Educational Recources and ELC's

[CyberNerd]

I've just discovered that we've just paid nearly two and a half grand in ELC's for some powerpoint presentations :!: :!:

 

I know the ELC thing was setup with good intent. It seems to me like the system is being rinsed by ex-teachers who don't have a clue about programming, is creating unnecessary lock-in and creating an atmosphere of 'won't share' in the educational community. /rant

 

This does seem such a scam, why is it that teachers can't actually produce these resources for themselves and put them on their websites for their students and other schools to benefit?

Does anyone here (other than us, who share advice/resources regularly) know teachers who actually produce and share resources, can someone point me to some sites that do this.

 

thanks

[webman]

Would laziness and greediness come into it at some point?

[CyberNerd]

I suspect so, but surely there must be some teachers in the country with a philosophy of sharing their knowledge - where are you !

[pete]

Bearing in mind the time it would take some of my users to produce somethin g like they can buy, it may be cheaper in terms of wasted man-hours

 

Having said that, the most my lot have spent on "prepared work" is <£50, I too would be in an arse-kicking mood if someone thought it was ok to spend £2K on powerpoint slides, you can get a Macromedia Studio 8 site license for that kind of money (also through elc).

 

elcs are ring-fenced beyond belief (though it has got better this year).

[CyberNerd]

elcs are ring-fenced beyond belief (though it has got better this year).

 

If only that was true, try calling an ELC supplier such as Ramesys and tell them your willing to buy lots of *anything* with ELC's, as long as they throw in some other, non-elc software - Its a scam I tell you, the money would be better spent encouraging teachers to produce and share their work.

 

Bearing in mind the time it would take some of my users to produce somethin g like they can buy, it may be cheaper in terms of wasted man-hours

 

Surely the teachers are required to produce lesson plans and resources as part of their jobs - its not a great leap forward to publish it as web-content. Go to most Uni websites and you'll find all manner of literature and course material, I don't see why schools have such a different culture.

IMO teachers (here) seem to be using ICT for the sake of it rather than to produce any beneficial resources.

[pete]

If only that was true, try calling an ELC supplier such as Ramesys and tell them your willing to buy lots of *anything* with ELC's, as long as they throw in some other, non-elc software

 

I don't handle ELC purchases myself, but "ring-fenced" is the line I'm getting from head of ict. If he's being too weak when bargaining I may have to take over. hmmm,

 

IMO teachers (here) seem to be using ICT for the sake of it rather than to produce any beneficial resources.

 

I'll swap ten of your teachers for ten of mine...... deal? Too many of mine are still in the "it's too complicated to use" / laptop = "powerpoint machine" (actual term used) stage.

[webman]

Surely the teachers are required to produce lesson plans and resources as part of their jobs

 

They jsut download them off the net...

[deerwood]

As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?

 

It is my firm belief that if any teacher uses their own time, skills, ideas and resources to produce educational resources, then they have a right to sell them if they so wish and, equally, a right to give them away free if they so wish. What is often less acceptable is that a school or local authority has a claim to such resources.

[CyberNerd]

As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?

 

Indeed, I have issues with the quality and price of some of this 'software'

 

It is my firm belief that if any teacher uses their own time, skills, ideas and resources to produce educational resources, then they have a right to sell them if they so wish and, equally, a right to give them away free if they so wish. What is often less acceptable is that a school or local authority has a claim to such resources.

 

I don't see a problem with teachers using their own time to do whatever they please.

I do see a problem if resources are produced during the course of someones employment that are to be used in an institution and are produced using by staff using equipment owned by the institution - in this case the institution should have claim to such resourses.

 

and is there anything to stop a technician writing an application (in their own time, of course) licensing it under restrictive conditions then imbedding it into the school? - after time she could then ransom the school to their terms. My belief is that reourses produced for schools (by staff) should be freely and publicaly available.

Sadly there seems to be a culture that prohibits this.

 

since none of the staff have copyrighted their own materials produced at this school, whats to stop someone else from publishing them?

[/RMS]

[RoyG]

As I understand it, any materials to be purchased with elcs and any manufacturer has to be vetted and approved. So presumably someone has vetted and approved these ppoint files and the makers/suppliers?

 

God knows how the vetting procedure is done, because loads of ELC approved software is pure cack! Conversely loads of good useful stuff is not approved. It seems to me that the approved list is pretty arbitrary.

 

An example of the madness - a year or two ago I was asked to buy graphics software. Adobe Photoshop, £106/licence, approved - Corel Graphics Suite, £16/licence, not approved. We bought Corel - cough!!

 

RoyG

[TechMonkey]

Don't get me started, I will choke on the rage and then have a coronary!! ELC's are one of those things that are great on paper but no one thinks about it. Our network is full of software now thanks to them, but most of it is hardly used. Staff hear of free money and order everything under the sun! The best scam I have seen is make paper resources into PDF's and then charge £200 for them as they are electronic now. But then supply the paper based resource as well which is what the staff actually want!!!!

 

We now try and get whole school resources, either online stuff like Guardian Unlimited, or software that will be cross curricular, to try and use them all up as quickly as possible!

[sahmeepee]

I've just discovered that we've just paid nearly two and a half grand in ELC's for some powerpoint presentations :!: :!:

 

Uhm, err.. we've spent a lot more than that on Powerpoints with the magical eLC beans. :oops:

 

Not proud of it, but as the budget holder eLCs put me in a difficult position: I have a professional responsibility to get as much as I can for the school with the funding available (value doesn't come into it as we've tried hard and never managed to spend the lot), yet on the other hand I have a moral responsibility not to waste taxpayers money on software which looks like it was made by a 7 year old in a couple of hours. The Gov't are tackling this problem now by turning off the eLC tap.

 

I know the ELC thing was setup with good intent.

 

You're know that for sure?! It was originally set up as a sweetener for publishers of educational content that were mewing about the BBC giving equally good educational materials away for free. See editor's note 5. Never mind the fact that some people had and are giving away free stuff without public / tv license funding. You will notice the bizarre timing: they eLCs are tailing off just as the BBC materials they were bothered about start to come online.

 

This does seem such a scam, why is it that teachers can't actually produce these resources for themselves and put them on their websites for their students and other schools to benefit?

Does anyone here (other than us, who share advice/resources regularly) know teachers who actually produce and share resources, can someone point me to some sites that do this.

 

Some of them do, and if the government was interested in saving taxpayers money, they would promote:

 

:arrow: :arrow: The Teacher Resource Exchange

 

in every staffroom in the country. Do a strawpoll in yours - I bet less than 1 in 20 staff have heard of it.

 

](*,)

[sahmeepee]

I forgot to mention my hatred of "software" which is really a couple of word docs, pdfs or powerpoints that some numpty's chucked together in 5 minutes that require an ANNUAL LICENCE FEE.

 

?!!?

 

You want me to "subscribe" to a directory of static files?! Ack.

[witch]

Down here in Dorset, the teachers are supposed to put stuff up onto the SWGfL website to share. I know that one of my schools uses it, but I don't think they actually put things for other people to see.

Having said that - I set up passwords and everything for people ages ago, and got some training on how to use the site from Linda, Web Manager/VLE co-ordinator for Dorset LA, (lindylou on this site) but to my knowledge only a couple of TAs actually use it!!

It is a good site but without the direction from the SMT, the teachers won't get to grips with it.

I will pass on details of The Teacher Resource Exchange to them!

[speckytecky]

From another excellent Forum http://www.ukgovernors.net.uk I recently picked up information about the new BBC initiative http://www.bbc.co.uk/jam I have seen Yr 1 and Yr 3 students using it so far and they love it and it seems - so far, hassle free!

[NetworkGeezer]

You want me to "subscribe" to a directory of static files?! Ack.

 

Oh I dunno. Better that than having to repackage a pre millennium Windows 98 run as admin hey have I got DLLs for you sir horror.

[russdev]

Down here in Dorset, the teachers are supposed to put stuff up onto the SWGfL website to share. I know that one of my schools uses it, but I don't think they actually put things for other people to see.

Having said that - I set up passwords and everything for people ages ago, and got some training on how to use the site from Linda, Web Manager/VLE co-ordinator for Dorset LA, (lindylou on this site) but to my knowledge only a couple of TAs actually use it!!

It is a good site but without the direction from the SMT, the teachers won't get to grips with it.

I will pass on details of The Teacher Resource Exchange to them!

 

Your not alone most leas have these 'portals' but as it stands succesful ones are ones eho get lea consultants to collect samples from schools and upload them. As problem is teachers feel they dont have time to upload and sort stuff like this. But lea consultant sending email out to schools send me samples of work that can put on site has better chance as all they have to do is email stuff in and then consultant uploads it.

 

Russ

[GrumbleDook]

Some Regions have produce some fantastic resources and given them away for free. North West Grid for Learning and their DiDA Delivered materials are a fantastic example of this.

 

Collaboration is not in the nature of manglement in schools ... unless it is on their terms. It is usually individual members of staff that want to share stuff. It takes a large change in the culture of the school to embed the ethos of sharing best practice (or using the practice of others to improve your own).

[CyberNerd]

I Just spoke with one of the teachers who ordered these outrageously priced presentations - she's had to go through them all to correct spelling mistakes, apparently there are quite a few --ggrrr

 

Anyway thanks for all the links, I'll make sure the teachers are force-fed them

[bossman]

Question? "why do teachers think that a VLE is a cause for them to clap their hands with glee in the knowledge any material that needs preparing digitally will be done by a technician who does not understand the first thing about teaching", surely they must sort the content matter and the technician upload to the resource environment. It really boils my blood when they come and ask "i have some digital photos on this cd can you print them off for me" and when i say sorry but i am extremely busy but there is no problem with printing the photos out yourself as there are plenty of workstations and printers around the school, they take the hump and then tell me that the only reason they asked me was because they don't have the time, WHAT!!!! the lazy so and so's and this is only a small example of the tasks they think we as IT people should do. Well I never ask them to do any of my workload so why should they expect me to do some of theirs i too am very busy running a whole school network with Sims and everything else plus planning, buying, costing,etc etc on my own thanks to the governors and SMT for that one (cost cutting) long story longer than this rant but makes me feel better.

 

who else in a proper job would experience total f..k wits and then be told that they are always in the wrong by a spineless HT and PC correct line manager who is the Stratigic Leader for ICT and expect them not to feel undervalued and unsupported.

 

my apologies to the good teachers around on this matter

[CyberNerd]

IMO it is because money is being put into paying for software and recources without actually training anyone how to use it.

It's simply because most Senior Management Teams only think of quick fixes and don't want to think of long-term solutions. In their world ICT is about shiny new computers and flashy lights - nothing more. They certainly won't admit that there is a training deficiency in the school, which after all is a training site.

The whole school ICT spending really needs to be turned on its head to stop this wastage - probably only BSF with Becta's guidance can do this, it's just unfortunate that it will mean we all get outsourced.