[sims] Query, SIMS and access to DB

[dwhyte85]

Hello,

 

I recently bumped into salesman, trying to sell me some software that basically takes a copy of the SIMS DB, uses it to map caller ID based on the pupils data, eg, Mr Pibb calls, it recognises the number and brings up little Pibbs details.

 

I asked the legality and he said it's not directly manipulating or querying SIMS data, it's using a backup of the data from the night before. Is this allowed?

[PhilNeal]

Working on a copy of the DB would not invalidate our warranty. You would need to satisfy yourself that access to the data was secure as I think you will need to use a master password that could be used to view any data in SIMS.

[dwhyte85]

Effectively they could query nearly up to date data :-/

 

 

Not sure I like it.

[kevin_lane]

i know that sims wont support you if any 3rd party software that has not been tested with it. i would be very careful

[matt40k]

Sounds like a interesting idea, not sure they went out it correctly, linky to there website?

[AyatollahPies]

I wasn't aware that it was such a long and arduous task to retrieve pupil details from SIMS.

 

[matt40k]

Well you'll have to ask for the pupils name, then enter into SIMS, click the search button, if you're not in SIMS you would have open it, enter your password (unless you've got SSO)... I mean this could take a whole 30 seconds!!

 

Still be nice to have a tel search option, still so would a number of other search options.

[dwhyte85]

I'm not developing it, it's already developed. I want to show it to our SLT but I wanted to make sure it's legal first

[creese]

Well you'll have to ask for the pupils name, then enter into SIMS, click the search button, if you're not in SIMS you would have open it, enter your password (unless you've got SSO)... I mean this could take a whole 30 seconds!!

 

Still be nice to have a tel search option, still so would a number of other search options.

 

Only one problem with that and that is what other useless software would the school spend their money on?

 

Another solution to a non-problem.

[matt40k]

Only one problem with that and that is what other useless software would the school spend their money on?

 

Matt40k's Super duper hydrodynamic hyper drive ultra speedy mega MIS addon, 2010 edition. No what it does yet, it it's a must for all MIS users.

[creese]

Matt40k's Super duper hydrodynamic hyper drive ultra speedy mega MIS addon, 2010 edition. No what it does yet, it it's a must for all MIS users.

 

£25,000 and I'll show you a quick way of logging into SIMS. Development code name is Bra1/n&F1nger. Still working on the 1st bit, it doesn't always function with all users.

[dwhyte85]

Only one problem with that and that is what other useless software would the school spend their money on?

 

Another solution to a non-problem.

 

If it makes receptions life easier and they can do the job more efficiently... receive a call and the pupil data is in front of them... it's a nice idea :-)

 

Apparently with language differences/accents it can be hard for reception to know who is calling and a bit of a battle finding out names of pupils, not all parents are fluent with English - infact an awful lot have English as a second language.

 

But, you are entitled your own opinion creese

[creese]

If it makes receptions life easier and they can do the job more efficiently... receive a call and the pupil data is in front of them... it's a nice idea :-)

 

Apparently with language differences/accents it can be hard for reception to know who is calling and a bit of a battle finding out names of pupils, not all parents are fluent with English - infact an awful lot have English as a second language.

 

But, you are entitled your own opinion creese

 

True but how will yuou get the information right in the first place, including change of mobile numbers. The software would have to pay for itself, I doubt very much that it will. If the language barrier is that difficult one can only imagine what the phone call would achieve.

[dwhyte85]

Well, from experience of the snow... 'my daughter wont be coming in today' in basic English, then trying to find out a pupils name and getting the spelling correct is a task in itself... we have several kids with the same name too, which adds to the fun.

 

Information being in place is down to the admin manager and she does a good job of that, same principal as the SMS systems to say school is off like on snow days.. relies on the data being correct in the first place... like I said it's a nice idea, I can see several issues with it but I know it's a problem they have. It's not a non-problem, but it isn't necessarily a must have feature either... it'd be nice to have if the price is right (or better if it was free)

Edited August 27, 2010 by dwhyte85

[creese]

Caller ID and a simple report would be just as effective.

 

You are probably the most optimistic person I have come across for a long time is you think it may be free. My experience, which is quite extensive, is that these things come at a premium price.

[localzuk]

Creese, why are you being so negative? Stop making out that this concept is pointless - it isn't.

 

Not to mention, this sort of technology need not be expensive at all. If you can get the caller ID from your PBX (if you use asterisk, super simple), pulling up a record of data is also very simple.

 

There's also no need for this company to be doing it via the 'backdoor' method of copying your database! Why are they not talking with Capita directly to develop this?

 

Personally, I've already built a system that works in the opposite way (ie. a simple website which allows a receptionist etc... to search for a name, and click on 'call' next to the parent's number), and I did it via nightly reports out of commandreporter. Doing this took a few hours of work.

[dwhyte85]

If you knew me you'd say I was quite the opposite! What I meant was it'd be good if it was something Capita put in. I am well aware it will cost from a 3rd party

 

I'd be shocked if our reception could manage to run a report, and i know our SIMS manager does not give them an awful lot of access.

[creese]

Creese, why are you being so negative? Stop making out that this concept is pointless - it isn't.

 

Not to mention, this sort of technology need not be expensive at all. If you can get the caller ID from your PBX (if you use asterisk, super simple), pulling up a record of data is also very simple.

 

There's also no need for this company to be doing it via the 'backdoor' method of copying your database! Why are they not talking with Capita directly to develop this?

 

Personally, I've already built a system that works in the opposite way (ie. a simple website which allows a receptionist etc... to search for a name, and click on 'call' next to the parent's number), and I did it via nightly reports out of commandreporter. Doing this took a few hours of work.

 

I would stop being negative if I was. As I clearly said why waste money, because it will cost, when the solution already exists. Run a report enter phone number details found.

[localzuk]

If you knew me you'd say I was quite the opposite! What I meant was it'd be good if it was something Capita put in. I am well aware it will cost from a 3rd party

 

I'd be shocked if our reception could manage to run a report, and i know our SIMS manager does not give them an awful lot of access.

 

I doubt Capita will add this feature, in the short (meaning next 5 years) term. However, the infrastructure already exists within windows to do this via TAPI and various other tools. What'd be great would be if Capita created a module framework for SIMS.net to allow authorised partners to create modules that open *within* SIMS.net, rather than externally to the program.

[creese]

I'd be shocked if our reception could manage to run a report, and i know our SIMS manager does not give them an awful lot of access.

 

Training, or simpler the report is accessed from the home screen, one click. If they have access to pupil data they can report on it.

[dwhyte85]

No idea why they haven't spoke to Capita, I'm guessing they're avoiding any fees to directly touch the DB?

 

Creese, why are you being so negative? Stop making out that this concept is pointless - it isn't.

 

Not to mention, this sort of technology need not be expensive at all. If you can get the caller ID from your PBX (if you use asterisk, super simple), pulling up a record of data is also very simple.

 

There's also no need for this company to be doing it via the 'backdoor' method of copying your database! Why are they not talking with Capita directly to develop this?

 

Personally, I've already built a system that works in the opposite way (ie. a simple website which allows a receptionist etc... to search for a name, and click on 'call' next to the parent's number), and I did it via nightly reports out of commandreporter. Doing this took a few hours of work.

[localzuk]

No idea why they haven't spoke to Capita, I'm guessing they're avoiding any fees to directly touch the DB?

 

Yeah, I believe they'd need some form of license to develop and IIRC its something like £5k. But if you're a business, serious about making money and selling products, you do things properly. So, my impression of this company would be 'steer clear'.

[dwhyte85]

Yeah, I believe they'd need some form of license to develop and IIRC its something like £5k. But if you're a business, serious about making money and selling products, you do things properly. So, my impression of this company would be 'steer clear'.

 

Yea, I don't like the whole copy the database thing. I like the concept though...

[creese]

So, my impression of this company would be 'steer clear'.

 

Pots and kettles

[localzuk]

Pots and kettles

 

You have made out that the concept being discussed is (quote) "Only one problem with that and that is what other useless software would the school spend their money on? Another solution to a non-problem."

 

I think the concept is a good one, but the method of implementation is potentially risky.