RemoteFX backend for thin clients?

[SYNACK]

I'm interested in its eventual application to MPS as this would give almost full 3D support to the MPS client screens and make them even quicker than they are now. Being built on high grade desktop boards also means that they should have no issues with any kind of GPU.

 

Currently we have some four screen units with 22" screens on them. The next one I build will have touch screens.

 

How long it takes Microsoft to integrate this in is another question but I am hopeing soon.

[gshaw]

RemoteFX also works with standard Remote Desktop Services, and not just VDI. So, reasonably, it shouldn't add much if any load to an existing deployment, when used in conjunction with RDS.

 

Yup fair point if going down the terminal services route, if you want a one-OS-per-user type environment that's when it starts getting complicated...

 

Maybe we need a pro \ con thread for the different solutions as there's many ways of skinning the cat now...

 

1) classic Remote Desktop with RemoteFX graphics acceleration

2) full VDI i.e. one Windows OS per user

3) share a powerful workstation between users via Multipoint

 

My first thoughts on each...

 

1) best user density but with the worry of one session crashing others and a more restrictive user experience (?)

2) best experience but resource heavy and therefore expensive

3) almost best of both worlds but if one machine goes down in a classroom it takes multiple users out until someone swaps it for a spare unit

Edited February 22, 2011 by gshaw

[jamesfed]

This maybe of intrest-

http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/servers/docs/4AA3-2927ENW.pdf

 

HPs new Reference Architecture for RemoteFX.

[localzuk]

Very useful document! It covers everything, and also points out that most of the RemoteFX advantages only appear when using full VDI.

[localzuk]

Now, using the standalone server model in that document as the basis for around 80 VDI users as they say, the cost would be about £20,000 just in hardware for:

 

1 x HP DL370 G6 High Performance (ie. 2 x 2.66 Ghz 6 core xeons)

12 x 8GB RAM modules

2 x Nvidia FX5800G 4GB graphics cards

24 x 300GB 10K SAS HDD's

 

The largest price is nearly £6.5k for the graphics cards!

 

So, that's about £250 per client, plus licensing. If you want to go the whole hog, and get new thin clients too, they come in at £440 each (for the HP t5740e). Slap in a monitor too, and you end up with £500 each. However, you may be able to utilise old equipment via the 'Windows Thin PC' (ie. the replacement for WinFLP, based on Windows 7 and therefore supports RDP 7.1), therefore making the end price £250 per machine, which is *very* good.

 

So, that's £750 each. Not a bad price, but still nowhere near as powerful as a fat client costing £750 each.

 

My guess would be - wait a while until the price of the graphics cards and 300GB SAS drives come down.

 

Any more than that number of clients, and you should start looking at scaling to the main solution discussed in that document, using blade servers.

Edited March 3, 2011 by localzuk

[jamesfed]

Its the document that I've been waiting for - Im trying to push some trusted and well funded suppliers to get ahold of some kind of kit (mainly the graphics card) for some on site POC.

[localzuk]

Having a fresh look this morning, the graphics cards (official HP ones, part number FZ559AA) can be found for anywhere between £2300 - £2900 new or about £1700 refurbished.

[plexer]

Those are some graphics cards.

 

Ben

[jamesfed]

Just confirmed! A HP RemoteFX compatible server (for testing) is on its way and should be arriving in a week or so

Already have the Thin Clients from 10zig (thanks to James!) sitting on the desk which I've had a play around with using my old Desktop PC as a Remote FX server but this HP should be able to do everything that I need.

Assuming all the parties agree I might see if I can do a youtube or two.

[Axel]

There are some interesting RemoteFX hardware based solutions coming down the line, for example

 

ThinLinX: Welcome

 

These "should" hit the price mark that "generic" Windows 7 based thin clients can't currently. By incorporating RemoteFX in hardware on a Linux based solution, they provide (in theory at least) a very fast RemoteFX rendering engine on a low cost/low power linux plaform....

[localzuk]

There are some interesting RemoteFX hardware based solutions coming down the line, for example

 

ThinLinX: Welcome

 

These "should" hit the price mark that "generic" Windows 7 based thin clients can't currently. By incorporating RemoteFX in hardware on a Linux based solution, they provide (in theory at least) a very fast RemoteFX rendering engine on a low cost/low power linux plaform....

 

The problem is, most places have existing clients which were bought with life expectancies of 10 years, so will want to reuse these with the new technologies. New devices are all well and good, but we wouldn't be able to justify purchasing them.

[Axel]

I fully agree - and it remains to be seen how cost effective RemoteFX is, I understand you need W7 clientside to run it (?) - so that pretty much eliminates ALL existing TC out there regardless of what they are based on.

 

...and Windows 7 is not an ideal thin client operating system for thin clients, or put another, the difference between a Win7 PC and Win7 TC is so little (in cost and hardware) - most people will be better off sticking with PCs, and the flexibility they offer, for applications that need that much power on the client.

 

Anyone got any pricing for Win7 thin clients...?

[jamesfed]

I think one of the HPs that weve got in with WES7 on only comes in at £215 (with schools discount) and although WES7 might not be as simple as Linux at that price I think its quite reasonable. All the same if Microsoft can hit the £100 price point they have said they can I'm more than happy

Either way we won't be looking at deployment until the Summer so could be in for some intresting turns before then

[Axel]

If you can get 'em at that price you should snap them up, even with education discount that is an amazing price...!!!

[jamesfed]

If you can get 'em at that price you should snap them up, even with education discount that is an amazing price...!!!

 

Would love to but still in POC stage and with the £16.23p that we have in the IT budget.......

[jamesfed]

This time its Microsoft who are kicking out the guideance-

 

Download details: Microsoft RemoteFX for Remote Desktop Virtualization Host Capacity Planning Guide for Windows Server 2008 R2 Service Pack 1

[plexer]

Remotefx doesn't mean only win7 there are some custom asic solutions.

 

Ben

[jamesfed]

Finaly got round to making this - YouTube - RemoteFX Demo