[BBC News] U-turn signalled over no-notice inspections for schools

[X-13]

[Devil's Advocate]So teachers can only be assessed for weakness by no notice inspection?[/Devil's Advocate]

 

[troll]yes[/troll]

 

 

But in all seriousness, it's an objective outsider looking at things. SMT can [and here they do] go into classes to observe, but because they KNOW the person, sometimes things that are a problem get written off as "that's just Mr/Mrs %Le_Teacher".

 

 

OFSTED see things without knowing anyone, so problems are flagged.

[sparkeh]

Personally I have a problem with the whole attitude of OFSTED. School improvement should be a collaborative process, currently it is adversarial. Recently a teacher was graded as 'good' so at his feedback sessions he asked the inspector what he needed to do to become 'outstanding', the inspector told him that it is not OFSTED's to give advice about how to improve but simply to make judgements. This is a disgrace and goes against what the inspectors are looking for when teachers are helping their pupils; imagine an inspector seeing a teacher telling a pupil that his work is incorrect but won't tell him how to get it right.

 

A much better system would be to assign every school a school improvement partner who visits regularly and gets to know the school, the staff and pupils. This way the monitoring authority would really get to know the effectiveness of a school and give meaningful guidance on how to improve.

 

Another issue is how OFSTED is increasingly being used to drive though the academy agenda. The latest framework has raised the requirements for each grade once again so schools that only last year would have been rated satisfactory and above are being placed into categories and forced into academy status. Any co-incidence that the new head of OFSTED is a fervent academy supporter?

 

That doesn't give them excuse to work to a level below what OFSTED and the government expects. If they can do it for the days that Ofsted are in then they can do it all year round.

The problem here is that I don't believe that it is possible to work 100% of the time at the expected level.

Actually let me qualify that. Yes it is possible to work at the expected level if you take 'satisfactory' as the expected level. Satisfactory means that the school is doing everything that it needs to do to give a pupil the level of education that the Government expects. But of course 'satisfactory' is not longer good enough, and if you achieve a 'good' grade then you are expected to keep improving, and improving and improving etc etc. The natural conclusion of this is that the Government expects everyone to achieve 'satisfactory' and whilst I believe that every school should be striving to achieve the best they can for their pupils, the work load needed and the requirements needed to achieve outstanding are unreasonable. It is striking that every outstanding school I know does not maintain these levels whilst OFSTED are out of the building

 

Nothing better than seeing a school on a surprise visit.

Really? If you harbour such feelings to toward your school that you enjoy watching it being put through, and its reaction to, an OFSTED inspection then I suggest you aren't the best person to be working there.

[mthomas08]

That doesn't give them excuse to work to a level below what OFSTED and the government expects. If they can do it for the days that Ofsted are in then they can do it all year round.

 

If some things checked are not relevant - like documented lesson plans - why don't the unions take issue with this with Ofsted rather than threats of strikes?

 

And I'd love to see Ofsted see how they talk to support staff during inspection times - a member of staff had a go at one of my team for a non functioning projector that had allegedly been broken for a week - but not reported (it was turned off at the wall). When I asked the staff member if they had any back-up lesson plan for eventualities like this, they looked blankly at me.

 

There is no excuse for shouting or unprofessionalism. Are they same with the students when under pressure?

 

Personally I'd welcome an OFSTED for ICT Support. We work to the same level day in, day out. We don't rush round doing stuff that should already be in place for when an inspection is due.

 

Every day's notice gives an extra day to tart or cover something up. I've seen many examples of this over the years, from rapid redecoration to six months worth of unmarked work rapidly group marked.

 

Totally Agree, I like it when some one posts exactly what I would post - saves me typing an essay.

 

IT Inspection for us - we had some years ago (from our service provider just a friendly one) regarding all sorts and they gave some pointers. Since then we have changed A LOT. Would I want one right now? Sure why not. It is pretty much my job to make sure we do things properly we even got a piece of paper for staff to sign when they are issued laptops.

 

I am also currently documenting everything I can regarding system setup/procedures.

 

As for OFSTED inspection, 1 day although short does still give this school time to remove all the students that cause problems and use the Student Support Centre and our two slammer/exclusion rooms (instead of sending them home). As for staff/projectors - they are TOLD "Do not make an easy/safe lesson just with a projector and plan a backup lesson" that came from the HT. SLT here also done a lot of lesson observations to find the staff who could be doing better, also to pick up the depts that could do better - changes have already been set in motion. As a result staff have been a bit more in the "Panic" mode.

 

Again - If an IT inspection would occur I am happy for it - maybe they can offer more pointers on how we can improve anything. Our last few system down times have been as a result of outside problems. E.g Loop backs, Failures (which have been sorted out within 24 hours).

 

Then on the other hand you can not compare a teacher not correctly doing her lesson to the entire network going down. You would have to compare it to an individual IT Suite or laptop - in which case things do actually work very well. Only had a single suite go down (students had smashed in to the cabinet and removed cables - dont ask me why the teacher HAD NOT noticed) - we are going to be moving this cabinet in the summer. Most of the laptop problems that occur are usually "User Error" but with netsupport we can resolve them within minutes. And then Projector issues which lets face it are a global issue like printers used to be back when schools purchased deskjets and little printers compared to laserjets.

[znova]

Ofsted in my opinion are just a bunch of people who couldn't make it in teaching. With my governors hat on, we had an inspection, the sole inspector wasn't interested in teaching, just how to make the results fit his preconceived grade. The teachers had independent inspections from LA, our head etc, teaching was deemed all good some with outstanding features but the inspector just looked at the data and said teaching was satisfactory. What a way to demoralise your workforce.

 

I do tend to think inspections should be no notice though. My husband has just had the Ofsted notice, but working in adult edu they get 3 weeks. So I'll have 3 weeks of hell at home as he is panicking, thanks Ofsted! No matter how many people tell him his teaching is good, he will still worry, and I don't think that's fair.

 

In my opinion, when Ofsted come they should inspect the quality of teaching not the paper trail.

[GrumbleDook]

Teachers are assessed for weaknesses by their own SLT and the ability of SLT to assess is one of the significant areas which is the QA during an inspection.

 

The QA takes the form that SLT will submit what *they* think is the relevant levels of the various teachers and OFSTED will check and verify. It is sampling ... and that is why after a morning of inspections on day 1 the inspection team might suddenly change their focus.

 

The argument for no-notice inspections will say that this is to give it the truest picture of what the school looks like and how it runs, including how SLT assess teaching & learning.

 

The argument against no-notice inspections will point out that this assessment by SLT is frequently part of a routine program of performance management and assessment of the capabilities of staff, which are usually done with significant notice which allows for time to mark, plan, etc to the best of the ability of the teacher ... so no-noitce is not a true reflection.

 

And the counter point to that is often that SLT should perhaps do no-notice checks as well then otherwise they are not getting a true reflection ...

 

And the counter point in return is that there are lots of other ad-hoc things SLT to (such as dropping into lessons as the wander the school, book scrutiny, meeting with the children, etc) which covers this side of things ...

 

It is like every policy decision out there ... arguments for and against and if you look hard enough you can *always* fine arguments both for and against!

[GrumbleDook]

Most assessments of IT systems in school (a number where done by Becta and other groups as part of surveying schools) highlighted the lack of planning in schools, lack of communications between tech and teaching sides of schools, issues with capacity management, etc ... there were lots of good points too ... but things like this were then fed into SLICT and FITS.

 

If a school would like an IT Audit there are still folk out there who do them on a commercial basis ... and some LAs still do this as well.

[localzuk]

Personally I have a problem with the whole attitude of OFSTED. School improvement should be a collaborative process, currently it is adversarial. Recently a teacher was graded as 'good' so at his feedback sessions he asked the inspector what he needed to do to become 'outstanding', the inspector told him that it is not OFSTED's to give advice about how to improve but simply to make judgements. This is a disgrace and goes against what the inspectors are looking for when teachers are helping their pupils; imagine an inspector seeing a teacher telling a pupil that his work is incorrect but won't tell him how to get it right.

 

Then a complaint should have been put in - it is very much OFSTED's place to say what they did wrong and therefore what needed fixing.

 

Ofsted in my opinion are just a bunch of people who couldn't make it in teaching. With my governors hat on, we had an inspection, the sole inspector wasn't interested in teaching, just how to make the results fit his preconceived grade. The teachers had independent inspections from LA, our head etc, teaching was deemed all good some with outstanding features but the inspector just looked at the data and said teaching was satisfactory. What a way to demoralise your workforce.

 

If the results being gained don't match the predictions made by your own staff then teaching *cannot* be good. If it was, then why did they not hit the targets? The predicted grades are set by the school itself, based on the child as an individual and national progress levels. You might get a couple who miss their targets due to whatever reasons (illness etc...) but if overall they aren't being hit, that is indicative that something is going wrong with the teaching.

[znova]

Then a complaint should have been put in - it is very much OFSTED's place to say what they did wrong and therefore what needed fixing.

 

 

 

If the results being gained don't match the predictions made by your own staff then teaching *cannot* be good. If it was, then why did they not hit the targets? The predicted grades are set by the school itself, based on the child as an individual and national progress levels. You might get a couple who miss their targets due to whatever reasons (illness etc...) but if overall they aren't being hit, that is indicative that something is going wrong with the teaching.

 

The problem is if you have a small school than 1 or 2 children not achieving really mess up the results. We were inspected by an ex-Ofsted inspector (now LA) on numerous occasions (even Unannounced) who admitted that teaching was good despite coming to prove otherwise. The results are improving but apparently not enough for Ofsted. Both him and Ofsted inspector came to point out the obvious but despite us asking repeatedly didn't offer any advise on how to improve on paper to match what is happening iN the classroom.

 

What annoys me most, that when the inspector was leaving he said -of record- that if we were inspected in December we would have got a good grade. Thanks!

Edited May 8, 2012 by znova

[sparkeh]

What annoys me most, that when the inspector was leaving he said -of record- that if we were inspected in December we would have got a good grade. Thanks!

Funny that, we were told a very similar thing (off record)....

[znova]

On another note, at work we had an inspection, got a very good grade but then we are an academy, the government can't be seen to give anything but good grading to their flagship schools. Of course we were issuing laptops left right and centre for "small group work" = tidying away problem kids. It's all political.

[tommej]

We were all strongy encouraged to petition against the no notice inspections (anonymously I must add). What a joke.

[PiqueABoo]

With my governors hat on, we had an inspection, the sole inspector wasn't interested in teaching, just how to make the results fit his preconceived grade. The teachers had independent inspections from LA, our head etc, teaching was deemed all good some with outstanding features but the inspector just looked at the data and said teaching was satisfactory. What a way to demoralise your workforce.

 

Two sides to that one: TOH was called "the best I've seen.." when training (independent assessment from another PGCE institution) and OFSTED always think she's Outstanding and she doesn't do anything she doesn't always do for that i.e. works hard. But the internal assessments usually have her as middling based on feeble, typically wrong, nit-picking... I'd like to believe that's some cunning SMT plan to keep the teachers striving to improve as opposed to resting on their laurels, but it's actually about local incompetence. I've had to do quite a lot of the 'only respect respectible opinions about you, discard the rest..' stuff coz it always puts her in serious career changing mode.

[soveryapt]

This is all quite an interesting read. Having only been in the education sector for 4-5 years, I get to experience my first OFSTED inspection tomorrow and Wednesday. Just had a text from the ICT Coord to let me know they found out about it this afternoon.

 

I've always been of an understanding (as with some other through previous experience on other sectors) that inspections should be done without notice to a degree, but also in conjunction with regular assessments from "line managers" (for want of a better phrase).

 

That said that I think the level of notice this school has been given (the afternoon before the visit) is more than adequate as that way the staff don't have any option but to get on as they were. It's then for SLT in the mean time to keep reviewing their staff and make sure they function as best they can ensuring the pupils get at least the level of education expected by the government. I've been dreading the day really when we were going to get "the call" having not been through it before, but this way, even if there are things I've missed, then I'll have to be pulled up on them, and the same with the staff. That said, I have been asked to be in early in case staff forget how to use computers overnight .. lol ..

[SimpleSi]

is more than adequate as that way the staff don't have any option but to get on as they were.

I would expect a signficant fraction of the teaching staff to be working till midnight and then back in at 6am.

 

Si

[soveryapt]

I would expect a signficant fraction of the teaching staff to be working till midnight and then back in at 6am.

 

Si

 

Probably, but that's their planning I guess .. mind you, I've already been on the servers (not in that school today) to double check on things and spotted a few printer issues (waste toner boxes full, empty toners, etc - nothing that can't be sorted when I get in - so fingers crossed, everything should run relatively smoothly from my POV ..

[featured_spectre]

Really? If you harbour such feelings to toward your school that you enjoy watching it being put through, and its reaction to, an OFSTED inspection then I suggest you aren't the best person to be working there.

 

Yes really...every school should be inspected without notice to see how things really run. I no longer work in a school but I work in an environment where if something goes wrong, heads will roll. Feedback is essential in my job or nobody learns. When working in a school on a contract basis they had a surprise visit, and come out with flying colours, and it should be like that for everyone. In business you don't get a notice, it just happens, schools should be the same. We may agree to disagree on this, but if the school is really amazing and all singing and dancing, or is really awful or somewhere in between a no notice inspection will highlight any failings, and will also highlight where the school excels.

[TechMonkey]

I think the OFSTED inspection is totally OTT and not realistic so should be reworked, but I think 0-day inspections should happen once this is done. You can not expect perfection every lesson, every day, but day to day things you should expect. Last inspection here the school was the calmest ever, no kids let out to roam, SMT available, staff had been in late every night and in early every morning & wasn't indicative of the school. It isn't sustainable and isn't realistic.

 

From the other point of view OFSTED have gone loopy. A local school got inspected and were pulled up on a kid not holding open a door for an inspector, showing they hadn't been taught manners, and for a lunch time supervisor not explaining to a child why they had to pick up the rubbish and put it in the bin. When the student was asked why they thought they had to do it they shrugged and said "I dunno". Welcome to kids OFSTED!

[witch]

Definitely gone loopy:

Recent OFSTED...inspectors were concerned that the children were not questioning the teachers enough - sitting quietly and in a well-behaved fashion listening to the teacher's input before getting on with it...and....

One inspector wanted to mark the behaviour down from good to satisfactory as she heard some children shouting in the corridor...once...

Food teacher told she talked too much..she was DEMONSTRATING some cookery skill at the time so the children could actually do it. There seems an increasing emphasis on the children doing it themselves with minimal input from the teacher - I can see what they are getting at but there are actually some things that HAVE to be taught.

Inspectors not allowed to tell the head which teacher was deemed what- bit daft as a lot of the input from OFSTED was about finding out whether the head and SLT's assessment of the teachers was accurate.

[craig2562]

In a previous life I used to be a Quality, Hygiene and Health & Safety Officer in a large manufacturing company. Although it was customary for us to be given notice of an impending inspection there was also a higher standard that you could sign up to which would require unannounced inspections for which, if you passed you received a higher award e.g. Gold Award which was then displayed for all to see. This was done in an effort to reward those companies that have put in the resources and procedures, rather than those that just get employees to fill out six month of forms etc with different coloured pens and have a week of manic cleaning up etc.

Not sure if that would work in this instance but it was a good idea.