office only, as now they're used school wide, yet in a lot of cases we're still using that same legacy model, be it on a larger scale.

 

Another angle to look at is how many add-ons are schools purchasing to work alongside the MIS (tapping into its database)? A solution that natively includes all or more functionality is advantageous for all, in terms of costs and training. It really is a no brainer. If you added up all these costs, it wouldn't surprise me if it doubles the cost of the original MIS!

[karldenton]

We use bromcom. We used to have it hosted here, but now we pay for the cloud version. Apart from occasional downtime, it works great for us. Support is great and always answer the phone. We don't use things like behaviour and assessment but they do those also. I know Bromcom recently won the Telford and Wrekin contract.