Kent BSF Wave 3: 11 schools and Northgate

[Deaks]

Northgate has recently been appointed preffered bidder for the first parts of the Kent BSF contracts and our school will be one of the first to change over. I'm interested to know what system they have put in place in the past in schools with regard to servers, desktops, student and staff laptops etc....

 

It appears from my Googling that in the past they have largely sub-contracted to RM but they were bidding against RM for the Kent contract so there seems to be a conflict there. I'm also obviously interested in what they do about existing staff and what areas of ICT support they leave to the school to sort out themselves.

 

I would be interested in any on or off the record comments and can be emailed directly via [email protected] if you would your comments not to be on a public forum.

Edited March 11, 2008 by Deaks

[beeswax]

you could do a search for Northgate, though here's one I did earlier.

[Geoff]

The BSF contract with Kent will cover this. You may be able to get hold of it with FoI request.

[Diello]

Northgate has recently been appointed preffered bidder for the first parts of the Kent BSF contracts and our school will be one of the first to change over. I'm interested to know what system they have put in place in the past in schools with regard to servers, desktops, student and staff laptops etc....

 

It appears from my Googling that in the past they have largely sub-contracted to RM but they were bidding against RM for the Kent contract so there seems to be a conflict there. I'm also obviously interested in what they do about existing staff and what areas of ICT support they leave to the school to sort out themselves.

 

I would be interested in any on or off the record comments and can be emailed directly via [email protected] if you would your comments not to be on a public

 

I'd appreciate if anyone's comments on the above could be copied to me as well via PM please - it'd be most appreciated. Thanks

[Rozzer]

Northgate have the contract in Bristol maybe you might wanna chat with someone at bristol city council to find out some information.

 

Ross

[Guest richard]

I am very interested in how this pans out as I even though I no longer work for Kent I still have contacts there and would like to keep up to date with what's happening. Edited January 21, 2008 by richard

[linuxgirlie]

Interested here also....

[Deaks]

Some stuff I've heard recently, take it all as rumour until you hear it confirmed from someone.

 

Northgate are telling us that it will NOT be an RM system for Kent, they are developing their own system.

 

I am told by technicians working in Broadstairs and Gravesend that they are tuping in June.

[Deaks]

Just had a meeting with our Head. The technical staff in the 11 schools in our phase1 Kent process will all be Tupe'd on June 19th assuming everything gets signed off correctly at KCC.

 

I'm told that over the next few weeks and months Northgate will be holding inductions both individually and with groups of staff from various schools to discuss the process.

 

We will be staying in our respective schools for the forseeable future and there was the usual reasurrances that t&c's would be protected. There were also assurances that training and support would be a big part of what Northgate would be doing.

 

I'm 50/50 on the whole thing myself. At times very cynical while also thinking if done right it could be ok. It's the uncertainty of it all that is the biggest problem. I also appreciate that those of you with good qualifications, lots of experience and in the higher wage bracked will be worrying the most about the whole process.

[Grommit]

It's the uncertainty of it all that is the biggest problem. I also appreciate that those of you with good qualifications, lots of experience and in the higher wage bracked will be worrying the most about the whole process.

 

 

Yep.. what happens to the higher paid Network Managers... could you ask ?

[Diello]

The Dilbert Principle will apply in a form - they won't want to keep the skilled network managers, because we're the ones most likely to pick up all their mistakes!

 

Why do you think NMs etc. aren't included when initial contractors are vetted? They only want people they can pull the wool over.

 

Friday afternoon cynicism!

[Deaks]

Here's the 11 schools affected:

 

[The] Charles Dickens School, Broadstairs

[The] Community College Whitstable, Whitstable

Dane Court Grammar School, Broadstairs

Herne Bay High School, Herne bay

[The] Ifield School, Gravesend

King Ethelbert School, Birchington

Northfleet School for Girls, Gravesend

Northfleet Technology College, Gravesend

Portal House School, Dover

St George's CE Foundation School, Broadstairs

St John's Catholic Comprehensive School, Gravesend

Thamesview School, Gravesend

 

http://www.kent.gov.uk/education-and-learning/schools-and-sixth-form/schools-for-future/waves.htm

[bsf-it-man]

Having been involed in several of the Bristol BSF schools I can tell you a little bit about what to expect. For each school you will reciece new servers and networking (wored and wireless) along with some laptops and a large number of desktops. Northgate run a managed service so that will mean that you no longer have complete control over your IT infrastructure, hardware and software. For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. As much as this is a new setup for Northagte it will be just as new for the teachers and students alike. There have been some teething problems but they have been ironed out for the most part, so by the time deployment happens for you things should be a lot more robust. However, these new tools can only be as good as the person using them so it will take time for the full benefit to be seen. All it all the general feeling I get from the teaching staff is that it has had a positive effect for all.

[Dos_Box]

Having been involed in several of the Bristol BSF schools I can tell you a little bit about what to expect. For each school you will reciece new servers and networking (wored and wireless) along with some laptops and a large number of desktops. Northgate run a managed service so that will mean that you no longer have complete control over your IT infrastructure, hardware and software. For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. As much as this is a new setup for Northagte it will be just as new for the teachers and students alike. There have been some teething problems but they have been ironed out for the most part, so by the time deployment happens for you things should be a lot more robust. However, these new tools can only be as good as the person using them so it will take time for the full benefit to be seen. All it all the general feeling I get from the teaching staff is that it has had a positive effect for all.

 

But most schools already have these facilities. Robust networks, cashless catering, dozens of whiteboards etc. I think you possible may be missing the concerns our members have here.

 

1. That the companies running the BSF contract will not actually provide a better service than the on currently being provided in house.

 

2. The managed service company has its own interests at heart first and foremost, not the schools.

 

3. Highly skilled IT staff will be reduced to nothing more than changing printer toner and other menial tasks until they are forced to resign.

 

4. The contract winners really don't understand the school IT envinroment.

 

I fear what you have posted is nothing more than a press release. School IT environments are possibly the most hostile in the world. It remains to be seen just how much companies can keep up with the pupils!

Edited February 24, 2008 by GrumbleDook

[GrumbleDook]

Having been involed in several of the Bristol BSF schools I can tell you a little bit about what to expect. For each school you will reciece new servers and networking (wored and wireless) along with some laptops and a large number of desktops. Northgate run a managed service so that will mean that you no longer have complete control over your IT infrastructure, hardware and software. For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. As much as this is a new setup for Northagte it will be just as new for the teachers and students alike. There have been some teething problems but they have been ironed out for the most part, so by the time deployment happens for you things should be a lot more robust. However, these new tools can only be as good as the person using them so it will take time for the full benefit to be seen. All it all the general feeling I get from the teaching staff is that it has had a positive effect for all.

 

Further to what DB has said ... you also paint a poor picture for those schools that are not only well established in IT Infrastructure and delivery, but where is the freedom to innovate? The chance for te support team at the school to have a new idea? How can they be expected to work with the teaching staff to come up with new ideas about how ICT can have an impact in the classroom?

 

Going back to the Bristol schools ... here are a few questions that need answers.

 

Have Northgate provided policies and procedures for schools to do with things security, data protection, acceptable use, CCTV, etc? Who wrote these? How are they disseminated to staff and students in schools? Does this mean that Northgate now have direct input into complaints and grievance policies and procedures in schools? Who controls Freedom of Information requests?

 

What is the process for Leadership input into the delivery of ICT in each individual school? Will there be groups looking at cross-curricular ICT? What input do Northgate have into this? Is it a case of "it isn't in our catalogue" or more like "we can do it but it will cost you even more!"?

 

Are the SLAs publically available for examination? Are there example timescales for things like software deployment, users administration, hardware deployment?

 

These are just a few of the questions that not only need answering but will allow those schools in up and coming BSF waves a chance to make sure there is a smaller chance of being screwed over, and those in BSF waves to come ... it gives them a fighting chance to say "bugger off ... don't tell us ... we will tell *you* how it is going to be!"

[binky]

You'll also have to log support calls through their Assyst system, and they might pair up with RM like they did with the C2K Project.

[broc]

Having been involed in several of the Bristol BSF schools I can tell you a little bit about what to expect. For each school you will reciece new servers and networking (wored and wireless) along with some laptops and a large number of desktops. Northgate run a managed service so that will mean that you no longer have complete control over your IT infrastructure, hardware and software. For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. As much as this is a new setup for Northagte it will be just as new for the teachers and students alike. There have been some teething problems but they have been ironed out for the most part, so by the time deployment happens for you things should be a lot more robust. However, these new tools can only be as good as the person using them so it will take time for the full benefit to be seen. All it all the general feeling I get from the teaching staff is that it has had a positive effect for all.

 

This is one of the most patronising comments I have ever come across with regard to BSF. It shows a total disregard for the many highly skilled (and qualified) IT professionals that already support ICT in schools across the whole of the UK and clearly demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of what many schools have already achieved, often with far less resource and funding than is on offer under BSF.

 

At the moment, I work for my school; I am part of the school community, I belong to an integrated team of staff that deliver the environment and resources that help our students learn. In the future, as part of a Managed Service, I will not be part of the school team; I will not be motivated by helping students learn, I will be driven by the need to generate profit for the Managed Service Shareholders. Where is the positive benefit to the school in that?

[Grommit]

Having been involed in several of the Bristol BSF schools I can tell you a little bit about what to expect. For each school you will reciece new servers and networking (wored and wireless) along with some laptops and a large number of desktops. Northgate run a managed service so that will mean that you no longer have complete control over your IT infrastructure, hardware and software. For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. As much as this is a new setup for Northagte it will be just as new for the teachers and students alike. There have been some teething problems but they have been ironed out for the most part, so by the time deployment happens for you things should be a lot more robust. However, these new tools can only be as good as the person using them so it will take time for the full benefit to be seen. All it all the general feeling I get from the teaching staff is that it has had a positive effect for all.

 

For most schools it is a massive change with the focus being educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer. .

 

This already happens... the Teachers Teach, the SLT Leads and the ICT Dpepartment focuses on educational delivery using as much as IT has to offer

 

We have Cashless Catering, Wired and Wireless Network, a Robust Network, A VLE (MLE) is being installed in July, 650 Desktops, 150 Laptops, 85Proemethean Whiteboards, Remote Access for Staff, 9 Servers (some old some new), Every part of the school has IT Infrastructure, CCTV, Access Control, IP Telephony

 

Does this all get handed over or does it get pulled out as most of the Pc's are 2.5 years old.. and some servers are 4 years old..

 

Interactive white boards, projecters, cashless catering, electronic registration along with a managed portal (MLE, Managed Learning Environment) offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content. .

 

We already have all this and much more.. and as for the MLE/VLE

 

("offer many new ways to get educational content to the students and offer teachers better personal control over the content")

 

Well if the Teachers don't load and control the content then who else will ?!? and trust me.. the Teachers are already moaning about the extra IT burden put on them with the MLE/VLE

 

When a teacher buys new software that they think will help the T&L we can have it installed and deployed within a couple of days..free..

 

Does this happen in Bristol?

 

When a Teacher moves offices we move the PC and Printer that day.. FREE

 

Does this happen in Bristol?

 

 

What happend to the Network Managers in the Bristol BSF ?

Edited February 24, 2008 by Grommit

[Ruthierhyme]

From a parental perspective BSF/PfS ultimately means removing the very real life career choices that students may consider because of their contact with, or knowledge of what their in house ICT service means & offers.

 

I can't seriously believe anyone considering remotely outsourcing any 'how tos' or hand's on facilities from the future workforce and current workforce can think it will be a benefit.

 

LEAs and Schools should be recieving the support they need to help them maintain what they have, to build on it and be proud of their provision rather than being asked to look elsewhere for answers they may later have no control over.

Edited February 24, 2008 by Ruthierhyme

[beeswax]

As we seem to be discussing the ethos of working for a particular school and mucking in together, I'd like to mention something which happened a few weeks ago. I was setting up the hall for morning assembly, projector, screen etc, and checking through with the teacher what she wanted from her laptop. It was a powerpoint presentation which contained a link to a website. We ran through it and the site wouldn't load no matter what we tried. The teacher had been up past midnight putting the finishing touches to the presentation, and assured me the link worked. She was getting edgy, and her class, who were doing the assembly were getting restless. I Googled the content, but all the links were dead. Then I had the idea of going to Google's cached pages, and I found it. Assembly went without a hitch, the teacher and her class were praised for the presentation and I got to metaphorically sweep up after the parade.

At the speed I type, it's probably taken me longer to get this down that it did to sort out the presentation. There are dozens, if not hundreds of incidents like this taking place in schools up and down the country every day. How will a help desk manage that? How will it ensure that not just what happens in classrooms is seen to? How will it cope with the small incidents like the one outlined above which help to build a stronger team spirit and make sure that pupils aren't let down? All the extra work a teacher puts in to ensure that her class show themselves off in the best light would go down the pan. School isn't just about what goes on in the classroom. We all help each other in different ways, such as looking over a CV for a Year 11 pupil applying for his first job in IT as I've done.

Losing something like this, the ethos which comes from wanting the best for your school, no matter what we may post on here to let off steam, this takes a long time to build up, it doesn't happen overnight. It comes from knowing the people you're serving, who you can have a joke with, and which teachers will not be able to remember their password after a 6 week break.

Schools are organic beings. However confused and noisy they may seem to the outsider, there is an underlying order to it all. And it's in knowing your way in and around this system that we provide much more than IT support.

[Deaks]

The technical staff at the 11 schools in this wave of Kent BSF will finally be having some direct meetings with Northgate in the next couple of weeks.

 

There will be two things happening. In the weeks of March 10th to 14th, and March 24th to 28th, there will be a technical visit to the school to "test the interim service audit process" whatever that means. This will involve your senior techie or network manager.

 

There will also be a two-hour structured TUPE meeting at each school between the dates of March 3rd and 19th for all staff going to be transferred.

 

Part 1 ( 1/2 Hr) - General Introduction and General Information Sharing

Part 2 ( 1/2 hr) - More info specific to ICT Technicians and Network Managers

Part 3 ( 1 hr) - 1:1 sessions for all ICT Staff

 

Also, a new name that might be useful is Deborah Robson who's title is "BSF Project Officer" for KCC Children, Families and Education at Brenchly House, Maidstone. (01622 221265) [email protected]

[Grommit]

Looks like they have been bought out..

 

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Recommended acquisition of Northgate Information Solutions plc By NIS Acquisitions Limited a company controlled by certain funds advised by Kohlberg Kravis Roberts

21 December 2007

 

Summary

 

• The Boards of NIS Acquisitions and Northgate Information Solutions plc are pleased to announce that they have reached agreement on the terms of a recommended acquisition of Northgate at a price of 95 pence in cash for each Northgate Share, valuing the entire issued and to be issued share capital of Northgate at approximately £593 million.

 

• NIS Acquisitions is a newly incorporated company formed at the direction of funds advised by Kohlberg Kravis Roberts for the purpose of implementing the Transaction.

 

• Northgate is a market leader in providing specialist software, outsourcing and information technology services to the human resources, local government, education and public safety markets. Northgate employs 6,490 staff and operates in 46 countries across five continents. Northgate has approximately 4,500 large/medium customers and approximately 10,500 small to medium enterprise (SME) customers worldwide.

 

• The price of 95 pence for each Northgate Share represents:

 

- a premium of 40.5 per cent. to the average Closing Price of 67.6 pence per Northgate Share for the month ended 11 December 2007, the Business Day prior to Northgate's announcement that it had received an approach which may or may not lead to an offer for Northgate; and

 

- a premium of 60.3 per cent. to the Closing Price of 59.25 pence per Northgate Share on 11 December 2007, the Business Day prior to Northgate's announcement that it had received an approach which may or may not lead to an offer for Northgate.

 

• The Directors of Northgate, who have been so advised by Rothschild, consider the terms of the Transaction to be fair and reasonable. In providing its advice, Rothschild has taken into account the commercial assessments of the Directors of Northgate. Accordingly, the Directors of Northgate intend unanimously to recommend that Northgate Shareholders vote in favour of the Transaction at the Meetings (or, in the event that the Transaction is implemented by way of a takeover offer, to accept or procure acceptance of such offer) as

[Deaks]

Yeah found that in my investigations a few weeks back. That sort of thing happens all the time in business and doesn't automatically mean anything changes.

[Squelch]

As I'm in the next phase in Kent I'll be very interested to hear what happens in these meetings..

[Deaks]

Keep an eye on this thread as I'll post as I know more.