Trapper Posted February 20, 2014 Posted February 20, 2014 Sadly Roberto there would be an attempt by the SNP to turn pro-Union into anti-Scottish as referenced above. My main beef with all of this is if Scotland leaves then there is no Great Britain as a political entity (yes we keep Union of the Crowns - until Queenie dies anyway) and henceforth no United Kingdom. This would in principle be a massive change for every British citizen. For a start would we still be "British" without Great Britain? It would have massive unforeseen impacts on our international relations - would we keep our seat at the UN Security council for example? A referendum of such scope to the entire political makeup of the country for the past 300 years should be open to all citizens. 1
Guest Guest Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) I think you are reading my statement too literally, the point is scottish people had helped pay for x assets along with everyone else, we should be likewise entitled to a fair % of the asset too, I didnt specify how that would be worked out which yes could be based on GDP etc. Sorry was burning dinner so had to press enter and run! I'm not really sure how to take your post then as all of your previous posts had said the same thing; ...We paid for part of everything that makes up the uk and we are entitled to it, this is not a case of we have to buy our own everything because we are handing back all we have paid for before. Not sure how it can't work this way... As far as I can gather (someone correct me if I'm wrong): Immovable things which fall within Scotland's borders such as property and recourses become Scotland's Movable assets get shared by population/GDP Things like the Pound and EU membership remain the rUK's Therefore just because you have paid for something doesn't mean it's yours. The UK as a whole could argue it's "paid" for the oil fields... And to answer one of your previous questions, the reason why you can't find Salmond saying you won't take the debt is because it was Sturgeon who said it. UK parties 'ganging up' to bully Scots into rejecting independence, says SNP | Politics | theguardian.com [if Scotland doesn't get the pound...] This would be an absurd position for any Westminster government to be in. It would cost their own businesses hundreds of millions of pounds in transaction costs, it would blow a massive hole in their balance of payments, it would leave them having to pick up the entirety of UK debt. Edited February 21, 2014 by Guest
RabbieBurns Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 How does this work - I would be interested to know, since at the moment I cannot vote I could easily get to Scotland to cast a vote - just don't see how when I am not on the Electoral Role in Scotland I'm still on the Electoral Roll, I haven't emigrated, I'm just on a jaunt overseas @SYNACK I could possibly get a postal vote - ill need to look into it.
TechMonkey Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 Salmond not wanting to take any debt? from May last year. This why the Bank of England had to step in and take on responsibility for all debt as the markets were starting to go a bit mental over it and would have caused the UK problems and a new independent Scotland even more. The problem is you can't easily separate Salmond from an independent Scotland as he has been the leading figure and is the head of the campaign. He is the one making claims and trying to lay down the law about how things are going to be. 1
localzuk Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 Just noticed something... Are all SNP people named after fish? :-D Its actually quite awesome. I apologise for my childishness. 2
happymeal Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 He's put THAT much into the campaign that he can't afford to admit any problems, or admit that his campaign hasn't thought through everything. He's put that much effort in that he expects to be hoisted onto shoulders of the people, to raptuous applause, while flipping off the Westminter Toffs, that he can't accept that he hasn't got all the answers or a plan and is leading people to a Yes through poor planning and lack of clear and concise information. Take the response to George Osbourne for example - THAT would have been an excellent "braveheart" moment to breakdown the reasons WHY Scotland can't keep the Pound, the problems with each point, and how they plan to counter each point to show WHY they CAN keep the pound. Flips off Wesminster, provides an educated rebuttle to inform the masses, and shows leadership heading into what will be a turblant time. Instead, on national TV and in front of the Business Conference he was at, he adopted the "you're wrong, stop bullying me" approach. This is the leading figure of the Yes Campaign!!!! Even if he just admitted "Ok, he might have us on point xyz, but we plan on doing abc or countering it with 123, which will see growth on our/both sides and a reduced risk", or "I don't have an answer for that just yet, but my experts will have an answer for me to present why we should keep the pound" - both of those would have been a lot better and show a bit more calm and leadership that "you're a bad bad man, stop bullying me". *grabs popcorn*
Gatt Posted February 21, 2014 Author Posted February 21, 2014 Just noticed something... Are all SNP people named after fish? :-D Its actually quite awesome. I apologise for my childishness. Been laughing about this for a while!
6Foot2 Posted February 21, 2014 Posted February 21, 2014 Been laughing about this for a while! Link: Aptronym - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia An aptronym (also: aptonym) or charactonym is a name aptly suited to its owner. There is a long list of notable examples and a shorter list of Inaptronyms. 1
Gatt Posted February 21, 2014 Author Posted February 21, 2014 Brown versus Salmond , I know what they would be suping anyway instead of water By the end of it only drunk Scottish people can understand the dribles. I think even drunk Scottish people will still struggle to understand the pair of them! Lol
sparkeh Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 51/49 We're getting there... Not according to other polls: http://www.panelbase.com/media/polls/F6134tables08091010.pdf Interesting read: BBC News - Scottish independence: The perils of unprecedented polls
localzuk Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 And that poll has had its effect, wiping serious value from companies with a foot in Scotland...
Hefferzzzz Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 I was firmly no from the start. However, with all the tripe that Salmond has been spouting and many of my friends and family regurgitating it without any regard for an alternative viewpoint. I want the vote to be yes and then all of his lies will be found out, Scotland will be in the same hole as Greece and Spain and I will take great delight in saying 'told you so'. It has become extremely vitriolic and the yes campaign seem to have lost all sense of reason.
featured_spectre Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 (edited) The yes campaign are banking on retaining membership to the EU, despite the fact that the EU council have said Scotland would have to re-apply, and Spain have said they'd veto entry as they do not like breakaway states (exceptions being where countries were released from Russia because of the soviet breakdown). Spain couldn't allow Scotland entry, for the simple fact it would mean they have to have their own referendum on the Aragonese, Basque, Galicia and Catalunya being released (all sets of people have called for separation from Spain). If Scotland were allowed in, it adds legitimacy to their cause and weakens Spain. Edited September 8, 2014 by featured_spectre
Hefferzzzz Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 The yes campaign are banking on retaining membership to the EU, despite the fact that the EU council have said Scotland would have to re-apply, and Spain have said they'd veto entry as they do not like breakaway states (exceptions being where countries were released from Russia because of the soviet breakdown). Spain couldn't allow Scotland entry, for the simple fact it would mean they have to have their own referendum on the Aragonese, Basque, Galicia and Catalunya being released (all sets of people have called for separation from Spain). If Scotland were allowed in, it adds legitimacy to their cause and weakens Spain. That is just one of the many items that the Yes campaign, Salmond in particular, have paid no heed to at all. Their stock answer is, 'yes we can it will be fine'. Whenever questions as to how or told no thats not correct their only reply is to shout 'liar'. Paternally my family are Scottish and its scary the number of Scots that are saying they will vote yes without any idea about what the hell is going on or what will happen after they do gain independance.
penfold_99 Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 It is worrying how the media has gone into complete meltdown about the latest poll. It only covered 1049 people, which is very unlikely/impossible to call the election from. What's the betting that this was a loaded sample to help the yes campaign? The No campaign will probably do the same in a few days. Its all about the optics.
penfold_99 Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 Have the yes campaign answered the question about the monarchy? If they are keeping the queen (bet salmond would love to be president of a republic if they didn't ) are they just dissolving the union of parliaments or the crown aswell? If they just dissolved the union of parliaments it would give them what they want without the need to rip apart the UK.
pcstru Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 (edited) The yes campaign are banking on retaining membership to the EU, despite the fact that the EU council have said Scotland would have to re-apply, and Spain have said they'd veto entry as they do not like breakaway states (exceptions being where countries were released from Russia because of the soviet breakdown). If Scotland have to reapply, why not the other remaining bit of the UK? After all it's not just one half that changes. Spain couldn't allow Scotland entry, for the simple fact it would mean they have to have their own referendum on the Aragonese, Basque, Galicia and Catalunya being released (all sets of people have called for separation from Spain). If Scotland were allowed in, it adds legitimacy to their cause and weakens Spain. The vote on Scottish independence is taking place at the behest of a Democratically elected parliament of the United Kingdom. Whatever the outcome, Spain can go Bile 's heid. [ETA At the start of the campaign I was very much a "No". Now, I'm more inclined to "Yes" but it's not anything said by the "Yes" campaign that has caused that change.] Edited September 8, 2014 by pcstru
Alkaline Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 I would say yes if i was Scottish. Imagine being governed by Glasgow.
Guest Guest Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 (edited) If Scotland have to reapply, why not the other remaining bit of the UK? After all it's not just one half that changes. Because the rUK is still the UK, the continuer state. It retains all current memberships etc. Scotland is a new state and therefore has to apply (not re-apply as they were never part of the EU, the UK were/are). The vote on Scottish independence is taking place at the behest of a Democratically elected parliament of the United Kingdom. Whatever the outcome, Spain can go Bile 's heid. As a member of the EU they have a voice on who gets to join, and it's in their interest to make it as hard as possible for Scotland. Edited September 8, 2014 by Guest
pcstru Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 The UK will hardly be "United" any more. Maybe we need to look at lineages and see who the King/Queen of Scotland should be? Perhaps the Scots get the Queen? But hey, if Scotland can't be part of the EU, they will probably just be taking a lead on where the rest of the population seems to want to go.
localzuk Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 The UK will hardly be "United" any more. Maybe we need to look at lineages and see who the King/Queen of Scotland should be? Perhaps the Scots get the Queen? It'd still be united, with Wales, England and NI. The Queen is of the UK, and Salmond has indicated they'd keep the monarch as it is.
pcstru Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 The Acts of Union are clearly union between Scotland and England and her provinces. I'm sure Salmond means to keep the monarchy as is, i.e. the Queen belongs to Scotland. I think the Scots supplied the King to Unite the Kingdoms, so it's only fair the Scots get to keep the current one. That leaves England no worse off after the divorce, looking for a new royal family. Just Sayin'.
Dos_Box Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 I would say yes if i was Scottish. Imagine being governed by Glasgow. I'm guessing geography and politics arn't your strong points? And the Scots wonder why Westminster gets it so wrong
localzuk Posted September 8, 2014 Posted September 8, 2014 The Acts of Union are clearly union between Scotland and England and her provinces. I'm sure Salmond means to keep the monarchy as is, i.e. the Queen belongs to Scotland. I think the Scots supplied the King to Unite the Kingdoms, so it's only fair the Scots get to keep the current one. That leaves England no worse off after the divorce, looking for a new royal family. Just Sayin'. The UK was joined in 2 different ways. First with the unification of the monarchy, where the King of England was a Scot due to lineage (so, not through "supplying a king" but through inheritance), then later with unification of parliaments (the Acts of Union). So, from what I can tell, Salmond simply wants rid of the Acts of Union, which would still mean we have a single monarchy covering both countries - just like we have a single monarchy covering the commonwealth (which I assume Scotland would also remain a member of).
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now