Islam and depictions of Muhammad

[X-13]

@jinnantonnixx that picture made mobile shrink down to nothing...

 

Also, I can't believe this thread is still going...

[jinnantonnixx]

@jinnantonnixx that picture made mobile shrink down to nothing...

That's the Epicurus effect. It's a well known problem on mobile sites.

 

Also, I can't believe this thread is still going...

I shall now wrap it up.

 

The end.

Edited September 23, 2012 by jinnantonnixx

[teejay]

What, a religious thread finishing after 7 pages, thought there would be another 20 or so to go

[Arthur]

http://i.imgur.com/HRDgy.png

 

Source: Skeptic Blog

[Arthur]

Also from the link above...

 

The good thing about science is that it’s true whether or not you believe in it — Neil DeGrasse Tyson

 

It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring — Carl Sagan

[BassTech]

Went shopping in Birmingham city centre on Saturday, there was a "religious" group protesting against this video outside the bullring....

I can tell you 90% of people just laughed at how pathetic it was and walked passed... The video was made in the USA - not in England/Birmingham! so why protest there? No other reason than an excuse to start trouble IMO.

[pcstru]

What, a religious thread finishing after 7 pages, thought there would be another 20 or so to go

 

The further in we get the more posts will be commenting on the length of the thread "Is this still going on". In some threads of several thousand posts it must get to the point where that's all there is...

[X-13]

In some threads of several thousand posts it must get to the point where that's all there is...

 

And "Godwin's law".

[localzuk]

Went shopping in Birmingham city centre on Saturday, there was a "religious" group protesting against this video outside the bullring....

I can tell you 90% of people just laughed at how pathetic it was and walked passed... The video was made in the USA - not in England/Birmingham! so why protest there? No other reason than an excuse to start trouble IMO.

 

Some people have to be angry at something...

[jinnantonnixx]

And "Godwin's law".

 

... which was funny up until the first few million times it was posted on forums. I hereby invoke Jinnantonnixx's law which proclaims that “As a group/forum discussion grows longer, the probability of the invocation of Godwin's law approaches one.”

[pcstru]

No other reason than an excuse to start trouble IMO.

 

No other reason? Surely, people have a right to avail themselves of their freedoms. Exercising their right to free speech and protest is a good enough reason.

[localzuk]

No other reason? Surely, people have a right to avail themselves of their freedoms. Exercising their right to free speech and protest is a good enough reason.

 

Usually, protest has a reason. You protest outside a business because they're doing something you think is wrong. You protest outside an embassy because you think that country is doing something wrong.

 

What does protesting in the middle of Birmingham, about a film made by an idiot in the USA have to do with anything of any relevance?

 

Rights come with responsibilities, and so far, those are being ignored by many...

Edited September 24, 2012 by localzuk

[pcstru]

Also from the link above...

 

Nice quotes but I think the are value judgements on a world view and they miss an important aspect of life : it's possible to like (or dislike) cheese. Not everything is reducible to some universal truth. I like cheese. My brother does not like cheese. There is no right or wrong about this, no need for me to prove anything or provide any evidence other than my statement. The cheese world-view of me and my brother might seem diametrically opposed, but they are both equally valid.

 

To some extent faith should be like this. It's faith because there is no objective evidence, so someone believes essentially because they like to. They like that world view and no one can really argue with 'like'. If there is conflict and lack of respect with atheist/rational viewpoints it's actually coming from religious believers for whom 'like' is not enough. They want to pretend there is evidence or rationale, they want to argue that the existence of say, god, is a universal truth rather than a personal one. That is a certain route to 'conflict'.

[pcstru]

Usually, protest has a reason.

 

Usually? I'd say that protest always has a reason. The question is do I know the reason, do I understand the reason and maybe finally, do I agree with the reasons? However, interesting as those questions are, they are beside the point that people do have a right to protest regardless of what I might think of that. Characterising the protesters as troublemakers tells us everything about the writers opinions but little about the opinions of the protesters. I don't particularly think the film about Mohamed is very good (or a good idea) but I don't question the right of someone to make that. Are these western freedoms only for non Muslims?

[X-13]

Are these western freedoms only for non Muslims?

 

Yes. Yes they are. [Not serious!]

[localzuk]

Usually? I'd say that protest always has a reason. The question is do I know the reason, do I understand the reason and maybe finally, do I agree with the reasons? However, interesting as those questions are, they are beside the point that people do have a right to protest regardless of what I might think of that. Characterising the protesters as troublemakers tells us everything about the writers opinions but little about the opinions of the protesters. I don't particularly think the film about Mohamed is very good (or a good idea) but I don't question the right of someone to make that. Are these western freedoms only for non Muslims?

 

When the entire wave of 'protests' has lead to deaths and violence, then the right to protest is diminished. Much like with animal rights protest, a bunch of illegal stuff happened, and therefore the entire movement came under scrutiny.

 

Also, your comments are kinda odd, as none of us have said they shouldn't have the right to protest, just that their protests are, well, dumb.

[witch]

Went shopping in Birmingham city centre on Saturday, there was a "religious" group protesting against this video outside the bullring....

I can tell you 90% of people just laughed at how pathetic it was

 

And I bet quite a few of those were Muslims. Don't forget that the press tend only to show the bad stuff. Many Muslims, both private citizens and those in various governments, have condemned the protests. Only we never see that stuff, do we?

[X-13]

Only we never see that stuff, do we?

 

And in news today, a bunch of people said "we don't really care about the offensive anti-muslim video circulating on the internet".

[sted]

And I bet quite a few of those were Muslims. Don't forget that the press tend only to show the bad stuff. Many Muslims, both private citizens and those in various governments, have condemned the protests. Only we never see that stuff, do we?

 

thats not just a relegious thing the "news" is almost all bad stuff happening 3 teenagers shot in pub brawl is much much more likely to make page 1 than 3 teenagers help rebuild old peoples houses after flooding

[LosOjos]

@pcstru - I'm done, I cannot make sense of you any more. On the one hand you criticize me for stating my opinions then not backing them up with evidence (they are my opinions, I have provided examples and reasons, apparently not enough for you), then you go ahead and have a go because I disagree with your opinions ("I make points as strongly as I feel is warranted. I don't precede every sentence with "In my opinion", "I think" etc, because apart from anything I write quite obviously being my opinion, it; a) quickly gets dull as a writing style and b) I prefer to treat readers as intelligent enough to already have figured that out." - exactly my point!). I suspect from your responses to me and others, you just want an argument and I can't be bothered with that.

 

[pcstru]

When the entire wave of 'protests' has lead to deaths and violence, then the right to protest is diminished. Much like with animal rights protest, a bunch of illegal stuff happened, and therefore the entire movement came under scrutiny.

Guilt by association? Isn't that another accusation being levelled at protesters who are attacking symbols of western power because they are guilty by association? Surely, we can stick to judging people by their own actions and refrain from tarring them with acts committed by others.

Also, your comments are kinda odd, as none of us have said they shouldn't have the right to protest, just that their protests are, well, dumb.

 

"so why protest there? No other reason than an excuse to start trouble IMO." - my post was aimed at the "no other reason".

[januttall]

What I don't get is the assumption that an American film maker or Danish comic book writer is = to the whole American country or entire Danish State. Its stupidity in the extreme to assume one voice speaks for us all.

 

Surely this apples to all things religions included. i know hundred's of people and every ones views are different, people understand or miss interpret things differently to each other. but shurley spreading understanding about something should always be taken over violence. violence is never the correct option what ever the circumstance. well unless your being beaten up. unfortunately people seem to fast to jump into a killing spree because some one has upset them, is it me or is this ludicrous i wouldn't declare war on a continent because some one in it scratched my car or stuck a finger up at me.

 

thats not just a relegious thing the "news" is almost all bad stuff happening 3 teenagers shot in pub brawl is much much more likely to make page 1 than 3 teenagers help rebuild old peoples houses after flooding

I Agree, we need far more positive stories in the news. its currently the place to go to get down and distressed. maybe we should campaign for more positive stories on the news.

Edited September 24, 2012 by januttall

[LiamH]

The thing i don't get is, yes the film was bad, it was made by an amateur with the view of causing offence and stirring up trouble, and yes the comic book drawings of Mohammed were distasteful, although they do the same thing with Jesus and there is never an uproar, but the story a few years back when if i remember rightly a British teacher in Oman let the pupils choose a name for a stuffed bear and because the name was Mohammed she got arrested and deported. That's a massive over reaction to something not meant to cause offence just because its against their religious beliefs.

 

By that reasoning just because the catholic church is against contraception should they be up in arms against everyone who uses it? because its against their faith but other people do it? Should catholic politicians put prices on peoples heads for using a contraceptive? I know the Pakistani minister was condemned by his own government for that, but why should somthing thats against your faith be punishable by death for someone who doesn't share the faith. It's not a international law.

 

Although saying all that i think the guy the made the film needs a good old slap.

[Gatt]

Its stupidity in the extreme to assume one voice speaks for us all.

Unless you are The Borg...

[januttall]

I agree with you. in many country's around the world the Christians are put to death just for being Christians still in this day and age without antagonizing anyone no court no jury just executed.

Mercy killing's ? where's the mercy in killing some one for not believing what you do or changing what they believe.

 

What a sorry twisted world we live in.