Live Video Delay

[quaium]

Just had a request from our PE department who want to capture live video footage of kids doing sport and then play it back for analysis. I'm trying to figure out the easiest and cheapest options and was wondering if anyone on here had any ideas.

 

The concept is simple. We have a child doing star jumps for 30 seconds. This footage is reordered on a camcorder and then played back automatically after the 30 seconds have finished. We already have access to a camcorder, laptop and projector and now I just need a simple (hopefully with NO teacher interaction at all) concept that will make this work.

 

Anyone know of any free software that is available out there that does this sort of thing? I have seen sports motion software out there but they are far too expensive. Any help or even suggestions in other ways this can be achieved would be gratefully accepted!

[quaium]

What's wrong with Stop/Rewind/Play?

 

I did suggest it but sadly it's too fiddly... I can also see it becoming a hassle when there is footage of 30 kids!

[SYNACK]

Why involve the camcorder, sounds like you could do the same job with a much cheaper webcam as you already have the laptop there as a storage medium. There is plenty of software around that will capture video off a web cam so one of those utilities may include a feature like this or it may be scriptable.

[plexer]

Our pe department uses motion coach for this and it's not free unfortunately.

 

Ben

[plexer]

How about:

 

Kinovea - Video Analysis Software for Sports

 

Ben

[AJT1]

We started doing the same thing recently. PE department came to me and said we have £500 to spend on video equipment to be able to record children and wanted to be able to play it back instantly. I ended up buying them a video camera with a 30GB hard disk in capable of video out, a 19" screen with video input and also a digital camera with a video out (which they don't really use).

 

They also don't use the screen now as they have just got a 50" LCD so can watch it back on that as soon as they want.

 

The camera is brill it also allows them to plug it into the computer and with the supplied software they can create dvd's (with menus aswell!) by just pressing a few buttons - brill!

 

 

It's all good easy to use kit making my life easier as I dont have to keep going down to help them use it, in fact I think I've only been down once!

[localzuk]

We use Dartfish for the same thing here. Not cheap but the PE dept like it. One thing to note though, you are more than likely going to end up needing to buy a replacement camera as they will undoubtedly going to knock it over and break it at some point... Like ours did.

[quaium]

How about:

 

Kinovea - Video Analysis Software for Sports

 

Ben

 

I don't think you can capture live video with this software, it's just video that you have already saved... or am I missing something?

[plexer]

If you're using a webcam just use whatever software that has for recording, if it's a firewore connected camera then you can use movie maker.

 

Then review and analyse the footage.

 

Geez some people want everything for nothing.

 

Ben

[Domino]

a VJ mixing desk could do this using a sample & loop function...

 

but it'd have a whole bucketload of features you wouldn't use and would be pricy (although it may still be cheaper than some of the specialist sports software i've seen - dartfish i'm looking at you)

[AJT1]

One thing to note though, you are more than likely going to end up needing to buy a replacement camera as they will undoubtedly going to knock it over and break it at some point... Like ours did.

 

Already lost the charger for the digital camera, £55 for another one!

[quaium]

If you're using a webcam just use whatever software that has for recording, if it's a firewore connected camera then you can use movie maker.

 

Then review and analyse the footage.

 

Geez some people want everything for nothing.

 

Ben

 

Does Movie Maker allow you to delay recorded live video footage?

[limbo]

You could probably use Windows Media Encoder for this - free download of the Microsoft Website.

 

You can capture video from a live source and have it record to a local video file.

 

As long as you save the video in a streaming media format like a .wmv you can start playing it in box standard media player while still recording it - with all the media player options of pausing, rewinding fast forwarding (although obvisouly only to the point where the recording has got to!!)

 

If you want high quality video then you might need a slightly beefier PC.

 

We use this technique for open evenings when we have too many people to fit in one hall - we record the presentation to the HDD of the PC, then another PC connects to it across the network and plays the video. We usually have a 10 - 15 minute delay and it is usually a 30 minute presentation. But you just start playing the video when you are ready.

[plexer]

What do you mean by delay the footage?

 

Once you have recorded it to the harddrive you could use any manner of video playing programs to step through it frame by frame or something more complicated to actually process the video such as the software that has been mentioned.

 

Ben

[quaium]

What do you mean by delay the footage?

 

Once you have recorded it to the harddrive you could use any manner of video playing programs to step through it frame by frame or something more complicated to actually process the video such as the software that has been mentioned.

 

Ben

 

Delay, as in to view the footage on a projecter screen after it has been recorded without the need to press a button or rewind the tape.

[Polski]

Parental consent?

 

Ensure the SMT do need leave you carrying the can when word gets back to the parents.

 

Sounds dumb, but sadly it’s the world in which we live folks.

[plexer]

Polski: What are you talking about?

 

Quaium: I can't see how what you want to do is acheivable?

 

Ben

[quaium]

Polski: What are you talking about?

 

Quaium: I can't see how what you want to do is acheivable?

 

Ben

 

It is acheivable but with expensive software. I've seen the software Kandel (I think that's what it's called or it could be the company name) in action and it works very well but like I said it's way to expensive!

[Polski]

The "Parental consent" bit refers to the fact the school may not have a policy in force to allow the children to be videoed.

 

Not 'small minded', just an observation.

[plexer]

quaium: well from what you have said I think you may just have to conceed that you cannot acheive what you want to do and that reviewing the footage after it has been saved is an option.

 

Other than that would it be possible encode the video on the fly as web stream and then open a viewer a few seconds later?

 

Ben

[quaium]

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice guys but I think I've found the solution with Windows Media Encoder (big thanks to limbo).

 

We're just going to setup the camcorder, get the kids to do their stuff, while their doing that we'll encode the footage to a file with Windows Media Encoder and then instantly play it back in Windows Media Player. No need to touch the camcorder or fiddle about with it, no need for stopping, rewinding and playing the tape and best of all only a few simple button presses required from the teacher.

[plexer]

I still don't see the point in needing such instantaneous playback rather than pe teacher going through footage with student and analysing what they need to change.

 

Ben

[quaium]

I still don't see the point in needing such instantaneous playback rather than pe teacher going through footage with student and analysing what they need to change.

 

Ben

 

Becuase it's not in a classrooom... it's a sports hall packed with 30 excited kids. The PE teacher needs to have his full attention on the kids and as little interaction with PC/video equipment as possible. For them to film the kids on a camcorder and then view it back is going to be time consuming and "fiddly". We just wanted a simple method, which could be instantly played back on a projector to the entire class.

[limbo]

I still don't see the point in needing such instantaneous playback rather than pe teacher going through footage with student and analysing what they need to change.

 

There is not much point in playing it back later - you want them to see it there and then so they can improve instantly.

 

Think about a situation like vaulting - a queue of 30 kids having a go one after the other, and having many goes within the hour.

 

They have a go at the vault - walk over to the TV and watch what they have just done with the teacher there to comment. They then go to the back of the queue and implement the changes on their next go - in the meantime another student has had a go and is now stood at the TV ready to watch.

 

It is hard to get the timing right - but if you do then it can have instant results on student improvement. You do no need to fast forward or rewind - you just leave it running because if there is a 20 second delay, and it takes students 20 seconds to walk from a finished vault to the TV screen then it always works. But being able to pause it if the student does not get to the TV in time is handy.

 

I used to be a sports coach at a relatively high club standard - and with technical sports like Gymnastics, Trampolining etc. this can have a huge impact because a student knows how something should look - but has no idea what they look like. If they know there legs should be straight, and think they are - seeing on playback that there legs were not straight means they realise it and can take steps to fix it - and when it is right then they know it too.

[quaium]

Limbo - Could you to tell me how I go about doing the 20 second delay thing on a standalone laptop not connected to any network? I am able to encode the live broadcast but can't seem to find a way of watching it via the http address provided at setup or any other way. Could you help me out?